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View Poll Results: Pride Nogueira vs UFC Mir
Nogueira Submission 9 29.03%
Nogueira KO/TKO 13 41.94%
Nogueira Points 2 6.45%
Mir Submission 4 12.90%
Mir KO/TKO 1 3.23%
Mir Points 2 6.45%
Voters: 31. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 12-24-2011, 09:22 AM   #31
patch1983
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Default Re: Big Nog (circa 2003/4) vs Frank Mir (circa 2011)

So you think being old, out of shape and years past his prime makes no difference on the ground?
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Old 12-24-2011, 09:23 AM   #32
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Default Re: Big Nog (circa 2003/4) vs Frank Mir (circa 2011)

Less of a difference than it does standing. Especially as it's just bjj with those two, it's 90% technique.
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Old 12-24-2011, 09:48 AM   #33
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Default Re: Big Nog (circa 2003/4) vs Frank Mir (circa 2011)

NOt to mention Mir was almost out cold....
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Old 12-24-2011, 10:21 AM   #34
patch1983
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Default Re: Big Nog (circa 2003/4) vs Frank Mir (circa 2011)

Do you think Nog's BJJ is as good as it used to be? Its clear he is not close to the fighter he used to be. Not even close.
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Old 12-24-2011, 10:34 AM   #35
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Default Re: Big Nog (circa 2003/4) vs Frank Mir (circa 2011)

ref stops it during the 1st kimura attempt...called the popkins rule
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Old 12-24-2011, 10:44 AM   #36
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Default Re: Big Nog (circa 2003/4) vs Frank Mir (circa 2011)

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Originally Posted by patch1983 View Post
Do you think Nog's BJJ is as good as it used to be? Its clear he is not close to the fighter he used to be. Not even close.
Standing he absolutely isn't. On the ground I haven't seen an awful lot of evidence that he's slipped.
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Old 12-24-2011, 11:10 AM   #37
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Default Re: Big Nog (circa 2003/4) vs Frank Mir (circa 2011)

What do you mean no evidence he has slipped on the ground? I might be wrong but i think the last time he submitted anyone was nearly 4 years ago.
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Old 12-24-2011, 11:15 AM   #38
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Default Re: Big Nog (circa 2003/4) vs Frank Mir (circa 2011)

He's either got knocked out standing or fought people like Couture who are submission savvy since then or not bothered hitting the ground, ie with Schaub.
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Old 12-24-2011, 12:24 PM   #39
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Default Re: Big Nog (circa 2003/4) vs Frank Mir (circa 2011)

I was listening to an old Bas Rutten interview where he was talking aboat when he rolls with people on the ground he notices that while it goes well he misses things he would have got and his speed and reaction are slower and thought of this thread.

If you think someone BJJ is not affected by getting older/slower etc then you are clueless.
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Old 12-24-2011, 12:30 PM   #40
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Default Re: Big Nog (circa 2003/4) vs Frank Mir (circa 2011)

Rutten has probably been more effected by retiring. What part of that would have gone differently if he was a few years younger? Nog's own arrogance ****ed him over, he tried to sub Mir, got bullied over (Mir is more powerful than a prime Nog) and one of the best BJJ guys in MMA slapped a kimura on him. I don't see how age effects that particular scenario.
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Old 12-24-2011, 03:59 PM   #41
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Default Re: Big Nog (circa 2003/4) vs Frank Mir (circa 2011)

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Originally Posted by LHL View Post
Nog by KO for me, that fight would of been finished if the ref didn't warn Nog for punching Mir in what ever place he left available
Oh wow, if only Nog was allowed to punch Mir in the back of the head ten or twelve times instead of only three or four times, he would have won the fight. I guess Nog was robbed when the ref warned him to stop hitting the back of the head.

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Old 12-24-2011, 05:11 PM   #42
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Default Re: Big Nog (circa 2003/4) vs Frank Mir (circa 2011)

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Originally Posted by Haggis McJackass View Post
Oh wow, if only Nog was allowed to punch Mir in the back of the head ten or twelve times instead of only three or four times, he would have won the fight. I guess Nog was robbed when the ref warned him to stop hitting the back of the head.

Well Mir not intelligently defending himself is what I was getting at, he knew what he was doing very hard to punch someone in the face who is only offering the back of his head. Even after he stopped Mir kept his face to the ground. Like in boxing when a fighter purposely turns his head and a fighter is throwing a punch who's fault is that.

But yeah you can read it in the way that makes me look stupidest

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Old 12-24-2011, 05:42 PM   #43
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Default Re: Big Nog (circa 2003/4) vs Frank Mir (circa 2011)

Nogueira would stop him, ****, he almost stopped him recently & he is lucky if he is half the fighter now he was then... I think Mir`s BJJ is good enough to avoid the submittion but he`d get outboxed & beat down to a 1st or 2nd round TKO loss.
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Old 12-24-2011, 05:46 PM   #44
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Default Re: Big Nog (circa 2003/4) vs Frank Mir (circa 2011)

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Originally Posted by Anarchy99 View Post
There is a video floating around of Rickson Gracie schooling Roger Gracie in 2009.. Made him look like a Bluebelt.
I don`t think such a video exists but even if it does, it doesn`t matter because Rickson is probably the best BJJ practitioner that ever lived, his talent is from another planet altogether.
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Old 12-24-2011, 06:05 PM   #45
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Default Re: Big Nog (circa 2003/4) vs Frank Mir (circa 2011)

I'm going to say Mir because that bloke was the first to ko and sub Nog. I know Nog wasn't at his best but I think in the rematch he showed he may not have been 100% in the first fight and it was going his way but Frank has more than one way to win. He has ko power and lethal submissions now. I wish he had an aggressive wrestling base to dictate where the fight goes and take the offensive from the first bell. That along with his brain freeze has to be his biggest issue.
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