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Old 12-31-2011, 08:09 AM   #1
scurlaruntings
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Default Is Overeems striking overrated?

Lets look at the body of evidence. First off Overeems background contrary to popular opinion is not as a striker. He started his career in mixed martial arts /judo and was trained by Bas Rutten.
Does the his GP win flatter him? I think so. Whilst the GP have never always produced the best fighters they have produced the toughest. And Overeems path to the top was relatively easy. First off he faced Spong. When both men were much lighter Overeem and he was sparring partners and Overeem was routinely schooled by Spong in their infamous GG wars.
Likewise a one armed Ghita who was outweighed significantly gave Overeem hell for as long as it lasted with far better crisper striking. Same again is true with Aerts who went through hell with Semmi in the Semi finals. Overeem basically waltzed through the GP and fortunately avoided the toughests fighters. Saki, Ghita, Shilt and an old Aerts.
Now when you look at Overeems striking its clear he loves his size now and is in love with his power and menacing look. But he just doesnt put them together as well as say Aerts, Ghita Spong or Saki. If Overeem is going to tear through the UFC and disguise his obvious weakness he really needs to start putting them together. This one punch -whip out a camera and survey your work- and the occasional uber knee is just not enough. There's just not enough variation in his work and its hardly surprising taking into account his background.
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Old 12-31-2011, 08:12 AM   #2
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Default Re: Is Overeems striking overrated?

I do not think so.

Why This Guy is Awesome:Alistair Overeem Edition by Tomas Rios.

In the world of combat sports, no one had a better December than Alistair Overeem. Between winning the grueling gauntlet of kickboxing that is the K-1 World Grand Prix Final and notching an effortless 19 second decimation of former UFC heavyweight prospect Todd Duffee, Overeem simply did the damn thang.

The only disappointment has been the way Overeem's success is now viewed. Many seem content to regard him as a talented fighter who has grown into a physical force that runs over opponents like some well-trained brute. This flies in the face of what that magical month of December really taught us about one of the true anomalies in the entire history of both kickboxing and MMA.

Our latest And 1 MixGIF series starts with Overeem's quarterfinal match against Tyrone Spong who spent much of the bout's early stages frustrating "The Reem" with constant movement and combinations. However, as the bout wears on we get to see the beauty of Overeem's game.

There may be no weapon in all of combat sports capable of matching Overeem's clinch knees and here he shows how he manages to land them so often. The sequence starts with Overeem subtly feinting a lead right hand -- a trap that Spong unwittingly falls into.

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As soon as Spong brings up his guard, Overeem wraps his left arm across the back of Spong's neck and connects with a solid left knee to the body that knocks his opponent off balance. Naturally, Spong attempts to back away and get his feet underneath him again, but Overeem anticipates this, maintains his hold of the neck and lands a right knee square on the chin.

It turns out to be a blow that Spong would never fully recover from and once Overeem realizes how vulnerable he is, the intelligence that drives his attacking style is laid bare.

A few moments after that first knee lands, Spong is trapped in the corner and tries for a teep kick to the body in an attempt to create some space between his chin and Overeem's fists. The defensive tactic fails as Overeem sees it coming and counters with a stiff right jab that sets off a relentless series of blows.

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Spong's chin saves him from being knocked out, but Overeem does manage to land several clean power shots. The reason Overeem is able to land so many blows despite lacking hand speed lies in his timing. Watch the sequence of strikes closely and you'll see he varies his rhythm and strikes in a way that keeps Spong from anticipating what's coming. An extra half second here, a different angle there and suddenly Overeem is unloading on a borderline defenseless opponent. Forget the power behind the strikes, it's Overeem's brain that is beating Spong so thoroughly.

Overeem's semifinal opponent, Gokhan Saki, would pose many of the same problems as Spong. Namely, an obvious speed advantage which Saki attempted to use as the lynch pin of a spectacularly violent stick-and-move strategy. Again, a faster foe found early success against Overeem before making a crucial mistake that would not go unpunished.

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The table is set by Overeem carefully herding Saki against the ropes with measured forward movement. Instead of circling out, Saki attempts to stand his ground and puts out a lazy, pawing jab -- perhaps the cardinal sin of striking. Immediately, a sharp left cross comes down the pipe before Saki can regain his guard and the blow lands right on his nose.

One consequence of the blow is that it pushes Saki's back further against the ropes and leaves him trapped in Overeem's wheelhouse. Usually, this is when an unrefined brawler would go for broke in hopes of landing a fight-ending shot. However, Overeem shows incredible patience by waiting an extra half-beat and measuring a sharp left kick to the body. While Overeem could never throw that strike with the speed Saki is capable of, by using an unusual rhythm and placing it perfectly he ends up landing it as well as anyone possibly could. Saki would go on to be stopped a few moments later by another left kick to the body, but it was the highlighted sequence that effectively ended the fight for him.

The one criticism I have heard of Overeem's performance against Saki is that he cannibalized the work Daniel Ghita did on Saki's body in the tournament's quarterfinal round. However, this argument not only ignores the technique in Overeem's attack, but the intelligence he exhibited by going after a weakness mercilessly. Fighting is a cutthroat business and few can match Overeem when it comes time to twist the knife.

In the tournament's final round, Overeem faced off with legendary three-time K-1 World Grand Prix champion Peter Aerts and drove home the case that no one can match his finishing instincts.

Appropriately enough, the sequence starts with Overeem again capitalizing on his opponent's error. Aerts moves into Overeem's range without throwing anything which means he's essentially handing his Dutch compatriot a free shot.

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The response is sudden as Overeem lands a crisp left knee to the liver that clearly bothers Aerts. In the follow-up we see another display of the broken rhythm Overeem favors as he calmly steps back, assesses the situation and steps back in with a simple leg kick to Aerts' lead leg that catches him completely off guard. Sensing the dire straits Aerts is in, Overeem lunges forward with a left hook to the body and a series of follow-up shots that fail to finish the job they've been assigned.

Realizing a more composed attack is needed, Overeem casually steps back, composes himself and steps in with a solid right cross to Aerts' temple that leaves him covering up. As he did in the Saki fight, Overeem makes Aerts pay with a body shot that effectively ends the fight. This time it's a left hook to the gut that would leave most grown men on the floor with tears streaming down their face as they silently struggle to suck in some oxygen.

The last technical breakdown in the queue is designed to illustrate just how far Overeem has come in his striking and just how dangerous he really is against anyone who can't claim world-class kickboxing credentials.

Taken from Overeem's bout against Duffee at K-1 Dynamite!! 2010, the same theme emerges as a careless mistake is brutally exploited.

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The mistake comes as soon as Duffee throws a lead right hook from way outside the pocket that has zero chance of landing. He compounds his error by moving forward after it whiffs which gives Overeem all the opportunity he needs to clinch up and do work.

Striking from the clinch can be difficult even with a dominant position in place as the angles are tight and it's hard to see where your strikes will land. Overeem handles those problems like a pro as he immediately laces a perfectly placed knee to the body that basically ends Duffee's night right then and there.

Overeem leaves nothing to chance though and rides the momentum of the knee to his right which leaves him nearly perpendicular to Duffee's body. This is a nightmare position for Duffee and Overeem shows why by landing a right clean across the jaw and a left hook that is superfluous at best.

Obviously, Duffe had no chance on the feet against Overeem beyond a miracle shot on the chin, but it's the manner in which Overeem outclasses him that is a sight to behold. Duffee makes a single mistake and in a matter of seconds he is laid out.

In his last four fights the same storyline has played out -- a single, careless mistake is made and the response is a fundamentally flawless display of pure violence. The X-factor here isn't Overeem's size, strength or anything else that is won in the genetic lottery or gained in weight rooms.

What makes Overeem so singular in combat sports is that he is a 6'5", 260 lb. heavyweight who has the striking technique to dismantle all comers and the kind of cutthroat finishing instincts that can't be explained, they can only be admired. By the way, take another look at the GIFs above and something else should catch your eye -- Overeem was doing work from both the orthodox and southpaw stance.

Alistair Overeem, you are a good guy at sports.
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Old 12-31-2011, 08:17 AM   #3
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Default Re: Is Overeems striking overrated?

C'mon dude less of the copy paste jobs. Give me your opinion not Rios's...

And i'm only attempting to hold Reem to the highest standard here in striking. Head to head with a guy like Ghita or Saki he's actually inferior.
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Old 12-31-2011, 08:26 AM   #4
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Default Re: Is Overeems striking overrated?

That is my opinion, I'm just pasting the article because it's relevant. Rios knows a lot more about combat sports than I do, and although he sometimes makes an idiot out of himself it's a very well written knowledgeable article which people might find interesting

Technically speaking those guys are better than Overeem in a lot of ways but like it says in the article Overeem uses his natural talents and incredible fight IQ to beat them. I don't think that makes him overrated. Well maybe by some people but it's clear to me and should be to most that Overeem is a very talented striker and although he isn't as good as Saki, Spong, Ghita, Hari etc. in many ways, he still beat them fair and square. You can say he just had an easy route to the final but that's the nature of the tournament. He's also beaten other good/great kickboxers outside of the tournament, such as KOing Hari, beating a fresh Aerts and although he didn't win he had a good showing against Bonjasky.
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Old 12-31-2011, 08:34 AM   #5
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Default Re: Is Overeems striking overrated?

is it me or has everyone in mma been acucsed of being overrated. If you have watched Overeem through out his career than you know his striking is not overrated. Who else can match his stand up??? only 1 person comes to mind and that is the current UFC HW champ JDS.
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Old 12-31-2011, 08:36 AM   #6
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Default Re: Is Overeems striking overrated?

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Originally Posted by elixirvtec View Post
is it me or has everyone in mma been acucsed of being overrated. If you have watched Overeem through out his career than you know his striking is not overrated. Who else can match his stand up??? only 1 person comes to mind and that is the current UFC HW champ JDS.
Probably not the best word to use. But when i compare Overeem with a PURE striker he leaves me wanting a lot more. I guess more of the K-1 fans here will agree with me than MMA fans.
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Old 12-31-2011, 08:37 AM   #7
Matty lll
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Default Re: Is Overeems striking overrated?

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Originally Posted by elixirvtec View Post
is it me or has everyone in mma been acucsed of being overrated. If you have watched Overeem through out his career than you know his striking is not overrated. Who else can match his stand up??? only 1 person comes to mind and that is the current UFC HW champ JDS.
I agree and watching the JDS-Nelson fight again I don't think he can stand with Overeem apart from a KO punch.
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Old 12-31-2011, 08:38 AM   #8
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Default Re: Is Overeems striking overrated?

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Originally Posted by Matty lll View Post
That is my opinion, I'm just pasting the article because it's relevant. Rios knows a lot more about combat sports than I do, and although he sometimes makes an idiot out of himself it's a very well written knowledgeable article which people might find interesting

Technically speaking those guys are better than Overeem in a lot of ways but like it says in the article Overeem uses his natural talents and incredible fight IQ to beat them. I don't think that makes him overrated. Well maybe by some people but it's clear to me and should be to most that Overeem is a very talented striker and although he isn't as good as Saki, Spong, Ghita, Hari etc. in many ways, he still beat them fair and square. You can say he just had an easy route to the final but that's the nature of the tournament. He's also beaten other good/great kickboxers outside of the tournament, such as KOing Hari, beating a fresh Aerts and although he didn't win he had a good showing against Bonjasky.
There's no doubting that buddy. But he really needs to put them together vs JDS otherwise his excellent credentials and resume are going to get squashed in a round. I just want to see Reem fighting how a World Class striker is supposed to.
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Old 12-31-2011, 08:57 AM   #9
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Default Re: Is Overeems striking overrated?

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There's no doubting that buddy. But he really needs to put them together vs JDS otherwise his excellent credentials and resume are going to get squashed in a round. I just want to see Reem fighting how a World Class striker is supposed to.
I think he will against JDS. He doesn't need to fear a takedown so hopefully he'll be able to just let it go. Saying that, He still needs to respect JDS' striking though because although JDS is anywhere near as good as Overeem technically speaking he still hits like a mule and it could be a short night for Overeem if he doesn't bring his A game.
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Old 12-31-2011, 08:59 AM   #10
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Default Re: Is Overeems striking overrated?

JDS isnīt the only fighter who can strike with Overeem, what about Kharitonov? I hope for a rematch in 2012
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Old 12-31-2011, 09:01 AM   #11
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Default Re: Is Overeems striking overrated?

JDS is a much better boxer (for MMA) than Overeem is. JDS will smash him up with relative ease. This fight will not be close. Overeem's only chance is to catch Junior with a big knee in the clinch and break his ribs, but I don't anticipate that happening, Cigano is not a rabbit in the headlights like Brock was.
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Old 12-31-2011, 09:01 AM   #12
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Default Re: Is Overeems striking overrated?

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I think he will against JDS. He doesn't need to fear a takedown so hopefully he'll be able to just let it go. Saying that, He still needs to respect JDS' striking though because although JDS is anywhere near as good as Overeem technically speaking he still hits like a mule and it could be a short night for Overeem if he doesn't bring his A game.
And thats basically my beef. JDS hasn't been KO'ed before. As the fight progresses it becomes more in JDS's favour. So Reem has to be ready to go 5 rounds as well as not being conservative with his output in order to keep JDS honest.
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Old 12-31-2011, 09:01 AM   #13
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Default Re: Is Overeems striking overrated?

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JDS isnīt the only fighter who can strike with Overeem, what about Kharitonov? I hope for a rematch in 2012
Oh snap, I keep forgetting about Kharitonov because he isn't in the UFC. He definitely can and has before. If Arlovski's chin wasn't shot he would have a chance as well.

I think Overeem beats them all now though, even Kharitonov.
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Old 12-31-2011, 09:02 AM   #14
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Default Re: Is Overeems striking overrated?

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Oh snap, I keep forgetting about Kharitonov because he isn't in the UFC. He definitely can and has before. If Arlovski's chin wasn't shot he would have a chance as well.

I think Overeem beats them all now though, even Kharitonov.
What about Bones Jones?
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Old 12-31-2011, 09:03 AM   #15
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Default Re: Is Overeems striking overrated?

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Oh snap, I keep forgetting about Kharitonov because he isn't in the UFC. He definitely can and has before. If Arlovski's chin wasn't shot he would have a chance as well.

I think Overeem beats them all now though, even Kharitonov.
Overeem destroyed Khartitonov in their first fight. He turned his face into a side of beef with devastating knee's on the mat. He cant do that in the UFC.
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