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Old 02-10-2012, 06:11 AM   #271
slip&counter
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Default Re: The all things technical thread.

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Originally Posted by Juan Ma Lopez View Post
Got to still disagree here with Zab. He was clowning him all until that shot landed. For most of this round he was showboating by leaving his chin out to dry then pulling it back in. He did it when they were on the ropes. Then when they went out to the middle of the ring Zab decided to put his head well over his right foot again to slip the right, only he didn't get back across in time.

In what way was his footwork what caused him to get hit with that shot?


No lol footwork is so broad it would take days.
Just watch the way he bounces after breaking from the clinch that's the first mistake he makes with his feet. He got himself into a bad position, which allows Kostya to set up the right. The second mistake he makes with his feet is he doesn't pivot properly after Kostya misses with the first, which causes him to stay in range for the follow up. He does try to do his bootleg version of Sweet Pete's signature move but not much in that fight. His feet were horrible. That's not the only fight either, it's systematic with Zab when he loses form. He displayed it throughout his career. It may look like he's just showboating (that makes it sound like that Kostya's shot was somehow fortunate) but look closer and he's making serious mistakes with his feet.

He closed the angle on himself.

Lol. C'mon, it's only fair you do a piece so i get my chance to critic.

Last edited by slip&counter; 02-10-2012 at 07:36 AM.
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Old 02-10-2012, 07:28 AM   #272
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Default Re: The all things technical thread.

Let me expand on it a little bit. What i mean by 'he didn't pivot properly' is that he didn't combine a pivot with his circling to spin away and make Kostya hit fresh air. He over exaggerated his movements and wasted motion. With a simple pivot he could've cut Kostya's right hand off.

The mistake he made with his feet was he stepped across with the wrong foot. Which meant his body weight was transferred into his front foot and that's why he couldn't avoid the right hand. He transferred his weight too far to his front foot. If he would've done a proper pivot he would've just turned on the toes of his lead foot and then brought the the other one over whilst still maintaining his shape and not transferring body weight unevenly. It's ideal that the weight stays balanced between the body and not unevenly on either foot, but if you're ganna put the weight on one foot in this instance then it's the back foot and not the wrong foot like he did. If he would've done that he would've ended up somewhere nearing the back and blindside of Kostya (on Kostya's left side) and he would got away from the right hand that followed. Instead what happened was he ended up in line with the right hand and then he compounded it by trying to move in the direction that the right hand was coming from.

But that's the problem with Zab. He'll pivot unbelievably well in spots. You watch some fights and he pivots like you've never seen, but then inexplicably he'll lose form and concentration and he'll do amateurish things like that with his feet. He doesn't stay consistant.
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Old 02-10-2012, 07:33 AM   #273
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Default Re: The all things technical thread.

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Originally Posted by Juan Ma Lopez View Post
Got to still disagree here with Zab. He was clowning him all until that shot landed. For most of this round he was showboating by leaving his chin out to dry then pulling it back in. He did it when they were on the ropes. Then when they went out to the middle of the ring Zab decided to put his head well over his right foot again to slip the right, only he didn't get back across in time.

In what way was his footwork what caused him to get hit with that shot?


No lol footwork is so broad it would take days.
Clowning him? Really...
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Old 02-10-2012, 07:47 AM   #274
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Default Re: The all things technical thread.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Ct2jCu7y9Y[/ame]

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F5Pw2elzBik[/ame]



Look at Durans clips in the end of the second vid. He did the most difficult thing to do in boxing.
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Old 02-10-2012, 07:56 AM   #275
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Default Re: The all things technical thread.

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My only point was that you can't limit it to two different styles. One being Hatton and the other something like Khan at the start of his fights. Yes, they are aspects to it but ones inside and others outside and not the only way you can fight on the outside is to move like Khan.
Would have been better to say inside footwork and then labelled the different techniques involved in that and then gone onto the different fighting styles and how there footwork helps with that style.
That Zab Judah gif he did the same move seconds before he got hit with the ko shot. He was showboating here not that his footwork was at fault.

Footwork is so broad to talk about but you done a good job with your other inputs brother. HTH
that's more like it my friend
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Old 02-10-2012, 08:45 AM   #276
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Default Re: The all things technical thread.

The only time Zab showboated that night was when he was breakdancing around canvas.
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Old 02-10-2012, 08:49 AM   #277
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The only time Zab showboated that night was when he was breakdancing around canvas.
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Old 02-10-2012, 09:07 AM   #278
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Default Re: The all things technical thread.

Ray Robinson use to dance. He said it helped with balance. He also advised fighters to walk as much as possible.

Does learning a specific type of dance like tap dancing help with balance?
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Old 02-10-2012, 09:15 AM   #279
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Default Re: The all things technical thread.

Didn't Marvin Hagler used to run backwards wearing rigga boots?
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Old 02-10-2012, 09:19 AM   #280
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Default Re: The all things technical thread.

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Ray Robinson used to dance. He said it helped with balance. He also advised fighters to walk as much as possible.

Does learning a specific type of dance like tap dancing help with balance?
Ray said that dancing was harder work than fighting

As someone who used to dance ( until I was 12) & has boxed a little I think it does help, not just balance but flexibility,agility & co-ordination. Dancing & boxing both require lots of learning & repeating choreographed moves.

Marquez did some ballet training before the 3rd Pacquiao fight to work on his legs..
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Old 02-10-2012, 09:48 AM   #281
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Default Re: The all things technical thread.

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Didn't Marvin Hagler used to run backwards wearing rigga boots?
Yep. I think so, Luke. Most fighters do run backwards in spots. I think it was with old school military boots then riggers though.

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Originally Posted by DrMo View Post
Ray said that dancing was harder work than fighting

As someone who used to dance ( until I was 12) & has boxed a little I think it does help, not just balance but flexibility & co-ordination. There's also the mental/muscle memory aspect of learning & repeating moves which is common to both.

Marquez did some ballet training before the 3rd Pacquiao fight to work on his legs; his balance & core strength.
That's interesting, Cheers, mate. Didn't know that about Marquez. I figured it would help with balance and footwork. As you rightly say it helps with learning and getting used to repetitions as repetition is the key to learning in boxing. Miguel Canto had awesome balance and he did some dancing too. You could see that the way he just glided along the ground. Almost like he was floating. I guess to get better balance it's crucial to train certain muscles.
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Old 02-10-2012, 10:19 AM   #282
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Default Re: The all things technical thread.

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That's interesting, Cheers, mate. Didn't know that about Marquez. I figured it would help with balance and footwork. As you rightly say it helps with learning and getting used to repetitions as repetition is the key to learning in boxing. Miguel Canto had awesome balance and he did some dancing too. You could see that the way he just glided along the ground. Almost like he was floating. I guess to get better balance it's crucial to train certain muscles.
Balance I think has more to do with co-ordination & core stability than muscle strength. Being flexible & having good extension & elasticity is better than having big strong legs imo.

Some of techniques I was taught when dancing, like how to spin without getting dizzy & how to maintain good posture whilst moving definately helped me when I 1st went into a gym.

I think a lot of boxers would benefit from lifting fewer weights & doing a bit of dancing

Last edited by DrMo; 02-10-2012 at 10:44 AM.
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Old 02-10-2012, 10:39 AM   #283
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Default Re: The all things technical thread.

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Balance I think has more to do with co-ordination & core stability than muscle strength. Being flexible & having good extension & elasticity is better than having big strong legs imo.

Some of techniques I was taught when dancing, like how to spin without getting dizzy & how to maintain good posture whilst moving definately helped me when I 1st went into a gym.

I think a lot of boxers would benefit from lifting fewer weights & doing a bit of dancing
You missed the most important thing; 'correct' footwork
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Old 02-10-2012, 10:45 AM   #284
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Default Re: The all things technical thread.

Ray was the exception IMO. Not many boxers are tapdancers at the top level! He was ace.
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Old 02-10-2012, 10:56 AM   #285
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Ray was the exception IMO. Not many boxers are tapdancers at the top level! He was ace.
James DeGale went to stage school & danced a lot

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