What's worse: nostalgia or anti-old timer bias? - Page 3

maracho · 07-05-2007, 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Butch Coolidge

Marciano eating a bunch of leather from a 180lb guy, and getting his face beat in, really makes me think he could take out Tyson, Tua, Brewster, Sanders, Klitschko. Holmes throwing sharp jabs at a turtles pace makes me think a contemporary would have no chance whatsoever. Remember when Michael Spinks was champ? Now that was a phenomenal time in heavyweight boxing. Lennox Lewis vs Joe Louis? No contest? RJJ vs Billy Conn? Forget about it. The old timers have it in spades...

Everbody that ever fought Marciano made abundant quotes concerning how hard he was to hit.

You think Holmes throws Jabs at a turtles pace?

Why do hate Spinks

At least I am humble enough to back up my arguments

maracho · 07-05-2007, 07:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eze

I can't stand the no one beats Ali shit from the 90s+ era.

I almost feel you have to base it off eras in terms of greatness, advances in nutrition and humans have evolved into bigger stronger beings. The AVG HW is 220, the avg HW back in Marcianos day were 185-195. I just dont see Rocky beating Vitali. Ever. And I juust dont see Ali boxing circles around him either.

But then again I do bash the old timers a bit but I get sick of the no one will ever be as great as the SRR, SRL, Ali.

I almost feel like this, why box and fight for legacy when no one in the world will ever say you are the best P4P all time, its an unreachable mark if you think about it.

I can show you plenty of fossil and early humans that were just as big and muscular (based on bone size and muscle attachment) as any football player alive today!

Butch Coolidge · 07-06-2007, 05:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maracho

Everbody that ever fought Marciano made abundant quotes concerning how hard he was to hit.

You think Holmes throws Jabs at a turtles pace?

Why do hate Spinks

At least I am humble enough to back up my arguments

Marciano was hard to hit? That's why there's so many pictures of him with his face half torn off.

Spinks? Steffen Tengstadd, Anders Ecklund, 91 second blow-out, aged Larry Holmes---and today's heavyweights are supposed to be the worst ever?

Holmes fighting at a snails pace--I actually saw Holmes fight a few times and most of those fights lacked bad intentions until the last round.

Appreciate what you have now.

Shake · 07-06-2007, 07:23 AM

Boxing is very much less popular these days, and as such, the talent pool is smaller. Youth are distracted with them newfangled diddly Ipods and internets. Very few go to such an ancient barbaric thing as a boxing gym and sweat and stuff. It's icky.

The point I'm trying to make is that it's perfectly logical for boxing to be at a low-point right now in width. There are always sparks -- such as PBF, and we just came off a nice era with Trinidad, De la Hoya, Mosley, Sweet Pea, Barrera, Morales, etc.

On the other hand some really do believe Marciano could best Lewis -- I'm no Lewis fan, but Marciano was smaller than Frazier. He belongs as much in a ring with Lewis as he does with Bernard Hopkins.

So it's a bit of give and take -- I find it the more high-profile old fighters are built up too much -- and the low-profile old champions are not given any credit what-so-ever. The gap is enormous. If you are unloved, your abilities and accomplishments are played down and vice versa. Take Ingemarr Johansson, a world-champion that beat Floyd Patterson. I bet if you asked anyone if he would win against Buster Douglas it would give people some pause -- but if you ask them if Floyd Patterson would win, they would be much more eager to confirm it, even though the two examples were very competitive.

Cruiser1 · 07-06-2007, 07:28 AM

I got sick of hearing about the old-timers a long time ago. I wanna know how they think a 195 lb. heavyweight from the 40's or 50's would be able to beat a polished 6'6'' 245 lb. guy like Wladimir Klitschko who can crack with both hands. I'm not necessarily referring to marciano either.

People are still talking about these guys from the 20's and 30's. Man, talk about living in the past.

Shake · 07-06-2007, 07:29 AM

I always compare them with the lighter weight fighters now. Seems more fair. I mean, Jack Dempsey was just a light-heavyweight.

View Poll Results: Which is worse
anti-old timer bias	21	43.75%
nostalgia, anti-present day is worse	27	56.25%
Voters: 48. You may not vote on this poll

07-06-2007, 07:23 AM	#34
Shake Belt holder ESB Addict Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 2,335 vCash: 75	Re: What's worse: nostalgia or anti-old timer bias? Boxing is very much less popular these days, and as such, the talent pool is smaller. Youth are distracted with them newfangled diddly Ipods and internets. Very few go to such an ancient barbaric thing as a boxing gym and sweat and stuff. It's icky. The point I'm trying to make is that it's perfectly logical for boxing to be at a low-point right now in width. There are always sparks -- such as PBF, and we just came off a nice era with Trinidad, De la Hoya, Mosley, Sweet Pea, Barrera, Morales, etc. On the other hand some really do believe Marciano could best Lewis -- I'm no Lewis fan, but Marciano was smaller than Frazier. He belongs as much in a ring with Lewis as he does with Bernard Hopkins. So it's a bit of give and take -- I find it the more high-profile old fighters are built up too much -- and the low-profile old champions are not given any credit what-so-ever. The gap is enormous. If you are unloved, your abilities and accomplishments are played down and vice versa. Take Ingemarr Johansson, a world-champion that beat Floyd Patterson. I bet if you asked anyone if he would win against Buster Douglas it would give people some pause -- but if you ask them if Floyd Patterson would win, they would be much more eager to confirm it, even though the two examples were very competitive.
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07-06-2007, 07:28 AM	#35
Cruiser1 Champion Emeritus ESB Addict Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 2,751 vCash: 1000	Re: What's worse: nostalgia or anti-old timer bias? I got sick of hearing about the old-timers a long time ago. I wanna know how they think a 195 lb. heavyweight from the 40's or 50's would be able to beat a polished 6'6'' 245 lb. guy like Wladimir Klitschko who can crack with both hands. I'm not necessarily referring to marciano either. People are still talking about these guys from the 20's and 30's. Man, talk about living in the past.
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07-06-2007, 07:29 AM	#36
Shake Belt holder ESB Addict Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 2,335 vCash: 75	Re: What's worse: nostalgia or anti-old timer bias? I always compare them with the lighter weight fighters now. Seems more fair. I mean, Jack Dempsey was just a light-heavyweight.
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