Boxing  

Forum Home Boxing Forum European British Classic Aussie MMA Training
Go Back   Boxing News 24 Forum > Boxing > Classic Boxing Forum


Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 03-18-2012, 11:13 AM   #1
Badbot
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 4,547
vCash: 650
Default Educate me on Ray Robinson

I apologize if this thread was made before but i could not find it.
I am new to boxing and i don't know much about him. I did some work with boxrec but thats just "on paper material".
What made him so great ? (please don't talk abut athleticism).
What were those great wins that put him down in history as the greatest ?
Badbot is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Old 03-18-2012, 11:26 AM   #2
McGrain
Diamond Dog
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 36,412
vCash: 1000
Default Re: Educate me on Ray Robinson

[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e991-NLbUsA[/ame]
McGrain is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2012, 11:41 AM   #3
Badbot
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 4,547
vCash: 650
Default Re: Educate me on Ray Robinson

Badbot is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2012, 01:14 PM   #4
lufcrazy
requiescat in pace
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: England, Up North
Posts: 22,447
vCash: 330
Default Re: Educate me on Ray Robinson

Well as a brief summary I'll go with the following.

in 41 he beat Lello, Angott and Shapiro to be regarded as pretty much the best LW in the world (maybe an uncrowned champion)

At WW, he holds victories over Angott, Servo, Zivic, Wilson, Armstrong, Bell, Gavilan. In my humble opinion, he was the best WW in the world from 1943 to 1950.

At Mw, he holds victories over Basora, La Motta, Levine, Abrams, Villemain, Belloise, Olson, Turpin, Graziano, Fullmer, Basilio, Moyer.

At Lhw he came within a few minutes of championship glory and was way up ojn points before retiring in his corner due to exhaustion. I'd fault his gameplan here for expending so much energy.

His winning performance against La Motta where he stops him for the Mw Championship is the best filmed performance I've ever seen by a fighter. Such a great arsenal is demonstrated.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w328DbEX33g[/ame]

I think this man is the most skilled boxer in recorded history. Some achieved more, Some beat better guys, but this man was the best of them all imo.
lufcrazy is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2012, 01:28 PM   #5
SugarShane_24
ESB good-looking member
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: the few, the proud, the Philippines
Posts: 4,433
vCash: 75
Default Re: Educate me on Ray Robinson

The guy is already a sure hall of famer in his welterweight stint alone.

But his tenure at 160 solidified him as the greatest fighter of all time.
SugarShane_24 is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2012, 01:37 PM   #6
salsanchezfan
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Auburn, WA
Posts: 3,911
vCash: 1000
Default Re: Educate me on Ray Robinson

I have been among those to have downgraded him more than most at 160, but I still think he's at ery least a top two or three P4P all time.

He had the athleticism and skill of the finest boxers coupled with numbing, true KO power in either fist and the daring and grit to take chances. He wasn't afraid to risk things, and to be truly great you need to do that.
salsanchezfan is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2012, 02:14 PM   #7
burt bienstock
Champion
East Side Guru
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 7,636
vCash: 500
Default Re: Educate me on Ray Robinson

The greatest ALL around fighter who ever lived. He had it ALL, and I was priviliged to see him at his best...He was Fred Astaire with boxing gloves....
burt bienstock is online now  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2012, 02:32 PM   #8
SugarShane_24
ESB good-looking member
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: the few, the proud, the Philippines
Posts: 4,433
vCash: 75
Default Re: Educate me on Ray Robinson

Quote:
Originally Posted by burt bienstock View Post
The greatest ALL around fighter who ever lived. He had it ALL, and I was priviliged to see him at his best...He was Fred Astaire with boxing gloves....
Now that you've mentioned that, allow me to humbly ask your opinion.

John Garfield is very much welcome to give his thoughts as well.

I know Robinson lost to Maxim in a fight he was winning.

Barring the heatsroke he suffered, what would your opinion be had Ray moved up to 175 and faced Archie Moore instead? Could he have done it?
SugarShane_24 is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2012, 05:32 PM   #9
1_man_army
The Knockout King
ESB Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Scotland
Posts: 1,206
vCash: 1883
Default Re: Educate me on Ray Robinson

Quote:
Originally Posted by lufcrazy View Post

At Lhw he came within a few minutes of championship glory and was way up ojn points before retiring in his corner due to exhaustion. I'd fault his gameplan here for expending so much energy.
I see what you mean but surely with Robinson being the considerably smaller man in the fight he's going to have to expend alot more energy anyway? That's why I cut Robinson some slack for the Maxim fight.

You lose a lot of energy against a naturally bigger man like that because you tend to need to use a lot of movement and you're more likely to be getting pushed around on the inside which saps alot of energy.

What's everyone elses thoughts on this?
1_man_army is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2012, 05:46 PM   #10
PetethePrince
Slick & Redheaded
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 14,396
vCash: 1200
Default Re: Educate me on Ray Robinson

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1_man_army View Post
I see what you mean but surely with Robinson being the considerably smaller man in the fight he's going to have to expend alot more energy anyway? That's why I cut Robinson some slack for the Maxim fight.

You lose a lot of energy against a naturally bigger man like that because you tend to need to use a lot of movement and you're more likely to be getting pushed around on the inside which saps alot of energy.

What's everyone elses thoughts on this?
You're correct. You either get shoved around and banged to the body in clinches, or you keep moving the way Robinson had. He fought a good fight, and if it were 70 degrees out he would've won. Can't fault the game-plan too much. Just ended unfortunately for Robinson.
PetethePrince is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2012, 05:58 PM   #11
burt bienstock
Champion
East Side Guru
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 7,636
vCash: 500
Default Re: Educate me on Ray Robinson

Quote:
Originally Posted by SugarShane_24 View Post
Now that you've mentioned that, allow me to humbly ask your opinion.

John Garfield is very much welcome to give his thoughts as well.

I know Robinson lost to Maxim in a fight he was winning.

Barring the heatsroke he suffered, what would your opinion be had Ray moved up to 175 and faced Archie Moore instead? Could he have done it?
If Ray Robinson had to face a Light Heavyweight, the ideal opponent would have been Joey Maxim, who did not hit as hard as some MWs. Therefore
Robinson who could have challenged an Archie Moore, Harold Johnson, Lloyd Marshall, all terrific punchers, chose the less dangerous Joey Maxim..
Yes Robinson collapsed due to the heat and exertion fighting a bigger man
as Maxim, but as Maxim proclaimed after the fight, "it was just as hot in my corner too". I can't see Ray Robinson climbing a ladder and beating Moore, Charles, Marshall,or Harold Johnson,at any time..They were too big and hit too hard...P4P, it's Robinson hands down !!!
burt bienstock is online now  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2012, 08:16 AM   #12
dmille
Contender
ESB Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Miami, FL
Posts: 995
vCash: 1000
Default Re: Educate me on Ray Robinson

Quote:
Originally Posted by burt bienstock View Post
If Ray Robinson had to face a Light Heavyweight, the ideal opponent would have been Joey Maxim, who did not hit as hard as some MWs. Therefore
Robinson who could have challenged an Archie Moore, Harold Johnson, Lloyd Marshall, all terrific punchers, chose the less dangerous Joey Maxim..
Yes Robinson collapsed due to the heat and exertion fighting a bigger man
as Maxim, but as Maxim proclaimed after the fight, "it was just as hot in my corner too". I can't see Ray Robinson climbing a ladder and beating Moore, Charles, Marshall,or Harold Johnson,at any time..They were too big and hit too hard...P4P, it's Robinson hands down !!!
He chose the less dangerous Maxim? WTF? There was only one title and Maxim held it.
dmille is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2012, 11:04 AM   #13
bodhi
So I can die easy ...
East Side Guru
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 9,492
vCash: 1337
Default Re: Educate me on Ray Robinson

IMO the best fighter ever, not necessarily the greatest though. Underachiever you might say
bodhi is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2012, 11:44 AM   #14
McGrain
Diamond Dog
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 36,412
vCash: 1000
Default Re: Educate me on Ray Robinson

Haha I never thought about it like that before, he probably IS an underachiever!
McGrain is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2012, 01:01 PM   #15
burt bienstock
Champion
East Side Guru
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 7,636
vCash: 500
Default Re: Educate me on Ray Robinson

Quote:
Originally Posted by dmille View Post
He chose the less dangerous Maxim? WTF? There was only one title and Maxim held it.
d, of course he chose Joey Maxim because ot the reason that Maxin held the LH title of THAT time...But rest assured if it was Archie Moore,or Ezzard Charles,or Harold Johnson who held that crown, Robinson would NOT have challenged these guys. Ray knew his limitations...
burt bienstock is online now  Top
Reply With Quote
Reply

Boxing News 24 Forum > Boxing > Classic Boxing Forum

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump





All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:58 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Boxing News 24 Forum 2013