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Old 03-31-2012, 08:39 PM   #16
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Default Re: Lewis vs Klitschko what do each need to do to win

Vitali is different to other big guys like Biggs, Tucker, Briggs and Grant he is a great fighter and never been knocked off his feet, Grant couldn't fight so why shouldn't Lewis just go in and bang him.
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Old 04-02-2012, 09:14 AM   #17
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Default Re: Lewis vs Klitschko what do each need to do to win

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What he did was win all of them. He also stopped some peeps early (by unloading some bombs pretty much straight up) that would have been otherwise dangerous.
When he faced Mcall who take his shots and he tried to punch with him, he was flattened. When he slugged with Mercer, another guy who take his shots, he fought him to a controversial decision.

Im not confident Lewis ever beats Tyson or Holyfield at their respective best using the same strategies he used later in his career to win fights. It simply wouldnt work with guys that good.
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Old 04-02-2012, 09:25 AM   #18
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Default Re: Lewis vs Klitschko what do each need to do to win

Lewis would look to get the left hook off more, when Steward told him to do this late it gave Vitali problems. From the outside he'd time straight rights instead of overhand rights. He'd come inside more to land uppercuts. He'd need to get his weight down and his stamina up to keep upto Vitali's workrate and be quicker himself. Lennox would probably also try and open those cuts up again

I think doing all these things he can drown Vitali with a KO by the mid rounds

As for Vitali's gameplan, probably hold on the inside more , box in and out at a high pace
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Old 04-02-2012, 10:08 AM   #19
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Default Re: Lewis vs Klitschko what do each need to do to win

Both men would benefit from throwing more jabs,
Lennox needed to shorten up his shots, they were way to wide
Vitali would benefit by throwing more right hands as it seemed he was landing alot when he threw them
Also id say to both men to pace themselves a bit better
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Old 04-02-2012, 10:25 AM   #20
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Default Re: Lewis vs Klitschko what do each need to do to win

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Originally Posted by lufcrazy View Post
Lewis isn't great on the inside and with his uppercut he's pretty much a one trick pony in the pocket, but vitali is a no trick pony so the edge is with lewis.

He'd begin taking too much punishment on his way inside and after about 8 rounds he'd start fighting in a shell on the outside which is suicide vs vitali and vitali would have probably got the stoppage around the 11th.

One trick pony?

Yes his uppercut(s) were a major weapon on the inside. But his inside game was more than just an uppercut...and i take it you mean his right one.

Lewis as we know was freakishly strong even for a man of his size and at the same time he was very agile with that size.

He would position himself firstly so that the other guy couldn't get nothing done, then he was able to quickly manoeuvre himself to let go with hooks, body shots and yes, uppercuts.
He was nearly always positioned and coiled to throw on the inside.

Yeah hit and hold was mainly his thing inside but definitely more than a one trick pony.

A lot of times we saw Lewis try the Tyson-esque combo of R-hook body, R-uppercut head, L-hook head, R-hook head. Admittedly not as effective as Tyson but at 6"5 and a 84" reach he was never gonna be. But still, impressive for a giant.


The matter of fact way you speak of the outcome doesn't sit well either mate, considering Vitali didn't look like he was gonna make it past the seventh (with or without cuts) never mind be able to stop Lewis in the 11th.

If you mean the second fight then we can all predict...and i predict Lewis wouldn't have looked that bad second time around.
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Old 04-03-2012, 08:21 AM   #21
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Default Re: Lewis vs Klitschko what do each need to do to win

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Vitali is different to other big guys like Biggs, Tucker, Briggs and Grant he is a great fighter and never been knocked off his feet, Grant couldn't fight so why shouldn't Lewis just go in and bang him.

Lewis took out far more dangerous fighters than those guys early.

Emanuel Steward is on record as saying Lewis had better success when he got up close and personal. Lewis wasn't used to a guy that big and was getting tagged when he thought he was safe. Lewis was declined by this time and outpointing the younger fresher (and big) fighter over the distance may not have been easy.

You might be right tho, Lewis did have that superb jab.
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Old 04-03-2012, 08:28 AM   #22
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Default Re: Lewis vs Klitschko what do each need to do to win

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When he faced Mcall who take his shots and he tried to punch with him, he was flattened. When he slugged with Mercer, another guy who take his shots, he fought him to a controversial decision.

Im not confident Lewis ever beats Tyson or Holyfield at their respective best using the same strategies he used later in his career to win fights. It simply wouldnt work with guys that good.
I like Lewis to beat Tyson and Holyfield anytime in their careers. Lewis was multi faceted while Tyson only ever knew one way. It was good enough to beat most great heavyweights but Lewis would be another matter imo. Holyfield at his best would always be a tough fight for anyone ever, period.

Lewis improved post McCall, ironically due to the man that masterminded McCall's sweet little strategy aimed at Lewis weakest link.

Lewis had a tough fight with Mercer, but he was a tough muther and quite a decent fighter when on his game. What heavyweight didn't have some tough unexpected fights? Louis was sat on his arse a few times, Holmes had plenty, Snipes, Weaver, Witherspoon etc. Ali had a couple, Holyfield. One tough fight doesn't maketh the fighter. Most any fighter in history can be criticised via that criteria.
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Old 04-03-2012, 08:44 AM   #23
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Default Re: Lewis vs Klitschko what do each need to do to win

Totally agree that Lewis needs to turn it into a fight. He needs to introduce that uppercut much earlier this time. In the last fight, it started to immediately pay dividends for him.
Lewis would have to get on that neck and uppercut inside.

Vitali would need to basically just do what he did in the last fight. Stay outside and potshot from range. Not get dragged into a brawl, and risk that cut opening up again.
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Old 04-03-2012, 08:51 AM   #24
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Default Re: Lewis vs Klitschko what do each need to do to win

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Originally Posted by JohnThomas1 View Post
Lewis had a tough fight with Mercer, but he was a tough muther and quite a decent fighter when on his game. What heavyweight didn't have some tough unexpected fights? Louis was sat on his arse a few times, Holmes had plenty, Snipes, Weaver, Witherspoon etc. Ali had a couple, Holyfield. One tough fight doesn't maketh the fighter. Most any fighter in history can be criticised via that criteria.
John, I do think the Mercer fight did show one or two flaws (originally said c-h-i-n-k-s but it was edited out) in Lewis' armour.
Lewis for me had gotten used to getting rid of guys with the big punch, and like a lot of guys who can bang tended to rely on that aspect of his game a bit too much in his later years.

For me, he struggled with Mercer simply because Ray was like this block of granite who could take his best shots all day, and come back with his own.
Mercer also had a great (well, very good) jab and Lewis never looked that comfortable fighting guys with good jabs.

In short, guys with great chins and good jabs give Lewis problems. (Imo.)
Those types of guys aren't exactly falling out of trees, but still...Vitali was actually one of those.
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Old 04-03-2012, 08:59 AM   #25
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Default Re: Lewis vs Klitschko what do each need to do to win

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John, I do think the Mercer fight did show one or two flaws (originally said c-h-i-n-k-s but it was edited out) in Lewis' armour.
Lewis for me had gotten used to getting rid of guys with the big punch, and like a lot of guys who can bang tended to rely on that aspect of his game a bit too much in his later years.

For me, he struggled with Mercer simply because Ray was like this block of granite who could take his best shots all day, and come back with his own.
Mercer also had a great (well, very good) jab and Lewis never looked that comfortable fighting guys with good jabs.

In short, guys with great chins and good jabs give Lewis problems. (Imo.)
Those types of guys aren't exactly falling out of trees, but still...Vitali was actually one of those.
You make interesting points. I'll have to watch the fight (Mercer) again, can barely remember it now. I'm confident Lewis at his best rolls Klit, well he did roll him when declined tho Klit improved somewhat after that.
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Old 04-03-2012, 09:50 AM   #26
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Default Re: Lewis vs Klitschko what do each need to do to win

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I like Lewis to beat Tyson and Holyfield anytime in their careers. Lewis was multi faceted while Tyson only ever knew one way. It was good enough to beat most great heavyweights but Lewis would be another matter imo. Holyfield at his best would always be a tough fight for anyone ever, period.

Lewis improved post McCall, ironically due to the man that masterminded McCall's sweet little strategy aimed at Lewis weakest link.

Lewis had a tough fight with Mercer, but he was a tough muther and quite a decent fighter when on his game. What heavyweight didn't have some tough unexpected fights? Louis was sat on his arse a few times, Holmes had plenty, Snipes, Weaver, Witherspoon etc. Ali had a couple, Holyfield. One tough fight doesn't maketh the fighter. Most any fighter in history can be criticised via that criteria.
Lewis showed clear kinks in his game that in my opinion could have been exposed by prime versions of Tyson Holy and even Bowe. Lewis dominated a weak crop of fighters and when he was at his peak the better fighters were past theirs.
Who are the best fighters Lewis faced? Realistically? Mercer, Bruno, Holyfield, Ruddock probably in that order. Fighters like Grant, Tua, Briggs, were hyped up but realistically were one dimensional non threats. Guys that could really fight and expose Lewis didnt have to be great to do it.
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Old 04-03-2012, 09:54 AM   #27
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Default Re: Lewis vs Klitschko what do each need to do to win

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Originally Posted by salty trunks View Post
Lewis showed clear kinks in his game that in my opinion could have been exposed by prime versions of Tyson Holy and even Bowe. Lewis dominated a weak crop of fighters and when he was at his peak the better fighters were past theirs.
Who are the best fighters Lewis faced? Realistically? Mercer, Bruno, Holyfield, Ruddock probably in that order. Fighters like Grant, Tua, Briggs, were hyped up but realistically were one dimensional non threats. Guys that could really fight and expose Lewis didnt have to be great to do it.
Are you saying that an old past prime Lewis could have been exposed by prime all time great heavyweights?

Or are you using that fight to say that Lewis in his prime would have lost to them.

If so looking at the McBride fight Tyson, Neilson fight Holyfeild and a Pukall Bowe that a Vitali fight Lewis does very well and could beat all 3 in a row on the same night.
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Old 04-03-2012, 10:08 AM   #28
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Default Re: Lewis vs Klitschko what do each need to do to win

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You make interesting points. I'll have to watch the fight (Mercer) again, can barely remember it now. I'm confident Lewis at his best rolls Klit, well he did roll him when declined tho Klit improved somewhat after that.
Lewis could never beat Vitali any other way than he did. Hes not winning a boxing match. Lewis could fight and he could box but in my opinion he wasnt great at either, but good enough and multi dimensional enough to know how to approach certain fights and expose his oppponents weaknesses. He was good enough to brawl with the boxers and box the brawlers.

His brawling performances were never that impressive, even in the early parts of his career. His wins over Grant, Golota and Bruno were somewhat poor looking on film from a technical standpoint He starched Ruddock with an off balance telegraphed righthand.
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Old 04-03-2012, 10:14 AM   #29
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Default Re: Lewis vs Klitschko what do each need to do to win

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Are you saying that an old past prime Lewis could have been exposed by prime all time great heavyweights?

Or are you using that fight to say that Lewis in his prime would have lost to them.

If so looking at the McBride fight Tyson, Neilson fight Holyfeild and a Pukall Bowe that a Vitali fight Lewis does very well and could beat all 3 in a row on the same night.
Bowe was just as good as Lewis at brawling. He wouldnt have tried to outbox Vitali from the outside he would have taken the fight right to Vitali just like Lewis did, and looked better doing it.

What Im saying is that Lewis didnt fight anyone in the league of prime versions of Tyson Holyfield and Bowe, and judging by his performances against opposition that werent as good he would have struggled with them and most likely lost. Vitali couldnt fight, Lewis easily exposed that, big deal.

Lewis was far closer to his prime facing Vitali than Tyson against McBride, there is nothing to take from that fight. Lewis did what he had to do against Vitali I didnt think he showed age in that fight, just had to fight in a way he was never that great at.
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Old 04-03-2012, 10:29 AM   #30
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Default Re: Lewis vs Klitschko what do each need to do to win

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Originally Posted by DonBoxer View Post
Are you saying that an old past prime Lewis could have been exposed by prime all time great heavyweights?

Or are you using that fight to say that Lewis in his prime would have lost to them.

If so looking at the McBride fight Tyson, Neilson fight Holyfeild and a Pukall Bowe that a Vitali fight Lewis does very well and could beat all 3 in a row on the same night.
Proper mint post m8.

Lenny Lewis could get off teh sofa now, do a Reggae-Reggae Sauce commercial, And spark out teh 1999 Tyson who barely beat Buffalo Botha, let alone teh featherfisted arm-puncher corpse who made his trainer throw in teh towel VS morbidly obese glass jawed tomato can Bummy MCbride.


Foreman Hooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooook!
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