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Old 04-11-2012, 07:01 PM   #31
Bogotazo
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Default Re: Good Analysis on Cotto vs. Mayweather here.

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Originally Posted by Hitta_Squadup View Post
The only problem with that bogo is Mayweather typically only throws one punch at a time to avoid thus exact strategy, Floyds also very good at getting back on defense after he throws, Floyd is fast & accurate enough with the straight right, lead left hook to discourage Miguel from continuing to use this strategy just as Manny was able too...

Cottos best chance and he will be very successful if he employs the jab get Floyd on the ropes and punishes him there specifically to the body that's the plan he better go with because his timing will not match up with Floyds at all...
But relying on a plan that involves jabbing and getting him to the ropes settles into a rhythm that Floyd can predict. Turning him and then catching him reaching as he pressures is a feasible strategy, especially considering the fact that many assume Floyd will be the aggressor. Cotto can't wait on Floyd to throw with him, he'll get picked apart, but if he can anticipate an offensive rush from Mayweather as he tries to cut off the ring behind a high guard, he can get the better of it.
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Old 04-11-2012, 07:14 PM   #32
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Default Re: Good Analysis on Cotto vs. Mayweather here.

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No. It's not the same thing, saying he hasn't had to make many adjustments is not the same as saying that he can't make adjustments.
Please point out where I said the guy said that Mayweather can't make adjustments. I said that he said that Mayweather doesn't make adjustments. That's the same thing as saying he hasn't made adjustments, which is what you said.
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Old 04-11-2012, 07:18 PM   #33
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Default Re: Good Analysis on Cotto vs. Mayweather here.

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But relying on a plan that involves jabbing and getting him to the ropes settles into a rhythm that Floyd can predict. Turning him and then catching him reaching as he pressures is a feasible strategy, especially considering the fact that many assume Floyd will be the aggressor. Cotto can't wait on Floyd to throw with him, he'll get picked apart, but if he can anticipate an offensive rush from Mayweather as he tries to cut off the ring behind a high guard, he can get the better of it.
I actually think the jab will prove to be counterproductive for Cotto. He has a hard jab, but he leaves himself open when he throws it. I've seen Mayweather counter jabs countless times. Shane didn't even want to throw it because it kept getting countered. He's not the only one that's happened to either.
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Old 04-11-2012, 07:20 PM   #34
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Default Re: Good Analysis on Cotto vs. Mayweather here.

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I actually think the jab will prove to be counterproductive for Cotto. He has a hard jab, but he leaves himself open when he throws it. I've seen Mayweather counter jabs countless times. Shane didn't even want to throw it because it kept getting countered. He's not the only one that's happened to either.
I think it's too valuable of a weapon to dispose of, but I agree that he shouldn't rely on it exclusively. Variation will be key.
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Old 04-11-2012, 07:23 PM   #35
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Default Re: Good Analysis on Cotto vs. Mayweather here.

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Please point out where I said the guy said that Mayweather can't make adjustments. I said that he said that Mayweather doesn't make adjustments. That's the same thing as saying he hasn't made adjustments, which is what you said.
He's made adjustments only against certain fighters with various amount of limitations to challenge his way of fighting. Remember, after Shane Mosley rocked him with that big right hand, he made adjustments by coming foward and timing mosley to get back on the defence but Shane is a very limited boxer who has always had trouble with techical fighters, plus he has no jab and add to the fact that he couldn't pull the trigger anymore, it made things easier for Floyd. This time it's different because Cotto already beat a fresher and faster shane mosley and Cotto is more experienced, and doesn't have the same habits he had before.(plus he has a good trainer, something he's never had until he hired Stewart but has the right trainer in Diaz to add to it) I'm anxious to see how Floyd deals with a fighter that also knows to adjust well in a fight and Cotto has shown he can adjust in big fights, except for the Pacquaio fight but there's a lot of theories surrounding that fight, either way Pacquaio gets credit for it and there's always a fighter out there that will have your number, including Mayweather, we just haven't found it yet, maybe May 5th Cotto will be the one, we'll have to wait back and see.
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Old 04-11-2012, 07:27 PM   #36
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Default Re: Good Analysis on Cotto vs. Mayweather here.

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Originally Posted by Bogotazo View Post
I think it's too valuable of a weapon to dispose of, but I agree that he shouldn't rely on it exclusively. Variation will be key.
Shane never had a jab though, even at his best, so I think it's pointless to bring that up. But if you have good timing like Miguel, than you WON'T get timied as much. Timing is everything. All the other intangibles that you've touched are also key. We'll just have to wait see how Mayweather deals with everything Cotto brings to this fight because this is the first time I feel he's gonna have his hands full, it will definetly prove his greatness and nobody will be able to ever question his greatness after this fight depending what happens, because Boxing is the theatre of the unexpected.
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Old 04-11-2012, 07:28 PM   #37
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Default Re: Good Analysis on Cotto vs. Mayweather here.

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He's made adjustments only against certain fighters with various amount of limitations to challenge his way of fighting. Remember, after Shane Mosley rocked him with that big right hand, he made adjustments by coming foward and timing mosley to get back on the defence but Shane is a very limited boxer who has always had trouble with techical fighters, plus he has no jab and add to the fact that he couldn't pull the trigger anymore, it made things easier for Floyd. This time it's different because Cotto already beat a fresher and faster shane mosley and Cotto is more experienced, and doesn't have the same habits he had before.(plus he has a good trainer, something he's never had until he hired Stewart but has the right trainer in Diaz to add to it) I'm anxious to see how Floyd deals with a fighter that also knows to adjust well in a fight and Cotto has shown he can adjust in big fights, except for the Pacquaio fight but there's a lot of theories surrounding that fight, either way Pacquaio gets credit for it and there's always a fighter out there that will have your number, including Mayweather, we just haven't found it yet, maybe May 5th Cotto will be the one, we'll have to wait back and see.
Well, if Cotto's plan is to play a game of chess with Mayweather and out think him, I think he'll get checkmated. It should be interesting though. Both are champions and probably future HOFers. The fight is only a few weeks away. I can't wait.
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Old 04-11-2012, 07:28 PM   #38
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Default Re: Good Analysis on Cotto vs. Mayweather here.

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I actually think the jab will prove to be counterproductive for Cotto. He has a hard jab, but he leaves himself open when he throws it. I've seen Mayweather counter jabs countless times. Shane didn't even want to throw it because it kept getting countered. He's not the only one that's happened to either.
shane doesn't have a jab. cotto drops and hurts guys with his jab. i agree with bogotazo...he'll have to mix it up.
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Old 04-11-2012, 07:35 PM   #39
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Default Re: Good Analysis on Cotto vs. Mayweather here.

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shane doesn't have a jab. cotto drops and hurts guys with his jab. i agree with bogotazo...he'll have to mix it up.

Marquez has an excellent jab. It was countered several times by Mayweather. It's not about how hard Cotto's jab is, it's about the ability to counter it. He's probably not going to be able to land solid many times with that jab anyway. Against Mayweather, he'll need to use it in order to setup his power punches. However, the way he throws it leaves him open to counter shots. If that happens too many times, he'll get gun shy and then he'll be in some real trouble.
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Old 04-11-2012, 07:41 PM   #40
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Default Re: Good Analysis on Cotto vs. Mayweather here.

saw this one before

best part was when he mentioned timing

nothing really insightful
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Old 04-11-2012, 07:41 PM   #41
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Default Re: Good Analysis on Cotto vs. Mayweather here.

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Marquez has an excellent jab. It was countered several times by Mayweather. It's not about how hard Cotto's jab is, it's about the ability to counter it. He's probably not going to be able to land solid many times with that jab anyway. Against Mayweather, he'll need to use it in order to setup his power punches. However, the way he throws it leaves him open to counter shots. If that happens too many times, he'll get gun shy and then he'll be in some real trouble.
I don't think Marquez's Jab is as good as Cotto's though. Cotto landed his jab more frequently on Pacquaio more than Marquez did(were talking just jab though, not the all the other intangibles that they utilized against Pacquaio) and Marquez didn't come up in weight the right way when he fought Floyd. I think Floyd would of still won because of the styles but it would of been a little more competitive than that.
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Old 04-11-2012, 07:55 PM   #42
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Default Re: Good Analysis on Cotto vs. Mayweather here.

in no way am i comparing floyd and roy....cause we all know when roys athletcism went ...roy went.....floyd is a different animal who doesnt have to rely on the athleticism.....

but floyd got sloppy with the left hook against shane....he missed it and shane caught him with the bomb......same thing happened to roy against tarver....
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Old 04-11-2012, 08:05 PM   #43
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Default Re: Good Analysis on Cotto vs. Mayweather here.

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Originally Posted by BigReg View Post
Marquez has an excellent jab. It was countered several times by Mayweather. It's not about how hard Cotto's jab is, it's about the ability to counter it. He's probably not going to be able to land solid many times with that jab anyway. Against Mayweather, he'll need to use it in order to setup his power punches. However, the way he throws it leaves him open to counter shots. If that happens too many times, he'll get gun shy and then he'll be in some real trouble.
i understand that. it's very counterable when he throws it with power. (is that a word?) but he knows how to mix it up well. i don't think cotto will shell up if one thing isn't working. i can see him trying something different like i said in the other thread. he does have a pretty big bag of tricks himself.
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Old 04-11-2012, 08:12 PM   #44
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Default Re: Good Analysis on Cotto vs. Mayweather here.

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I don't think Marquez's Jab is as good as Cotto's though. Cotto landed his jab more frequently on Pacquaio more than Marquez did(were talking just jab though, not the all the other intangibles that they utilized against Pacquaio) and Marquez didn't come up in weight the right way when he fought Floyd. I think Floyd would of still won because of the styles but it would of been a little more competitive than that.
come to think of it...i don't recall anyone ever taking cotto's jab away. on the flip side...floyd does have a great right hand when he uses it. eager to see this play out. also...don't sleep on cotto's own counter hook off the right. floyd does a great job of smothering to take the counter away when he throws that right. i can't recall him facing anyone with a left on cotto's level. dlh had a bad elbow going in to their fight so he doesn't count.
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Old 04-11-2012, 08:17 PM   #45
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Default Re: Good Analysis on Cotto vs. Mayweather here.

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Originally Posted by daprofessor View Post
come to think of it...i don't recall anyone ever taking cotto's jab away. on the flip side...floyd does have a great right hand when he uses it. eager to see this play out. also...don't sleep on cotto's own counter hook off the right. floyd does a great job of smothering to take the counter away when he throws that right. i can't recall him facing anyone with a left on cotto's level. dlh had a bad elbow going in to their fight so he doesn't count.
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ui-7QZLuDD0[/ame]
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