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Old 05-14-2012, 04:42 PM   #46
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Default Re: Hearns vs Mayweather

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Originally Posted by knockout artist View Post
I agree with him up to this point



Now this is as retarded as it comes, Hearns was able to outbox Ray Leonard on the back-foot! At 147 he had great mobility and foot speed.



Hearns faded against Leonard because he had to fight 15 rounds! In a 12 round fight he would have beaten Ray Leonard! He came into that fight drained, have weighed 145 at a time when you weighed in on the day of the fight. Imagine if he had the luxury of weighing in the day before, then having 36 hours to rehydrate and regain his strength!




He did need space to work, thankfully he had a 78 inch reach! Predictable? He went from the aggressor, to outboxing Sugar Ray Leonard on the backfoot! Look at his fight against Benitez, then look at his fight with Duran, Tommy was not predictable!



Just stop right there, no ****ing way Floyd starts backing Hearns up! Floyd ran away all night from feather fisted Baldomir and Ricky Hatton! Floyd runs away all night from Hearns. No way he walks towards a skillful boxer with that kind of height, reach and power.





Mayweather reach 72 inches
Leonards reach 74 inches
Hearns reach 78 inches


Tell me how he effectively counters someone who has a 6 inch reach advantage, and will fight him at range? Take into consideration that Money May is feather fisted at 147, he isn't gonna hurt Hearns even if he lands. Floyd won't come on strong, he'll be grateful to still be conscious going down the stretch. Tommy still managed to floor the bigger Benitez, another defensive wizard, when Tommy had a broken hand.

That guy must be trolling, surely.
Great post.

**** it, the Kalule that Leonard had to get rid of he was that much of a niusance, beats Floyd over 12. No way does Floyd come on strong enough to get rid of The Great Ugandan, and Kalule's style would give Floyd fits IMO and allow Kalule to take centre ring. Floyd would find a spot for his straight rights, but Kalule would find his counters as well.
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Old 05-14-2012, 04:47 PM   #47
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Originally Posted by Spearmint Rhino View Post
Leonard probably doesn't get his dues for that win, in terms of what he had to overcome and produce to pull it off.

It's probably the best win ever, by any fighter.... though Frazier over Ali probably runs it close.

A taller opponent with long arms, with ridiculous skills and punching power.... worn down and stopped in the 14th.

For all I don't like Leonard the man, what you've got to give him is that he always tried to close the show, rather than coasting to the cards.
If only it had been a 12 rounder....

Fraziers win against Ali has nothing on it IMHO. Ali took the fight a couple of fights too soon after being out of the game for 3 years. Great win but not up there with Leonard-Hearns, Robinson-Gavilan etc (IMHO!!!!!)
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Old 05-14-2012, 04:53 PM   #48
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Default Re: Hearns vs Mayweather

What frustrates me with Floyd is that he always leaves you wanting more, sometimes he only does half a job.

Marquez and Mosley should both have been done inside the 12, Zab probably would have been but for the low blow.... and perhaps even Oscar too.

As brilliant as he undoubtedly is, and as much as power/KO's aren't everything, when a fighter is carrying an opponent it's not particularly impressive.

Pac did it against Margarito when he could have got shot of him, might have put the brakes on his now apparent decline by doing so
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Old 05-14-2012, 04:53 PM   #49
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Default Re: Hearns vs Mayweather

The 12 round argument is a bit misleading. It suggests Leonard ONLY won because Hearns got tired. If the fight had been shorter, he might have taken different risks.
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Old 05-14-2012, 04:58 PM   #50
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Default Re: Hearns vs Mayweather

Great fighters pace fights. A lot of 15 rounders that the greats won in round 14, they would have won in round 11 in a 12 rounder.
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Old 05-14-2012, 04:58 PM   #51
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Default Re: Hearns vs Mayweather

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Originally Posted by Spearmint Rhino View Post
Leonard probably doesn't get his dues for that win, in terms of what he had to overcome and produce to pull it off.

It's probably the best win ever, by any fighter.... though Frazier over Ali probably runs it close.

A taller opponent with long arms, with ridiculous skills and punching power.... worn down and stopped in the 14th.

For all I don't like Leonard the man, what you've got to give him is that he always tried to close the show, rather than coasting to the cards.
I can't count that as the best win ever. Ray was comfortably outboxed all night. I think he won the first 6 rounds, and forms 9, 10, 11 and 12.

Duran's win over Leonard and Fitzsimmons' win over Gentlemen Jim were considerably better and should rank higher IMO
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Old 05-14-2012, 05:00 PM   #52
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Default Re: Hearns vs Mayweather

Both good calls Vano.
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Old 05-14-2012, 05:03 PM   #53
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Default Re: Hearns vs Mayweather

How did this come back up? Jesus I've been called a little boy by someone who calls themselves 'Nipple'! Look someone had to make the Mayweather argument for the piece and I was that someone. I'm not convinced he would win but I believe I put forward a plausible argument. I couldn't care less if people believe that or not or if they agree with my logic or not. It was written in good faith and sound mind plus no one can say with absolute certainty who'd have won. And Vano, why do you wish someone had shown you this before you left? You'd have done what exactly, said five words that day instead of the usual four? Mate you need to learn about burning bridges. I couldn't give a rat's ass what you say about me but BN invited you into their team and you have repaid them by misrepresenting them on here. You can put it down to the recklessness of youth but it's ludicrously self-defeating; you had a golden opportunity there, a way in and it's a shame you didn't realise.
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Old 05-14-2012, 05:11 PM   #54
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Default Re: Hearns vs Mayweather

Bloody hell Dan, that was a bit much mate.

I wish someone would have shown me that because we could have had a debate about it and I would have pointed out exactly why Hearns knocks him out within 6 rounds.

To say I've misrepresented boxing news is ludicrous. I was the one hyping the 100 greatest boxers edition a complete month before it hit the stores, and said it was a must buy! Even when I completely disagreed with certain placements. Dig through my post history and find one bad word i said about you, Tris, Nick, or anyone for that matter. In fact, I was massively greatful to the guys for allowing me access to their archives, and have said it many times. I even came on here like a kid at christmas sharing pictures I found interesting. And I've misrepresented them? Damn, I even sponsored you 20 quid (almost half a weeks wage I received for my work at BN) for your charity walk
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Old 05-14-2012, 05:12 PM   #55
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Default Re: Hearns vs Mayweather

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Originally Posted by Vano-Irons View Post
I can't count that as the best win ever. Ray was comfortably outboxed all night. I think he won the first 6 rounds, and forms 9, 10, 11 and 12.

Duran's win over Leonard and Fitzsimmons' win over Gentlemen Jim were considerably better and should rank higher IMO
Considering the stylistic disadvantage Leonard was at, I think that gives it some extra weight. You seem a little derisive of Leonard - a little while ago you made the bizarre argument that if you took away his best wins he wouldn't be so great. Bit of a "No shit, Sherlock" for ay fighter, that one.
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Old 05-14-2012, 05:14 PM   #56
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Default Re: Hearns vs Mayweather

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Originally Posted by Flea Man View Post
Great post.

**** it, the Kalule that Leonard had to get rid of he was that much of a niusance, beats Floyd over 12. No way does Floyd come on strong enough to get rid of The Great Ugandan, and Kalule's style would give Floyd fits IMO and allow Kalule to take centre ring. Floyd would find a spot for his straight rights, but Kalule would find his counters as well.

Floyd's very beatable at 147-154. He's just done well to stay away from the likes of Paul Williams. If you look at the opponents he's faced at 147-154, ODLH started his career at 135, was 34 years old and clearly years past his prime. Mosley started at 135, was 38 years old and years past his prime. Marquez was prime at 126, he had no business at 147, Hatton's prime was at 140. I'm not saying that Floyd has ducked or cherry picked, but that he hasn't really faced a legit, prime A grade fighter who was a natural or big WW.
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Old 05-14-2012, 05:14 PM   #57
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Default Re: Hearns vs Mayweather

If someone told me to write an article on how Floyd could beat Hearns I'd down tools and go on strike [Gaz/Icemax will say something about this].

It's just not possible, and I'd not want to compromise my reputation as a writer/historian etc by writing such a piece.
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Old 05-14-2012, 05:15 PM   #58
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Default Re: Hearns vs Mayweather

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Originally Posted by Vano-Irons View Post
I can't count that as the best win ever. Ray was comfortably outboxed all night. I think he won the first 6 rounds, and forms 9, 10, 11 and 12.

Duran's win over Leonard and Fitzsimmons' win over Gentlemen Jim were considerably better and should rank higher IMO
Wasn't Fitzsimmons comfortably outboxed in his win over Corbett, as well?
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Old 05-14-2012, 05:15 PM   #59
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Default Re: Hearns vs Mayweather

Yeah, I gotta' say Vano hasn't been involved in this at all.

Renegade, this is all light-hearted jostling. No one really dislikes you or doesn't respect your opinion, you're one of my favourite tweeters.

The whole part about 'someone had to do the Mayweather side' of course you were doing your job, not idly typing on a forum debating like we are.

Again, Vano even tried to stick up for you until Kosaros posted your piece. He barely dissected it, I think you are being a bit harsh.

Also, do you have spies on here or do you come on and search your own name? Jus' sayin'....
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Old 05-14-2012, 05:17 PM   #60
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Default Re: Hearns vs Mayweather

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Originally Posted by dftaylor View Post
Considering the stylistic disadvantage Leonard was at, I think that gives it some extra weight. You seem a little derisive of Leonard - a little while ago you made the bizarre argument that if you took away his best wins he wouldn't be so great. Bit of a "No shit, Sherlock" for ay fighter, that one.
I'm not a massive Leonard fan as you can probably tell. I made that point, as many of Ray's wins were damn close. He lost to Duran clearly IMO, was outboxed by Hearns for large parts, and some felt he was lucky against Hagler.

Of course it's all ifs and buts, and Ray managed to win those fights (duran in the rematch), but I'm not as convinced as others are on him, even if he is in my top 15 all time
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