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Old 05-28-2012, 06:59 AM   #31
Stoo
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Default Re: JDS v Fedor

He's clearly the GOAT beating well rounded fighters like Carwin, Mur and Nelson. It's inpossable to suggest that a fighter who was champ 6 years ago could compete with the guys of today as they have ''evolved'' The guys back in the day in PRIDE were all roided up cheats, where as today we have Carwin, Big Foot and The Reem riding high in the top 10

JDS is so good he's dominating the division with decent TDD and basic boxing fundermantals

Cain > Big Foot > Fedor, you cant **** with that logic.
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Old 05-28-2012, 07:06 AM   #32
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Default Re: JDS v Fedor

I will hold you to this in another few months...
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Old 05-28-2012, 07:12 AM   #33
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Default Re: JDS v Fedor

JDS is clearly shot now too. Mur's face would have smashed his glass hands to smtherines

You dont repeadedly punch Mur in the face and then win your next fight. The only exception to this rule is Brock. But Mur tried a different tactic with him, and you all know the story about his glass intestines dont ya

JDS will lose the belt in his next fight
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Old 05-28-2012, 09:33 AM   #34
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Default Re: JDS v Fedor

Quote:
Originally Posted by James23 View Post
So Prime Fedor is when he was winning...

Now that he's losing he's no longer in his prime.

I have that right, yes? Okay, so glad we've ruled out the possibility that he's simply not as good as the guys he's fighting, phew. It's not that, clearly, he's just past his prime.

Yay for mental gymnastics!
Do some research before posting such stupidity.

Before the modern UFC, Fedor ruled the Price fighting championships & he beat everyone who was anyone, some more than once. Pride allowed soccer kicks and knees to the head of a downed opponent, UFC does not. Those differences as well as others may be the reason most former Pride fighters don't fare nearly as well under the UFC octogon rules. Strikeforce rules are much closer to the UFC than the Pride format. Combine that with the fact that Fedor already had a lot of mileage on his "prime" and it's really no surprise he isn't quite as good as he used to be. Same can be said for Crocop and many others............
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Old 05-28-2012, 09:35 AM   #35
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Default Re: JDS v Fedor

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Originally Posted by kel View Post
The guy that got destroyed by Werdum, Big Foot and Hendo before reaching 35yrs of age..............

JDS would beat Fedor senseless
Ridiculous conclusion.
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Old 05-28-2012, 10:28 AM   #36
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Default Re: JDS v Fedor

Fedor's success had a lot to do with his athleticism. Fedor's athleticism made up for some of the technical holes in his game. Fedor's background in Combat Sambo gave him familiarity in every range of fighting, and made him an expert in throws. Fedor's speed allowed him to close the distance against better strikers, and his was able to keep them off balance once he go inside. Fedor had enough submission knowledge and explosiveness to deal with wrestlers. This explosiveness and submission defense also allowed him to have success against a bjj stylist like Nogueira.

Once his speed started to decline, his record went on the decline as well. No one is as athletic approaching their mid 30's as they were in their 20's.

As almost anyone that watched Fedor's fight with Arlovski knows Dos Santos has a style that could present Fedor with a lot of problems. I would probably make Dos Santos the favorite in a head to head match-up with Fedor.

Dos Santos is still behind Fedor in terms of overall achievement. Fedor's record has a lot of filler, but the fights against Nogueira and Cro Cop are what separates him from everyone else. Cro Cop was a world class striker that was beating almost anyone outside of Nogueira and Fedor. Cro Cop was 3-0 against Barnett. Fedor also defeated Cro Cop in a ring. The ring is a preferred place for strikers as there is no cage to press them up against. Nogueira was defeating anyone that wasn't Fedor. Fedor dominated Cro Cop and Nogueira.

There is still time for Dos Santos to eclipse Fedor in an all time sense. It took Fedor close to 30 fights to build his reputation. Dos Santos only has 16, and he is already in the running.
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Old 05-28-2012, 11:07 AM   #37
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Default Re: JDS v Fedor

Fedya.
JDS is all ufc hype.
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Old 05-28-2012, 11:22 AM   #38
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Default Re: JDS v Fedor

Quote:
Originally Posted by kel View Post
The guy that got destroyed by Werdum, Big Foot and Hendo before reaching 35yrs of age..............
You mean the guy that went 16-0-1nc in PRIDE including wins over 2 K1 champs, 2 world class wrestlers, a UFC tournament finalist, a UFC tournament winner, and 2 of the best mma heavyweights ever?

I use to get so sick of Fedor being declared the automatic winner vs any proposed opponent by any method he chose, but deniers of his legacy are equally as annoying.
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Old 05-28-2012, 12:14 PM   #39
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Default Re: JDS v Fedor

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Originally Posted by Beekeeper View Post
Stoo, you starting this thread exposes you for the revisionist anti-fedor crypto-danawhitist that you really are.

For some people here, the win streak does not have enough quality opponents, yet they fail to mention this other higher quality win streak that was more impressive and lasted longer.

They question whether Fedor was past his prime by starting to lose fights later in his career, like the Werdum loss, who they conveniently forget was in Pride AT THE SAME ****ING TIME AND DIVISION AS FEDOR, and with much less success at that time.

Alas, so tell me where I am wrong here?
The legend has returned!
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Old 05-28-2012, 12:23 PM   #40
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Default Re: JDS v Fedor

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Originally Posted by RUSKULL View Post
Do some research before posting such stupidity.

Before the modern UFC, Fedor ruled the Price fighting championships & he beat everyone who was anyone, some more than once. Pride allowed soccer kicks and knees to the head of a downed opponent, UFC does not. Those differences as well as others may be the reason most former Pride fighters don't fare nearly as well under the UFC octogon rules. Strikeforce rules are much closer to the UFC than the Pride format. Combine that with the fact that Fedor already had a lot of mileage on his "prime" and it's really no surprise he isn't quite as good as he used to be. Same can be said for Crocop and many others............
Research, huh? Perhaps you mean watching all 68 PrideFC Events? Seeing every single PrideFC Fight? Did you even know there were 68 PrideFC Events? Maybe there isn't, maybe I just made that number up. Here, I'll let you count:

[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

I know exactly what I'm talking about, I'm talking about the mental gymnastics guys like you do. Your silly little post only further proves my point.
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Old 05-28-2012, 01:56 PM   #41
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Default Re: JDS v Fedor

The shit spouted about Fedor is laughable, we could go all day about this but a little dose of your own Medicne Arlovski who Fedor knocked out BRUTALLY...Knocked out a certain Iron chinned Roy Nelson...JDS, Mir, Werdum coudlnt knock him out, and he has but whipped alot of other UFC heavies.


Cormier a top 5 heavy could only beat Monson by points, the same as an old Fedor.


No man is invincible...Fedor was the main man for 7 years and 4 months....lets see this longevity with others first.
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Old 05-28-2012, 02:04 PM   #42
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Default Re: JDS v Fedor

Damn, just realised Beekeeper posted for the 1st time in months and I didn't mention Aoki v Alvarez
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Old 05-28-2012, 10:44 PM   #43
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Default Re: JDS v Fedor

Quote:
Originally Posted by James23 View Post
Just for reference, I don't see Fedor as a bad fighter, I think he's an absolutely fantastic fighter but the idolization he gets, nearly to the point of deification, is plainly absurd.

30 + wins in a row is amazingly impressive, of course, but how many of those wins were truly against top competition? Certainly not 30. Similar to Floyd's record in boxing. 43-0? (Correct me if I'm mistaken) Impressive, of course, but perhaps 9 or 10 of them are against truly elite level competition? And perhaps even that is being generous. Of course everyone has to work their way up to the point of being elite level fighters themselves but that doesn't erase the fact of competition level assessment in a fighters record. Moreover, Fedor had truly questionable opposition when he was considered the top Heavyweight in the world. Having tough fights against Middleweights and nearly losing by submission to a kickboxer (you could even throw in the fact that he was losing the fight to a mediocre fighter at best in Brett Rogers (took me a second to even think of his name) before a wild overhand) doesn't look great when assessing the strength of a fighter relative to other fighters who are effectively flawless in their performances against consistant top ranked competition.

He certainly deserves to go down in the hypothetical MMA Hall of Fame, clearly, but saying that "in his prime" he would have beat absoltuely anyone, or even have been the statistical favorite to do so is just absurd. And now that he's losing I'm simply pointing out the delusional thinking of his worshippers as I did in the following post:



By this same standard we can assume Matt Hughes fell out of his prime just after losing to GSP at UFC 65 (or UFC 79) because he did start to lose a disproportionate amount of fights after that, relative to the amount he was winning prior to those fights. I'm absolutely sure there are other examples but I don't particularly have the inclination to do the mental work to figure out a perfectly analogus example and Matt Hughes, while not a perfect parallel, works well enough for someone who isn't truly splitting hairs. Merely to attempt to illustrate the point.

Fedor is a fantastic fighter, a Hall of Fame caliber fighter, but the best in the history of the sport and someone who would be, at least, the favorite to beat anyone in the sport today (or anytime in the last 3-5 years)? I simply do not see it.
Good post.

I think the fanboy's line of reasoning pretty much boils down to:

1) Cro-cop is the best striker ever and Fedor beat him. Therefore Fedor beats all strikers.

2) Big Nog is the best BJJ guys ever and Fedor beat him. Therefore Fedor beats all BJJ/ground guys.

Between those two categories, Fedor has it covered. He beats everybody who has ever competed, every time.

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Old 05-29-2012, 01:19 AM   #44
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Default Re: JDS v Fedor

Prime Fedor versus Current JDS. I would still give Fedor the edge, slightly.

Current Fedor versus Current JDS. I give JDS the edge by a wide margin.
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Old 05-29-2012, 10:11 PM   #45
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Default Re: JDS v Fedor

Quote:
Originally Posted by James23 View Post
So Prime Fedor is when he was winning...

Now that he's losing he's no longer in his prime.

I have that right, yes? Okay, so glad we've ruled out the possibility that he's simply not as good as the guys he's fighting, phew. It's not that, clearly, he's just past his prime.

Yay for mental gymnastics!
F'n hilarious an OBVIOUS MMA NOOB.. Respect the GOAT.. If u watched MMA for more than 4 years u would know how stupid u sound..
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