Pacquiao or Mayweather...who exceeded our expectations more?

[AnotherFan]

Originally Posted by Bladegunner

I know I am correct

Pac has not accomplished more than floyd did, only a guy looking at it with pactard eyes will suggest this.

It like saying pac has won more titles at different weight is achieving more. I can easily counter this and say floyd has never lost in any weightclass he has competed in, pac has lost at flyweight, super featherweight and some would go as far as saying he also lost at WW

Is it beyond question to say it is subjective?

I rate Floyd above Pac, due to better performences, but I still think Pacs resume has more depth. Overachieving I think it is called.

How much you value an undefeated record is subjective as well. Is Floyd and Calzaghe undefeated because they are bloody good, or because they were a bit weary about who they fought and when? Only a fanboy would pretend there are completly unbiased, objective answers to this question.

[turbotime]

Mayweather, he's caught up while Pacquiao hasn't fought a legit title holder or ranked fighter without an advantage since Hatton, and should have lost to Marquez.

[puga_ni_nana]

Originally Posted by turbotime

Mayweather, he's caught up while Pacquiao hasn't fought a legit title holder or ranked fighter without an advantage since Hatton, and should have lost to Marquez.

so are you saying that pac was leading before and floyd just caught up?

and this is what i'm saying about floyd with people's expectations for him subsiding. floyd fighting guys that he was supposed to be fighting years ago, and he gets monstrous credit. pac fighting the same opponents like mosley, cotto and add the other relevant WWs like margarito and clottey while he was just in his 2nd/3rd year as a WW and people discredits it. floyd took 5 to 6 years to fight these elite WWs and he gets bigger credit when he was supposed to be fighting them welters.

[turbotime]

Originally Posted by puga_ni_nana

so are you saying that pac was leading before and floyd just caught up?

and this is what i'm saying about floyd with people's expectations for him subsiding. floyd fighting guys that he was supposed to be fighting years ago, and he gets monstrous credit. pac fighting the same opponents like mosley, cotto and add the other relevant WWs like margarito and clottey while he was just in his 2nd/3rd year as a WW and people discredits it. floyd took 5 to 6 years to fight these elite WWs and he gets bigger credit when he was supposed to be fighting them welters.

Yeah definitely, Floyd just caught up. to be honest I didn't think we'd ever see him fighting elite fighters after the Hatton bout because he went into retirement, but since then he's fought and beaten 4 top 3 or higher ranked titlists.

If Pac had beaten Mosley before Mayweather (he had the chance in 2009, but didn't take the fight) I think he'd have been better.

[puga_ni_nana]

Originally Posted by turbotime

Yeah definitely, Floyd just caught up. to be honest I didn't think we'd ever see him fighting elite fighters after the Hatton bout because he went into retirement, but since then he's fought and beaten 4 top 3 or higher ranked titlists.

If Pac had beaten Mosley before Mayweather (he had the chance in 2009, but didn't take the fight) I think he'd have been better.

pac has beaten cotto way earlier and people gives bigger credit to floyd even if it was just pac's 2nd fight at WW (3rd fight above 135) and cotto closer to his prime. this proves that since we are not used to see floyd fighting elite match-ups at the higher weights, he gets more credit now than pac is getting.

[turbotime]

Originally Posted by puga_ni_nana

pac has beaten cotto way earlier and people gives bigger credit to floyd even if it was just pac's 2nd fight at WW (3rd fight above 135) and cotto closer to his prime. this proves that since we are not used to see floyd fighting elite match-ups at the higher weights, he gets more credit now than pac is getting.

Nah I give Pac more credit for beating Cotto, but the fact is he still took the easier option at the time against Cotto at a catchweight when they turned down a shot at the real title against Mosley.

[puga_ni_nana]

Originally Posted by turbotime

Nah I give Pac more credit for beating Cotto, but the fact is he still took the easier option at the time against Cotto at a catchweight when they turned down a shot at the real title against Mosley.

it would be worse since mosley actually agreed to fight for pac's 140 ring title. and we all knew what happened to mosley after the margarito win. at his age, he is spiraling down fast. at the end of the day, pac's team picked a better opponent that would reflect more to his legacy, especially that cotto has done well after that while mosley succumbed to father time.

[VivaNazVegas]

Originally Posted by puga_ni_nana

it would be worse since mosley actually agreed to fight for pac's 140 ring title. and we all knew what happened to mosley after the margarito win. at his age, he is spiraling down fast. at the end of the day, pac's team picked a better opponent that would reflect more to his legacy, especially that cotto has done well after that while mosley succumbed to father time.

He retired

[turbotime]

Originally Posted by puga_ni_nana

it would be worse since mosley actually agreed to fight for pac's 140 ring title. and we all knew what happened to mosley after the margarito win. at his age, he is spiraling down fast. at the end of the day, pac's team picked a better opponent that would reflect more to his legacy, especially that cotto has done well after that while mosley succumbed to father time.

No they were agreeing to fight at 143 for Mosley's real title, and Pac's team ran.

[puga_ni_nana]

Originally Posted by turbotime

No they were agreeing to fight at 143 for Mosley's real title, and Pac's team ran.

and fighting mosley at 143 is better? and you probably missed the part where mosley was willing to get down at 140 to have a payday with pac. as i said pac's team amde the better choice of opponent than that version of mosley.

[turbotime]

Originally Posted by puga_ni_nana

and fighting mosley at 143 is better? and you probably missed the part where mosley was willing to get down at 140 to have a payday with pac. as i said pac's team amde the better choice of opponent than that version of mosley.

So the Mosley that just got done smashing Margarito and was listed as top 4 P4P is lesser of an opponent than a guy Margarito just smashed?

[puga_ni_nana]

Originally Posted by turbotime

So the Mosley that just got done smashing Margarito and was listed as top 4 P4P is lesser of an opponent than a guy Margarito just smashed?

considering that he is about 38 that time, coupled with about a year of inactivity and seeing his performance in his last 3 fights now (not to mention that cotto was prime and has a win over him), pac's team made a better choice of opponent for his legacy than that version of mosley at 140 pounds.

[turbotime]

Originally Posted by puga_ni_nana

considering that he is about 38 that time, coupled with about a year of inactivity and seeing his performance in his last 3 fights now (not to mention that cotto as prime and has a win over him), pac's team made a better choice of opponent for his legacy than that version of mosley at 140 pounds.

A year of inactivity? They were discussing the fight after Pac fought Hatton and wanted to move to welter around June of '09. Mosley just got done fighting Marg at that point.

[puga_ni_nana]

Originally Posted by turbotime

A year of inactivity? They were discussing the fight after Pac fought Hatton and wanted to move to welter around June of '09. Mosley just got done fighting Marg at that point.

nah pac would be fighting around the end of the year so by that time, mosley would be almost one year inactive. not good for an aging fighter. also you seemed to miss my point that mosley was confirmed as shot when he fought floyd, mora and pac himself. cotto at that time is in a much better condition, in his prime, and continued to have success even after losing to pac whcih is better for pac's legacy in hindsight.

[turbotime]

Originally Posted by puga_ni_nana

nah pac would be fighting around the end of the year so by that time, mosley would be almost one year inactive. not good for an aging fighter. also you seemed to miss my point that mosley was confirmed as shot when he fought floyd, mora and pac himself. cotto at that time is in a much better condition, in his prime, and continued to have success even after losing to pac whcih is better for pac's legacy in hindsight.

Cotto was not in his prime. That was stolen by Mosley, Margarito and Clottey and Pac by making Cotto fight at a catchweight even after those hard fights.

Mayweather gets a TON of credit for beating Mosley in a REAL title fight even more than a year after Pac ducked Mosley, so you're wrong in that one.

You must not count Pac's win over Morales for much then right? Since he lost a fight before fighting Pac then retired shortly after.