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Old 07-16-2012, 02:00 PM   #151
bailey
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Default Re: Prime Calzaghe is a H2H Beast

[quote]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loudon View Post
I don't have to mention specific dates though do I? I can do if you want, but that's not the point I was making.

My point was, Joe stayed at 168 and struggled to make weight fighting guys like Reid, Woodhall, Starie etc for decent money, when he could have moved upto 175, and made the weight easier, and fought bigger named fighters for more money, and at the end of the rainbow, was potentially a fight with Roy if he'd have done that.

That's all my point was. When you're as great as Joe was, why fight at 168, when 175 has better fighters, for more money? It's a fair question to ask.
You do have to mention specific dates if you want your point to have any weight.
Did 2005 have a better earning potential LHW division when Tarver was champ and G Johnson was #1 and Erdei was #2?
When at SMW there was 3 undefeated world champs in Calzaghe, Kessler, Lacy and 3 time WBC champ Beyer at 4?
I know which division looks better to me
Other than Jones and Michalczewski, there wasnt better names and better money. The names you mention of Woodhall and Reid did more than Griffin.
Quote:
Unfortunately for Joe, he seemed to be at his peak when the SMW had lost it's great fighters and excitement. When Benn, Eubank, Collins, Roy, Toney and Gerald were there, Joe was too young. Since he's retired, the guys in the Super Six have brought the division back to life so to speak. Ward, Froch, Dirrell, Kessler are good fighters. I think Joe would have had a great chance of winning the super 6.
Calzaghe beat Kessler who beat Froch.
What has Dirrell done? Explain to me how Dirrell has a better resume than Mkertchyan let alone Veit. Do explain
I have shown you how SMW was tougher then than it is now on a previous post showing the year and who was who.
Quote:
All I'm saying is, why wait as long as he did to unify,
Are you dumb . why do you say he waited so long. Ottke wouldnt fight him, didnt want to. So how could he unify?
Reid wouldnt fight him when WBC champ and Woodhall was going to but lost his title.
When champs appeared who would fight him, he fought them
Quote:
when he could have moved up to 175 earlier? In my opinion, if he'd have won a belt at 175, and been a two weight world champ, that would have equaled, or even surpassed unifying the 168 division, under the circumstances.
What would have surpassed winning all of the SMW titles and making a joint record defences and then moving up and beating Hopkins?

Quote:
I haven't missed Eubank, and Mitchell on purpose. I was just asking the question, of why he stayed at 168? when he could have had moved to 175 sooner? The longer he stayed at 168 in europe, the less chance he had of securing a fight with someone like Roy.
All of the best SMWs were in Europe and that was his division.
Did Roy fight Michalczewski? No. Erdei? No. But they were better than Johnson and Tarver
Quote:
I know who's beaten Griffin, Toney, Tarver etc, etc, my point was Joe could have made more money fighting those guys, and he'd have gotten more recognition. It's ok saying he beat Hopkins, who beat Tarver, yes that's a fair point, but he could have beaten Tarver himself, instead of fighting guys like Manfredo to gain U.S. exposure.
Tarver had lost to Hopkins when Calzaghe was hyping the fight by beating Manfredo. What cant you get?
Toney was a CW before Calzaghe even won a world title. Why keep bringing him up?
How could beating nobody Griffin be more money than Eubank, Reid, Woodhall, all big home fights? It wouldnt have been. It wasnt exactly considered a big fight when Johnson or Tarver were fighting Griffin was it!
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Now please answer my question.

You keep posting videos of Joe saying "I chased Roy for 5 or 6 years but he didn't want to know"

So tell me when this was?
Read it again
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Let's discuss it using facts, statements and logic, and you'll see for yourself that he was telling porkies.

In Sept 2002 after Woods, Roy's options were Joe, Tarver and possibly Ruiz. Late 2002 Murad Muhammad gave Roy the news he'd be waiting for. He said the Ruiz fight was on. So Roy at that point had a chance to fight for a version of the heavyweight title. So Roy didn't give Joe a seconds thought and proceded to fight Ruiz.
Dont blam Roy, but thats Roy not Calzaghe
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So Joe wanted Roy in 2002, but Roy opted for Ruiz instead.

In March 2003, Roy fought Ruiz. In Nov of that year, he came back to 175 and had a close fight with Tarver.

So Joe didn't chase Roy throughout 2003. Do you agree?
Calzaghe was always calling him out. Roy opted for Tarver and came unstuck
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In 2004, because of their close first fight, they had a rematch in May. Tarver Knocked him out. Then in Sept Glen Johnson also knocked him out.

So Joe didn't chase Roy throughout any of 2004. Do you agree?
Calzaghe is seen on those videos calling out Jones long before that. It is on the videos, if he just said 5/6 years its just a case of getting times wrong opff the cuff, because the video shows otherwise.
You are looking to make something out to be otherwise because there he is on the Tyson undercard saying otherwise

Quote:
Now correct me if I'm wrong, but the links you've put up in the past, of Joe saying "we chased Roy for 5 or 6 years" are from 2008, I believe? Maybe I'm wrong, but it doesn't really matter what date he said it anyway. The point is, from 2003-2008 Joe didn't chase Roy.
If you asked me some dates I could say 5/6 years to things off memory that could be 8 years etc. He was saying he had called him out for years which was proven, however you want to look at it whilst trying to split hairs
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So he must have been talking about from 2002 and earlier. Yes?

That means, that according to Joe, him and Frank tried to get Roy into the ring between 1997-2002. Now everybody knows that's complete bollocks!
No it isnt. Calzaghe had called for Jones around the Sheika and Woodhall time. I have put the link out about Calzaghe has weighty issue of Jones after Woodhall. Look at my old link
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It's absolutely laughable! We all know that Joe didn't chase Roy in 97, 98, 99, etc, etc.
i remember Calzaghe talking of Jones but couldnt say for sure about 97, 98, 99 but he was calling him out and chasing him from 2000 onwards that I know of and have proven

Quote:
So the links you keep posting from time to time, show that Joe is full of shit!
No they dont, they show that you are resulting in splitting hairs due to facts taking you apart. Even when Calzaghe was beating Woodhall, McIntyre and Sheika the name Jones was called and you have even seen him after a fight saying otherwise to what you are trying to argue.
You self pwned a bit there
Quote:
If you believe him, please tell me what he did to get Roy in the ring in the late 90's.
Beat the best SMWs that would fight him and as you can see in the link on this post. Roy said he was wanting to drop down to SMW. The links there, read it
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Old 07-16-2012, 02:04 PM   #152
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Default Re: Prime Calzaghe is a H2H Beast

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Originally Posted by Loudon View Post
No, I'm sorry I can't counter the points, because it's completely absurd.

If you think Roy was the same in 2008, as what he was in 2000, then you're on mind bending drugs!

In 2000, Roy was 31 years old and was at the top of his game.

Late 2008, Roy was 9 weeks from being 40, and he'd lost his legs, his footspeed, his reflexes, his punch resistance, and his confidence.

He was still a good fighter, but he wasn't good enough to fight the elite guys at world level anymore.

The only similarity bewtween Roy of 2000, and Roy of 2008, was his name, and his fantastic physique that he always had.

I can post a picture of his Trinidad fight, and I can post a picture of his Telesco fight, and they would look pretty similar, but the two different versions of him are worlds apart.

Roy fought Hall in 2000, just a year after he fought Reggie Johnson.

So are we saying that there wasn't any difference between the version of Roy from Reggie in 99, to the version of Roy that fought Trinidad early 2008?

I could go on and on, it's mental!

You think Roy from 2001 against Gonzalez, or Roy from 2002 against Woods, was the same as Roy from the Hanshaw fight?

You're out of your goddamned mind! Ha!
If you cant answer and just say its insane then you really dont have a sensible answer.
Now I do think Roy would have faded between those times, but that was only exposed by levels and I cant see that big a difference and lets not forget Jones failed a test for that fight with Hall
Amazing how all thses people claim Jones was shot yet cant explain the post below.
People say Roy was shot when Calzaghe beat him but show me where he was so different there to when he failed a test against R Hall and where the hand speed was so different. The difference was Jones was facing someone who could match him for speed and had a bit more ring generalship. Hall couldnt close the gaps like Calzaghe also Calzaghes foot movement was causing Jones problems

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XcSVev-wcdI&feature=fvwrel"]You Tube[/ame]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X-1qzWVmGmU"]You Tube[/ame]

No doubt there will be some that say well if you cant tell the difference, but let them explain.
Nobody can tell me the difference in Jones, but you can see the difference between Calzaghe and Hall and that seemed to make a big difference
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Old 07-16-2012, 02:26 PM   #153
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Default Re: Prime Calzaghe is a H2H Beast

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Originally Posted by general zod View Post
Pavlik was willing to move up to face Calzaghe who started making bizarre claims to get out of it and decided to fight a fighter he himself said was shot

Gone over this already. You clearly have not watched Liles-Mitchell and just because you beat Mitchell doesn't not mean you can beat Liles
So you in a previous thread said Liles was shot quite a few fights before Mitchell beat him, in the Ballogou fight, which was before Calzaghe even won a SMW world title, but now think he was a potential fight for Calzaghe where Calzaghe may not have won . You seem to change your point frequently. Get found out and then change it again
Quote:
Johnson was a solid fighter from around Woods I to Dawson II, much better than anyone Calzaghe faced at smw - lhw, which would explain why Calzaghe never faced him
No he wasnt . Johnson split 3 fights with Woods and was badly hurt in their first fight at the end.
You fail to note that Johnson lost the chance to fight Calzaghe when he couldnt beat Woods in their third fight. Calzaghe was ringside onloy for Johnson to lose yet another box off to fight Calzaghe.
The fight was on British TV. What channel did you watch it on Zod?
Do answer that.
Johnson was a journeyman and wasnt better than Lacy who you ridicule
Quote:
Woods back then was a green contender. He really didn't come into his own until he faced Johnson for the IBF belt
This is what I mean about you chopping and changing your mind to suit. So now Woods was green because he lost to Starie who Calzaghe beat, and didnt come into his own when Jones beat him, but a few fights later when he fights Johnson and didnt look good (neither did), he came into his own. Did he come out of his own when he did little against Tarver?
Quote:
Irrelevant.
It was a better fight for Calzaghe than the guys he was fighting at smw
Michalczewski would have been a better fight for most, but unlike Jones, Calzaghe was in a different division and yet the form line still looks good for Calzaghe beating Eubank who beat Rocchigiani who was robbed against Michalczewski.
Did Jones, Johnson or Tarver dare to fight Michalczewski.
Unlike Jones, Calzaghe cleared out the SMW division even if it took a while. Jones never did that at any weight.



Quote:
How does this help you? So Calzaghe did not have to fight Tarver because he beat Jones, who had been beaten twice by Tarver and Hopkins who wouldn't move up to lhw until 2006?
How does it not. Tarver was thrashed by Hopkins and Calzaghe beat Hopkins who thrashed Tarver. Why fight the loser if you can fight the winner? If you cant get the winner, fair enough, but Calzaghe could and did a job
Quote:
I'm talking about when Jones was at his peak, not that guy who was 3-3 in his last 6 fights before facing Calzaghe
You say this yet call double figure losses Johnson a better fighter than who Calzaghe was fighting at SMW when Johnson had lost to Sheika
Quote:
Stop boxrecing
Calzaghe could of fought him if he moved up to lhw earlier
All you have done is try to justify Calzaghe staying in a barren wasteland
Pathetic. this is your excuse for Dawson jumping away from SMW to fight easier comp at LHW only for Dawson to now go back to SMW.
Dawson was holding a WBO belt of sorts at SMW where he could have got a shot at Calzaghe. Dawson vacated the belt and moved away a division, a division he is fighting in next.
Yet you say Calzaghe could have fought him if he moved up sooner , Dawson moved up in 06 and was a nobody whilst Calzaghe had an undefeated SMW champ in Lacy a far bigger name to fight, yet you say fight nobody Dawson. Dawson wins a world title in 07 yet isnt a big name whilst Calzaghe has another undefeated this time unified SMW champ to fight, yet you say fight Dawson.
Pathetic even by your standards Zod
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Old 07-16-2012, 02:31 PM   #154
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Default Re: Prime Calzaghe is a H2H Beast

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Originally Posted by emallini View Post
His combination of workrate,skill,heart,chin and speed would be a nightmare for anyone
yes he is
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Old 07-16-2012, 02:47 PM   #155
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Default Re: Prime Calzaghe is a H2H Beast

Bailey,

Thanks for your reply.

If you think the SMW had better quality, that's fair enough. What I'm saying is, he'd have earnt more money and he'd have got more global recognition, if he'd have fought the likes of Johnson and Tarver. Kessler was his career defining fight. How many people outside of europe do you think were interested in that fight? That fight was not a huge event outside of europe.

My whole argument is Joe saying that he chased Roy. You can't get Roy into the ring if you're fighting european (however good they are) fighters in europe. He says he wanted Roy and he wanted to be well paid, but this was not possible.

Yes in my opinion, if Joe had've left the SMW division and won a belt at 175 from Roy or Tarver, then yes I think that would of eclipsed him unifying the SMW division. Because in my opinion, Tarver and Roy Jones were better fighters than Kessler.

Yes all of the SMW's were in europe, and that was Joe's weght class. That's fair enough, but again you're missing the point. He claims he wanted Roy badly. How was he going to get Roy in the ring by fighting european SMW's, when Roy was an American LHW? There would have been no call for the fight outside of Britain. Do you think the American's watched Calzaghe knock Veit out? He had to make a name Stateside to drum up interest in a fight with Roy. That was his only option of getting the fight.

The point I was making about Manfredo, was that Frank wanted him to take the fight to gain U.S. exposure. But if Joe had've moved up to 175 earlier, he'd have got his U.S. exposure, and he could have fought the likes of Tarver before Hopkins beat him.

Fair enough regaring Toney, but it was an example of 175 fighters who he could have mixed with.

I brought Griffin up, because he was world famous after his fights with Roy for various reasons. Joe could have tried getting fights of this stature in the U.S. and making a name for himself, to potentially land a fight with Roy.

Again Reid and Woodhall were good fighters, and yes they were big fights in Britain. But once again, they didn't make waves in the U.S. If you wanted Roy in the 90's you had to make waves in the U.S. (if you were from another country) or it was a non starter.

When was Joe always calling him out? When? He mentioned his name a few times and continued to fight at SMW in europe. Again he wasn't going to get Roy in the ring by doing that. He had to make sacrifices, such as going to America, and fighting at Roy's weight.

Once again, he's on the Tyson undercard talking about Roy, and then look who he went on to fight. Ricky Hatton could have called Floyd out after every fight, but he ended up going to the U.S. and calling him out, and he moved up to Floyd's weight class.

How is it proven that he called him out for years? Just because he said so? I've already exposed him. He was lying through his teeth. Go and look at the video of him dismissing Roy, that Zod's put up. It's a joke.

Again, How the **** was Joe going to get a fight with Roy, when Roy was trying to unify the 175 division, and Joe was fighting Woodhall at SMW. When Joe was fighting Woodhall, nobody outside of europe knew who he was.

You haven't proven anything regarding Joe chasing Roy. Joe saying he chased him isn't proof. Don't look at what he said, look at what he did, there's your proof.

Beating the best SMW's in the world at home, is not going to get you a fight with an American at LHW is it? They would have had to have given Roy silly money, for him to have dropped back to 168 around that time. He already had an eye on going up to heavy. Frank didn't have the money to bring Roy over here, or down in weight. There wasn't enough money to go around, because Joe also wanted silly money.

Regards, Loudon.
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Old 07-16-2012, 03:00 PM   #156
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Default Re: Prime Calzaghe is a H2H Beast

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Originally Posted by bailey View Post
If you cant answer and just say its insane then you really dont have a sensible answer.
Now I do think Roy would have faded between those times, but that was only exposed by levels and I cant see that big a difference and lets not forget Jones failed a test for that fight with Hall
Amazing how all thses people claim Jones was shot yet cant explain the post below.
People say Roy was shot when Calzaghe beat him but show me where he was so different there to when he failed a test against R Hall and where the hand speed was so different. The difference was Jones was facing someone who could match him for speed and had a bit more ring generalship. Hall couldnt close the gaps like Calzaghe also Calzaghes foot movement was causing Jones problems

[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

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No doubt there will be some that say well if you cant tell the difference, but let them explain.
Nobody can tell me the difference in Jones, but you can see the difference between Calzaghe and Hall and that seemed to make a big difference
Bailey,

Even though I don't agree with a lot of what you say, it's clear that you have a good knowledge of the sport. But when you post up rubbish like this, I can't take you serious, because it has to be a wind up?

You haven't even got a case to debate, because Joe himself has said that Roy was shot. You literally have no argument.

In 2006, Joe himself said that Roy wasn't the same.

Zod has just posted up a video of Joe saying the exact same thing in 2008.

That's it!

The Roy version of Hall was nearly peak.

The Roy version of Calzaghe was nearly 40 years old. He'd suffered two knockout defeats, one of which was a crushing one, that left him out for minutes. He was 3-3 in his last 6 fights, and his reflexes had slowed considerably. His punch resistance had gone, and his legs weren't the same, which affected his once great footwork. Yes he still had his great handspeed, but he couldn't get in and out of range like he used to be able to do. His confidence had also taken a terrible battering.

He still has great handspeed today at 43, but he can't get his shots off.

So how could he have been the same at 40, as what he was when he was the best fighter in the world at 31?

You're being silly!

Do you think the version of Roy, that fought Anthony Hanshaw and Felix Trinidad, was the same version that fought Reggie Johnson in 99, just a year prior to Hall?

Regards, Loudon.
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Old 07-16-2012, 03:09 PM   #157
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Default Re: Prime Calzaghe is a H2H Beast

Bailey,

I've just read your response to Zod.

You call Johnson a journeyman. But 2 or 3 months ago, you started a thread titled "Did Roy Jones start to lose when his competition stepped up"

Glen Johnson wasn't a step up in competition for Roy, you've just admitted as much, that's why it's hard to debate with you.

You've also asked if Roy, Tarver etc dared to face DM?

DM had the WBO belt, and had no intention of leaving Germany. He'd got it cushy. Nobody was going to fight in Germany, when the judging was disgraceful. Some of Ottke's opponents were getting raped by the judges. Also HBO offered DM $5 million to go to the U.S. and he declined on two occasions.

Regards, Loudon.

Last edited by Loudon; 07-16-2012 at 04:05 PM.
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Old 07-16-2012, 03:22 PM   #158
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Calzaghe is the best SMW ever. He beats Hopkins at any stage, stop acting like Joe was in his prime at 37 or whatever.
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Old 07-16-2012, 03:36 PM   #159
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Originally Posted by shanahan14 View Post
Calzaghe is the best SMW ever. He beats Hopkins at any stage, stop acting like Joe was in his prime at 37 or whatever.
Shaz, you are making the classic Calzaghe nuthugger mistake of switching their ages around in your head even though you get them right on paper. It was Bernard that was a lot older than Calzaghe, not the other way round.

And it was Bernard who fought prime opponents when he got older. It was Calzaghe who avoided them when he got older. It wasnt the reverse and its pointless to pretend that the opposite was the case.


These are the two valid points that keep getting raised, and keep getting not just ignored, but REVERSED by Zaghenuthuggers like Bailey and then they label these lies as 'facts'. Its bad enough ignoring facts, but to reverse them is putting you on the same level as the Klithuggers like Vladimir23.

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Old 07-16-2012, 04:07 PM   #160
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Default Re: Prime Calzaghe is a H2H Beast

Bailey,

Roy was exposed by levels? What do you mean?
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Old 07-16-2012, 04:34 PM   #161
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Default Re: Prime Calzaghe is a H2H Beast

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So you in a previous thread said Liles was shot quite a few fights before Mitchell beat him, in the Ballogou fight, which was before Calzaghe even won a SMW world title, but now think he was a potential fight for Calzaghe where Calzaghe may not have won . You seem to change your point frequently. Get found out and then change it again
??????????
I never said he was shot. You are the one who has no idea what shot means. I said he was clearly past prime, by the time he fought Ballagou. When you become a champion your first aim should be to try and unify the division, proving that you are the man in that division. Not just another belt holder.
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Originally Posted by bailey View Post
No he wasnt . Johnson split 3 fights with Woods and was badly hurt in their first fight at the end.
Of course he was a green contender back then. How on earth could he be anywhere near prime when he still building up his confidence and skill set by beating stiffs?
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Originally Posted by bailey View Post
You fail to note that Johnson lost the chance to fight Calzaghe when he couldnt beat Woods in their third fight. Calzaghe was ringside onloy for Johnson to lose yet another box off to fight Calzaghe.
????????
Calzaghe had no problem fighting guys like Mitchell, Brewer, Salam and Woodhall who were coming off recent losses, but Glen loses his chance because he drops a questionable decision to Woods? If Calzaghe was so serious about fighting at lhw then he would of challenged Woods.
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Originally Posted by bailey View Post
The fight was on British TV. What channel did you watch it on Zod?
Do answer that..
Grow up
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Originally Posted by bailey View Post
Johnson was a journeyman and wasnt better than Lacy who you ridicule
This is what I mean about you chopping and changing your mind to suit.
Johnson was a journeymen at smw, but he found his footing at lhw,which is why he was voted Ring fighter 2004 and has wins over Tarver, Woods and Jones(ATG).
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Originally Posted by bailey View Post
So now Woods was green because he lost to Starie who Calzaghe beat, and didnt come into his own when Jones beat him, but a few fights later when he fights Johnson and didnt look good (neither did), he came into his own. Did he come out of his own when he did little against Tarver?
Describe Woods's skill set going into the Jones fight then describe it going into the Johnson fights?
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Originally Posted by bailey View Post
Michalczewski would have been a better fight for most, but unlike Jones, Calzaghe was in a different division and yet the form line still looks good for Calzaghe beating Eubank who beat Rocchigiani who was robbed against Michalczewski.
Triangle theory?
Did Rochh fight a Eubank that had took the fight at 11 days notice and had lost to Collins twice? Styles decide fight outcomes not your bizarre use of triangle theory
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Originally Posted by bailey View Post
Did Jones, Johnson or Tarver dare to fight Michalczewski.
Thats a different topic altogether. we are talking about the fights available for Calzaghe 7 lbs north
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Originally Posted by bailey View Post
Unlike Jones, Calzaghe cleared out the SMW division even if it took a while. Jones never did that at any weight.
Why on earth are you so obsessed with Jones?
For the record Calzaghe never cleared out any division. When the concept of a unified champion was put forward the belts involved were the wbc, ibf and the wba. The wbo wasn't included because it wasnt seen as a legit belt. Calzaghe had the wba, wbc and wbo but not the ibf belt. How on earth can you clear out a division when there is still a fighter in there with a recognized belt?
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Originally Posted by bailey View Post
How does it not. Tarver was thrashed by Hopkins and Calzaghe beat Hopkins who thrashed Tarver. Why fight the loser if you can fight the winner? If you cant get the winner, fair enough, but Calzaghe could and did a job
Tarver arrived on the scene around 2000. If Calzaghe had moved up much sooner then he could of fought him. Instead of seeing this you are again using triangle theory. Foreman beat Frazier who in turn beat Ali and look how Ali-Foreman turned out.
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Originally Posted by bailey View Post
You say this yet call double figure losses Johnson a better fighter than who Calzaghe was fighting at SMW when Johnson had lost to Sheika
A fighters skillset is not a static thing, it is a dynamic thing which can change over time. G.Johnson was a much better fighter at lhw. If you bothered to watch any of his fights then you would know that. Instead you just look at boxrec stats.
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Originally Posted by bailey View Post
Pathetic. this is your excuse for Dawson jumping away from SMW to fight easier comp at LHW only for Dawson to now go back to SMW.
Dawson was holding a WBO belt of sorts at SMW where he could have got a shot at Calzaghe. Dawson vacated the belt and moved away a division, a division he is fighting in next.
Yet you say Calzaghe could have fought him if he moved up sooner , Dawson moved up in 06 and was a nobody whilst Calzaghe had an undefeated SMW champ in Lacy a far bigger name to fight, yet you say fight nobody Dawson. Dawson wins a world title in 07 yet isnt a big name whilst Calzaghe has another undefeated this time unified SMW champ to fight, yet you say fight Dawson.
Pathetic even by your standards Zod
????????
No one knows why Dawson moved up at that point unless you have some inside info then it is foolish to think that the only reason Dawson moved up was because he was scared of calzaghe. He was so scared that he wanted to fight him when Calzaghe became the ring no 1 at lhw, with Calzaghe saying that he was not interested.
I'm terrified of you in 06 but willing to fight you in 08?

Last edited by general zod; 07-17-2012 at 05:20 AM.
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Old 07-16-2012, 04:40 PM   #162
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Default Re: Prime Calzaghe is a H2H Beast

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Originally Posted by bailey View Post
So you now were watching these fights on the internet all these years ago and not on TV. Sounding more suspect and now admitting you havent seen alot of them.
Do you have any idea the amount of fights there are out there? Do you think everyone has the time or energy to watch every fight live? A lot of fights are hard to find which is why I join boxing forums and swap fights. Most of the Liles, Nunn and Toney fights on youtube were uploaded by me. For all the guys who never had the chance to watch them when they originally came on TV. At least I have watched the fights unlike you mr "I only know boxrec and the last few years of boxing on sky sports."

Last edited by general zod; 07-17-2012 at 05:17 AM.
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Old 07-16-2012, 04:44 PM   #163
general zod
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Default Re: Prime Calzaghe is a H2H Beast

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Originally Posted by bailey View Post
Yep but you forget that Veit only ever lost to world champs or fighters who became world champs.
You also dont note that Veits first 2 losses came to Calzaghe before those other guys beat him and that Veit beat Braehmer first time around

The win Calzaghe had over Veit was a very good victory.
The first time Calzaghe beat Veit, Veit was 30-0 and hadnt beaten anyone of real note, hence he was blown away in a round by Calzaghe.
When Calzaghe beat Veit a 2nd time Veit was an accomplished world rated 45-1 interim world champ who had some solid victories behind him, and was top 10 rated.
Veit had beaten undefeated Dziarra who wasnt a great fighter but did go on to beat L Mock and undefeated M Oral who would go on to challenge MW champs A Abraham and S Sylvester recently.
Veit had also beaten beaten undefeated Guerrero for the European union title.
Veit beat future title challenger Salem and Mock.
Veit also beat world rated C Brewer with an educated destructive 9th round KO.
A note on Veit. He only ever lost to world champs or fighters who became world champs and has victories over Mock, Salem, Perdermo (a future Kessler challenger), Brewer when Brewer was world rated and Veit beat undefeated Braehmer who became WBO LHW champ and never lost the title in the ring.
A good Calzaghe victory over a mandatory world class SMW
Also a great away victory for Calzaghe in Germany
When you are forced to start hyping up wins over guys like Veit then you know you are in trouble
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First Calzaghe must make a mandatory defence against German Mario Veit - the type of fight he admitted this weekend he struggles to raise himself for.
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Originally Posted by bailey View Post
Just because Calzaghe was tight at a weight, doesnt mean it doesnt have an impact changing weight divisions. N Benn said he was tight at MW, but reckons it took him a couple of years to really be strong at SMW
Benn never said that and what is your source?

Last edited by general zod; 07-17-2012 at 11:07 AM.
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Old 07-16-2012, 04:46 PM   #164
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Default Re: Prime Calzaghe is a H2H Beast

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Originally Posted by Loudon View Post
Bailey,

I've just read your response to Zod.

You call Johnson a journeyman. But 2 or 3 months ago, you started a thread titled "Did Roy Jones start to lose when his competition stepped up"

Glen Johnson wasn't a step up in competition for Roy, you've just admitted as much, that's why it's hard to debate with you.

You've also asked if Roy, Tarver etc dared to face DM?

DM had the WBO belt, and had no intention of leaving Germany. He'd got it cushy. Nobody was going to fight in Germany, when the judging was disgraceful. Some of Ottke's opponents were getting raped by the judges. Also HBO offered DM $5 million to go to the U.S. and he declined on two occasions.

Regards, Loudon.
Bailey (aka knockout artist aka timeout) is obsessed with Jones.

Last edited by general zod; 07-17-2012 at 11:06 AM.
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