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View Poll Results: Was Ali-Foreman Fixed?
Yes 10 8.33%
No 91 75.83%
Probably 7 5.83%
Probably Not 12 10.00%
Voters: 120. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 04-05-2013, 07:48 AM   #181
lufcrazy
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Default Re: The Fix In The Jungle?

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Originally Posted by BillB View Post
1. Fleischer's involvement in Walcott's call was an absurd excuse. Fleischer had nothing to do with the fight. He was a spectator. Walcott knew that.

2. Liston lay there exactly as long as he should have- until Ali was in a neutral corner. He then immediately got up.
Continuing the fight proved Walcott understood the neutral corner rule.

Why then did he stop the fight five seconds later, and award Ali a KO?
We all know why, nat told him he'd been down over 10 seconds and jersey mistakenly called it off.

I'm sorry but your theory can easily be explained by way of a simple mistake. You want me to believe jersey took a bribe then I'm gonna want more proof.
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Old 04-05-2013, 07:57 AM   #182
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Default Re: The Fix In The Jungle?

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1. Fleischer's involvement in Walcott's call was an absurd excuse. Fleischer had nothing to do with the fight. He was a spectator. Walcott knew that.

2. Liston lay there exactly as long as he should have- until Ali was in a neutral corner. He then immediately got up.
Continuing the fight proved Walcott understood the neutral corner rule.

Why then did he stop the fight five seconds later, and award Ali a KO?

The question you cannot answer is, If Walcott was helping Ali why did he let Liston get up and continue.

He was caught up in the moment.
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Old 04-05-2013, 07:57 AM   #183
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We all know why, nat told him he'd been down over 10 seconds and jersey mistakenly called it off.

I'm sorry but your theory can easily be explained by way of a simple mistake. You want me to believe jersey took a bribe then I'm gonna want more proof.
Walcott already knew Liston had been down over 10 seconds and knew it did not matter how long he had been down. Ali would not go to a neutral corner. Walcott knew there had been no knockout.

Why then did he stop the fight?


BTW- Fleischer denied Walcott's version of what he told him.
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Old 04-05-2013, 08:19 AM   #184
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Default Re: The Fix In The Jungle?

Listen even if the fight was fixed, which I think is bull**** by the way. There was only going to be one winner in that fight, and his name was Muhammad Ali!!!'
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Old 04-05-2013, 08:38 AM   #185
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Default Re: The Fix In The Jungle?

Im gonna play devils advocate here. First off, im of the train of thought that it was all above board, but just for the sake of argument regarding the possibility that Walcott was 'in' on it. Didnt larry holmes say in a book that he was told, or 'advised' by a rather unscrupulous person, to hire jersey joe in one of his training camps??

Or is that bull****?
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Old 04-05-2013, 08:57 AM   #186
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You said it! Just face it Ali was a better fighter than old Sonny boy. Fix or no fix if they both fought it out, Sonny was going to feel one thing, Pain!!
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Old 04-05-2013, 10:29 AM   #187
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Im gonna play devils advocate here. First off, im of the train of thought that it was all above board, but just for the sake of argument regarding the possibility that Walcott was 'in' on it. Didnt larry holmes say in a book that he was told, or 'advised' by a rather unscrupulous person, to hire jersey joe in one of his training camps??

Or is that bull****?
I hadn't heard that, but it may well be true.

Foreman wrote that it was common practice to lay money on the referee to look the other way etc. He paid the Zaire referee $25,000 to not DQ him if he hit Ali on one knee. He said he tended to do that and didn't want to slip up and lose the fight because of it.
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Old 04-05-2013, 11:37 AM   #188
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9 polled state it was a fix. 80 said no


Says it all,imo.
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Old 04-05-2013, 12:08 PM   #189
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Walcott already knew Liston had been down over 10 seconds and knew it did not matter how long he had been down. Ali would not go to a neutral corner. Walcott knew there had been no knockout.

Why then did he stop the fight?


BTW- Fleischer denied Walcott's version of what he told him.

Why do you assume Walcott knew all of these things in the heat of the moment.

I'm a qualified mathematician and when I'm going through questions with my class I can get things like 23x17 wrong and thats not even a great deal of pressure.

This is the heavyweight championship of the world between the current champ and the hardest man in history. That hardest man got dropped in the first by a punch that doesn't look solid until years later when hd footage comes out.

Imagine the panic, confusion and rush, if ever there was to be a mistake it would be in that moment, and guess what? There was a mistake. It's one thing to box and another to ref.

Jersey ****ed up. He never seemed in control and he made a bad mistake. If you wanna believe in some elaborate conspiracy I wanna see proof.
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Old 04-05-2013, 12:28 PM   #190
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Default Re: The Fix In The Jungle?

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9 polled state it was a fix. 80 said no


Says it all,imo.
Yes, the proportion's roughly the same as those who think Barack Obama is the Anti-Christ (or thought it would be funny to say they did, or didn't understand the question).

[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]
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Old 04-05-2013, 12:41 PM   #191
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Originally Posted by lufcrazy View Post
Why do you assume Walcott knew all of these things in the heat of the moment.

I'm a qualified mathematician and when I'm going through questions with my class I can get things like 23x17 wrong and thats not even a great deal of pressure.

This is the heavyweight championship of the world between the current champ and the hardest man in history. That hardest man got dropped in the first by a punch that doesn't look solid until years later when hd footage comes out.

Imagine the panic, confusion and rush, if ever there was to be a mistake it would be in that moment, and guess what? There was a mistake. It's one thing to box and another to ref.

Jersey ****ed up. He never seemed in control and he made a bad mistake. If you wanna believe in some elaborate conspiracy I wanna see proof.

I don't believe in an elaborate conspiracy.
What I believe happened is not at all elaborate.
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Old 04-05-2013, 02:48 PM   #192
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I don't believe in an elaborate conspiracy.
What I believe happened is not at all elaborate.
Yes nothing elaborate about paying a well respected former world champion to fix a fight he is refereeing.
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Old 04-05-2013, 04:11 PM   #193
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Yes nothing elaborate about paying a well respected former world champion to fix a fight he is refereeing.
Well respected? Are you serious?

Walcott had turned professional wrestler prior to refereeing.

I don't know if you know anything about US pro wrestling, but it is the absolute bottom rung of the entertainment industry. Every bit of it is fake and scripted.

Tell me what is unbelievable about dangling a few dollars in front of him to favor a particular fighter as referee.
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Old 04-05-2013, 04:29 PM   #194
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Well respected? Are you serious?

Walcott had turned professional wrestler prior to refereeing.

I don't know if you know anything about US pro wrestling, but it is the absolute bottom rung of the entertainment industry. Every bit of it is fake and scripted.

Tell me what is unbelievable about dangling a few dollars in front of him to favor a particular fighter as referee.
I'm not saying it's unbelievable. I'm saying it's less believable than Walcott just making a mistake.
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Old 04-05-2013, 04:50 PM   #195
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I'm not saying it's unbelievable. I'm saying it's less believable than Walcott just making a mistake.

What Walcott did in that fight was much more than "just a mistake".

It may have been the biggest travesty in boxing history. It was either intentional or monumental, unbelievable stupidity.
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