Boxing  

Forum Home Boxing Forum European British Classic Aussie MMA Training
Go Back   Boxing News 24 Forum > Boxing > Classic Boxing Forum


View Poll Results: Was Ali-Foreman Fixed?
Yes 10 8.33%
No 91 75.83%
Probably 7 5.83%
Probably Not 12 10.00%
Voters: 120. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 07-22-2012, 12:48 PM   #91
Vince Voltage
Contender
ESB Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 970
vCash: 500
Default Re: The Fix In The Jungle?

I doubt very much that it was fixed in the traditional sense. We know George didn't take a dive. But there were some underhanded and corrupt thiings going on.

George wasn't given proper time to heal from his cut in training. The corrupt government wouldn't let him leave the country when he wanted to. Angelo Dundee has admitted -proudly- that he loosened the ropes. And George was given a very fast count.

Still, Ali fought marveously that night. In my opinion it was Ali's greatest night.

But my main complaint about Ali as a fighter is that I think he seduced/intimidated people in to doing things his way. Rules were bent for him, judges extremey lenient. And John Ruiz is probably the only guy I can thiink of that held more than Ali. But yet, I don't remember him ever deducted a point for anything.

It's hard to say if conditions were any better for George if he would have fought any better, though. But I do think he deserved a rematch within a year of that fight. Despite what Ali says, George was ducked by him after Zaire.
Vince Voltage is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Old 07-22-2012, 01:10 PM   #92
BillB
Contender
ESB Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 725
vCash: 500
Default Re: The Fix In The Jungle?

Consider this:

The loose ropes were obviously in preparation for the rope-a-dope.
There is more than one source saying that Dundee either directed they be made loose, stopped any attempt to tighten them or both.

How could anyone have predicted that Foreman would have been stupid enough to fall for the tactic? He'd never done anything like that before. Why assume he even might do that in Zaire? Why assume anybody would?

It might indicate they knew Sadler would be urging him on- telling him to keep pounding and don't stop. 'George, he can't take another round of it. Don't let up'
BillB is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2012, 02:01 PM   #93
FastHands(beeb)
Contender
ESB Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: London, England
Posts: 736
vCash: 500
Default Re: The Fix In The Jungle?

There certainly were some strange circumstances surrounding this fight. I think it's difficult to say with confidence one way or t'other. If this was a Scottish courtroom, I would plump for a verdict of not proven guilty.
FastHands(beeb) is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2012, 02:51 PM   #94
johnmaff36
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: ireland
Posts: 2,611
vCash: 1000
Default Re: The Fix In The Jungle?

Look, its pretty straightforward. As Ali has stated on numerous occasions and even if you watch the fight, he came out to fight and landed enough to nick the 1st round. Ali claims that in that 1st round, George was doin a good job of cutting off the ring that he (Ali) didnt think he could keep the pace for 15 rounds therefore he changed his tactics somewhat and that involved using the ropes. Now, whether the ropes where tampered with or not its immaterial for the point im about to make ; You do not get points for lying on the ropes.

If anyone can show me an example of a fighter getting points for doing so then feel free to show it and i'll withdraw my statement.

Also, to reitterate my point, Ali was ahead on the scorecards when the KO came. Smokin Joe at ringside had him in front after 6 rounds too, so can someone please tell me how Ali got these points if all he did was lie on the ropes? He musta been punching at some stage
johnmaff36 is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2012, 03:36 PM   #95
BillB
Contender
ESB Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 725
vCash: 500
Default Re: The Fix In The Jungle?

Ali also said he got the idea for the rope-a-dope tactic after watching films of the Foreman-Frazier fight.

He said Foreman could barely make it back to his corner after he KOed Frazier in the second round.

He decided then that the way to beat him was to let him punch himself out.
BillB is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2012, 03:48 PM   #96
Senor Pepe'
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 4,704
vCash: 500
Default Re: The Fix In The Jungle?

Bill B,

I thought Angelo Dundee told Muhammad Ali to box-and-move after the 1st Round,
and to 'get off the ropes'.

But Ali said he couldn't, as his legs felt like 'cement blocks' due to the high humidity
and intense heat.

The Rope-A-Dope was nothing more than a mistake, absolutely not thought out.
Senor Pepe' is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2012, 03:53 PM   #97
BillB
Contender
ESB Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 725
vCash: 500
Default Re: The Fix In The Jungle?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Senor Pepe' View Post
Bill B,

I thought Angelo Dundee told Muhammad Ali to box-and-move after the 1st Round,
and to 'get off the ropes'.

But Ali said he couldn't, as his legs felt like 'cement blocks' due to the high humidity
and intense heat.

The Rope-A-Dope was nothing more than a mistake, absolutely not thought out.

It depends on which version of Ali's story you believe. He likely has several more versions out there.
BillB is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2012, 03:55 PM   #98
Senor Pepe'
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 4,704
vCash: 500
Default Re: The Fix In The Jungle?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BillB View Post
It depends on which version of Ali's story you believe. He likely has several more versions out there.

Yes, Muhammad Ali did 'lie alot' in Zaire.

I think he also told his wife Belinda, that Veronica was 'just a friend'.

When the very polite Belinda called Muhammad in Zaire, she asked in proper English.

'Who the **** is Veronica'

Belinda Ali
[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]
Senor Pepe' is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2012, 04:10 PM   #99
LittleRed
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Yoknapatawpha
Posts: 3,092
vCash: 475
Default Re: The Fix In The Jungle?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BillB View Post
It depends on which version of Ali's story you believe. He likely has several more versions out there.
So you're saying our options here are either Ali was a strategic genius who plotted out exactly how to beat Foreman well beforehand and loosened the ropes knowing no one would care, or that Ali was a tactical genius who improvised the rope a dope on the spot intuitively inferring that it would work?
LittleRed is online now  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2012, 04:35 PM   #100
Senor Pepe'
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 4,704
vCash: 500
Default Re: The Fix In The Jungle?

Telephone conversation between Belinda Ali and Muhammad Ali.

Just released by the Inter-Continental Communications Company.

RING - RING

Muhammad, 'Hello, who is it.'

Belinda, 'This is your wife, remember me'.

Muhammad, 'Yes, I was just thinking of you.'

Belinda, 'Well, I have been thinking of you too, and your new friend'.

Muhammad, 'What friend.'

Belinda, 'I've been told that you have a new friend with you there in Zaire'.

Muhammad, 'Oh, you must mean Veronica'.

Belinda, 'Who the **** is Veronica'.

Muhammad, 'Wait Belinda, she's just a new friend'.

Belinda, 'Well I heard that you've been ****ing your new friend'.

Muhammad, 'Belinda, wait, when I get back to the States we'll go over this'.

Belinda, 'You listen to me you draft-dodging, two-timing scum bag. You better pray
that George Foreman kills you in that boxing ring, because if he doesn't, I will when you get back home'.

CLICK.
Senor Pepe' is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2012, 06:40 PM   #101
Vince Voltage
Contender
ESB Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 970
vCash: 500
Default Re: The Fix In The Jungle?

So, the fight was fixed by Veronica Porsche then, to prevent Belinda from killing Ali? Holy shit, this is scary! And to think Foreman was an unwitting pawn in all this....
Vince Voltage is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2012, 06:45 PM   #102
LittleRed
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Yoknapatawpha
Posts: 3,092
vCash: 475
Default Re: The Fix In The Jungle?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vince Voltage View Post
So, the fight was fixed by Veronica Porsche then, to prevent Belinda from killing Ali? Holy shit, this is scary! And to think Foreman was an unwitting pawn in all this....
Sadly, stranger things have actually happened in boxing.
LittleRed is online now  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2012, 07:20 PM   #103
johnmaff36
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: ireland
Posts: 2,611
vCash: 1000
Default Re: The Fix In The Jungle?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vince Voltage View Post
So, the fight was fixed by Veronica Porsche then, to prevent Belinda from killing Ali? Holy shit, this is scary! And to think Foreman was an unwitting pawn in all this....
yep, and if you look at the melee when the fight was stopped, just behind don king is jessica fletcher
johnmaff36 is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2012, 07:23 PM   #104
Bill Butcher
Erik`El Terrible`Morales
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Phoenix Marie`s ass, Fritzl Residence, Glasgow, Scotland.
Posts: 14,262
vCash: 1000
Default Re: The Fix In The Jungle?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jacklondon View Post
Only a (no offense) ****ing slack jawed retard with a politically correct agenda would vote "no" or "probably not".
Only a complete prick would try tarnish one of the biggest achievements of the biggest star boxing has ever had (no offence if you voted incorrectly)
Bill Butcher is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2012, 07:29 PM   #105
Bill Butcher
Erik`El Terrible`Morales
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Phoenix Marie`s ass, Fritzl Residence, Glasgow, Scotland.
Posts: 14,262
vCash: 1000
Default Re: The Fix In The Jungle?

Just reading thru some comments there.... ****in hell, there sure are some delusional cunts on here talking & believing some crazy shit
Bill Butcher is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Reply

Boxing News 24 Forum > Boxing > Classic Boxing Forum

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump





All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:02 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Boxing News 24 Forum 2013