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Old 08-17-2012, 10:55 AM   #1
Brand NOOBian
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Default Endurance Issues on the Heavy Bag

Just entered my 7th month of training, but I'm still having trouble with endurance on the heavy bag. My endurance has drastically improved in all other areas I think, but there's just something about the heavy bag that drains me. Not sure what the issue can be, so I'll just list some basic info that might be of help.

Age: 28
Weight: 72 kg (158.4 lb)

Typical Training Session (4-5 days/week):
*3 x 3 min jump rope (no problems)
*3 x 3 min shadow box (no problems)
*3-6 x 3 min heavy bag (usually start struggling toward the end of the 1st round or near the beginning of the 2nd and progressively get worse as the rounds go on)
*3-6 x 3 min speed bag (no problems)
*3 x 3 min shadow box (usually struggle the last 1 or 2 rounds)
*3 x 3 min jump rope (usually struggle the last 1 or 2 rounds)

*If I do bodyweight/dumbbell/ab exercises, I usually do it after my 2nd shadow boxing session and usually get through it with no problems

*If I spar, it's usually at a random time during my regular routine after my 1st shadow boxing session. I recently started being able to get through 3 x 3 min without gassing out.

Road Work (1-2 days/week):
*jog 2.5 miles + 3 x 3 min shadow box + 2-2.5 mile sprint intervals (100-200m sprint/100 m walk)
OR
*jog 3-5 miles in a little under 10 min/mile (i used to struggle running 2 miles under 30 min when I started boxing)


I know it's hard to assess what the problem could be based on this info, but any ideas? I thought if I just kept pushing myself as hard as I could on the heavy bag my endurance would naturally go up, but it isn't getting any better on the heavy bag itself. Is there anything else I can do to improve?

Also, my first match is coming up at the end of Oct. It's only 2 x 1.5 min rounds. Based on my endurance in sparring, I feel like 2 x 1.5 min isn't gonna be that hard to get through. Based on my endurance on the heavy bag, I think I might gas out. I'm guessing sparring would be a better indicator of how I would do in a match, but I'm still a little concerned.
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Old 08-17-2012, 11:41 AM   #2
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Default Re: Endurance Issues on the Heavy Bag

How about try cutting the number of rounds on rope work and shadow boxing?
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Old 08-17-2012, 12:14 PM   #3
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Default Re: Endurance Issues on the Heavy Bag

Not sure you'll get a lot of responses here, since no one can see how hard you work the heavy bag. Too many factors like you said. But if your general cardio is improving - that's pretty encouraging. Heck a lot of us here experience the same thing. Probably cuz we're just working a little harder on the bag,
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Old 08-17-2012, 01:01 PM   #4
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Default Re: Endurance Issues on the Heavy Bag

Vary your training.

Variation 1: End every heavybag round with a one minute punch out where you go 100% with 1-2s or hooks or whatever, it's just important to push yourself here.


Variation 2: Box on the Heavybag for 5-10 minutes. Nothing builds endurance, like endurance.

Variation 3: Less rest in between rounds, try 10-30 secs less rest each round.
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Old 08-17-2012, 01:07 PM   #5
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Default Re: Endurance Issues on the Heavy Bag

Quote:
Originally Posted by Speechless View Post
Not sure you'll get a lot of responses here, since no one can see how hard you work the heavy bag. Too many factors like you said. But if your general cardio is improving - that's pretty encouraging. Heck a lot of us here experience the same thing. Probably cuz we're just working a little harder on the bag,
Here's a video of me on the heavy bag a few weeks ago. This is the 1st round. I try to focus more on speed with this bag. The red bag on the left is softer, and that's the one I use to work on power. I have the most trouble with the red bag in terms of endurance, but this should give you a general idea on how I work the heavy bag. Not really looking for critiques on my technique, as I've already spotted things I need to work on, but I'm open to constructive criticism.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fPPgPf5L_gw[/ame]
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Old 08-17-2012, 01:26 PM   #6
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Default Re: Endurance Issues on the Heavy Bag

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brand NOOBian View Post
Here's a video of me on the heavy bag a few weeks ago. This is the 1st round. I try to focus more on speed with this bag. The red bag on the left is softer, and that's the one I use to work on power. I have the most trouble with the red bag in terms of endurance, but this should give you a general idea on how I work the heavy bag. Not really looking for critiques on my technique, as I've already spotted things I need to work on, but I'm open to constructive criticism.

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Hey man that's pretty good, you have some fast hands. Although I'm no expert I find it is easier to see what other people do wrong rather than what you do wrong

The main things I noticed where that although you are focusing on speed you still need to get the proper rotation in your right hand. Throw it fast but throw it like you would in a fight with the full rotation of the hips(I'm guility of this as well). In fact overall I think you need to hit a little harder, that's what the heavybag is for after all.

You also need to make sure you get full extension on your punches, for the most part you do but at times you'll step to close to the bag.

Finally I think you need to punch a bit higher up the bag, you are puncher a bit to far down where it wouldn't be a body shot ut it wouldn't be a head shot. Punch straight at head level.
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Old 08-17-2012, 02:04 PM   #7
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Default Re: Endurance Issues on the Heavy Bag

If you've been doing that for seven months and you're still having a hard time, you must be too tense when you're working the bag. You'll notice this too when/if you start sparring. If you're totally relaxed and moving smoothly instead of tensing your muscles and trying to hit "hard", you can go for much much longer without getting tired. Just try to relax and think about having balance and timing and coordination when you hit the bag, not trying to put a dent in it or knock it through the wall. Relax and work your speed and technique and you'll realize how much easier everything is.
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Old 08-17-2012, 02:28 PM   #8
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Default Re: Endurance Issues on the Heavy Bag

Do less warm up
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Old 08-17-2012, 03:07 PM   #9
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Default Re: Endurance Issues on the Heavy Bag

Feet to wide, on front Foot, Pushing your Shots. Other than that pretty tidy, but Bad posture of the Shoulders, because of where the Head is, because of the Backfoot.
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Old 08-17-2012, 03:58 PM   #10
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Default Re: Endurance Issues on the Heavy Bag

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brand NOOBian View Post
Just entered my 7th month of training, but I'm still having trouble with endurance on the heavy bag. My endurance has drastically improved in all other areas I think, but there's just something about the heavy bag that drains me. Not sure what the issue can be, so I'll just list some basic info that might be of help.
If you are training as you have stated consistently, then I see no reason for concern, providing you are training at right level of intensity.

A few points:

Most people tend to throw more punches per round when on the heavy bag than they do in sparring / competition as generally a live opponent isn't stood stationary waiting to be hit.

Most novices tend push their punches on the bag rather than focussing on HITTING it. They also tend to focus on power rather than letting the power come through speed and technique.

Heavier gloves for training increases difficulty - come fight night you will probably be wearing lighter gloves ?

If you are hitting the bag 4-5 times per week it's likely that your muscles haven't fully recovered between sessions (don't forget the cumulative effects of the rest of your training). I would have a few days off to allow full recovery and then go for 2-3 quality sessions per week at this stage. You just need to provide your body with a stimulus to adapt - You don't need to blast your body every session.

Vary your training - try some Tabata style intervals / intervals of different lengths and vary your rest periods.


If you have been training consistently for 7 months without a break - have a deload week (i.e. a week of rest or lower your frequency / volume / intensity to allow for recovery.

Also, bear in mind that prior to your first bout, you will have 3-4 days of rest (or very little hard training). You will be fully recovered an raring to go come your first bout.

What do your circuit / bodyweight / weight session involve? And how often do you do these?
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Old 08-17-2012, 04:04 PM   #11
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Default Re: Endurance Issues on the Heavy Bag

Must be tense or over thinking your punches while on heavy bag. Relax and let the punches come out more fluidly (is that a word?).
Also, try heavier gloves. I can tell those are like 10oz or lighter.
16oz will tire you out quicker so don't expect results right away.
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Old 08-17-2012, 10:54 PM   #12
Brand NOOBian
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Default Re: Endurance Issues on the Heavy Bag

Thanks for all the responses.


Quote:
Originally Posted by scrap View Post
Feet to wide, on front Foot, Pushing your Shots. Other than that pretty tidy, but Bad posture of the Shoulders, because of where the Head is, because of the Backfoot.
A friend of mine pointed this out to me as well, so I've been trying to shorten up my stance since recording the video. Not sure what you mean by the bad posture/head position though. Can you elaborate?


Quote:
Originally Posted by RichC View Post
What do your circuit / bodyweight / weight session involve? And how often do you do these?
Day 1:
*3 x 8-10 pull ups
*3 x 10-12 chin ups
*3 x 20 alternating hammer grip curls (10 on each side)
*3 x 20 one-arm rows (10 on each side)
*3 x 10 reverse bench flys
*3 x 10 dumbbell dead lifts

Day 2:
*3 x 20 medicine ball push ups
*3 x 10 diamond push ups
*3 x 10 push ups with feet elevated on bench
*3 x 10 regular push ups
*3 x 20 dips
*3 x 20 bent over triceps extensions (10 on each side)

Day 3:
*3 x 20 alternating dumbbell shoulder press (10 on each side)
*3 x 20 shoulder raises (10 lateral, 10 front)
*3 x 20 dumbbell lunges (10 on each side)
*3 x 10 dumbbell squats
*3 x 20-30 dumbbell heel raises

Some days I don't have enough time and/or energy to get through the whole routine. In fact, this past week I've pretty much left this part out and opted for more shadow boxing/jump rope at the end of my workout.


Quote:
Originally Posted by JDK View Post
Must be tense or over thinking your punches while on heavy bag. Relax and let the punches come out more fluidly (is that a word?).
Also, try heavier gloves. I can tell those are like 10oz or lighter.
16oz will tire you out quicker so don't expect results right away.
They're bag gloves I got when I first joined the gym. Probably 8-10 oz. I haven't bought any other gloves of my own yet. We're only allowed to use the community 16 oz gloves for sparring, but I think they have some 14 oz ones for the bag. Will try that next time.
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Old 08-17-2012, 11:39 PM   #13
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Default Re: Endurance Issues on the Heavy Bag

Quote:
Originally Posted by RichC View Post
If you are training as you have stated consistently, then I see no reason for concern, providing you are training at right level of intensity.

A few points:

Most people tend to throw more punches per round when on the heavy bag than they do in sparring / competition as generally a live opponent isn't stood stationary waiting to be hit.

Most novices tend push their punches on the bag rather than focussing on HITTING it. They also tend to focus on power rather than letting the power come through speed and technique.

Heavier gloves for training increases difficulty - come fight night you will probably be wearing lighter gloves ?

If you are hitting the bag 4-5 times per week it's likely that your muscles haven't fully recovered between sessions (don't forget the cumulative effects of the rest of your training). I would have a few days off to allow full recovery and then go for 2-3 quality sessions per week at this stage. You just need to provide your body with a stimulus to adapt - You don't need to blast your body every session.

Vary your training - try some Tabata style intervals / intervals of different lengths and vary your rest periods.


If you have been training consistently for 7 months without a break - have a deload week (i.e. a week of rest or lower your frequency / volume / intensity to allow for recovery.

Also, bear in mind that prior to your first bout, you will have 3-4 days of rest (or very little hard training). You will be fully recovered an raring to go come your first bout.

What do your circuit / bodyweight / weight session involve? And how often do you do these?
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Old 08-18-2012, 04:32 AM   #14
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Default Re: Endurance Issues on the Heavy Bag

you're more tired on the red bag because youre throwing power into your shots, but what happens is that it soaks your energy rather than conveniently, bounce your fist back. (Newton's law) Compare that with the tighter green bag which pushes back in the opposite direction with equal force.

While your shadow boxing may be fine and you aren't tired cause of it, remember that you are punching air, so you feel no effort to exert forward and backward.
But everytime you throw out hard, you have to pull back equally hard. Spar someone, and when you miss your big shot, you suddenly feel very heavy. The red bag is doing just that, denying you of an immovable surface, so now you've spent twice the energy recovering from the motion.
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Old 08-18-2012, 09:08 AM   #15
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Default Re: Endurance Issues on the Heavy Bag

[quote=Brand NOOBian;13609537]Thanks for all the responses.




A friend of mine pointed this out to me as well, so I've been trying to shorten up my stance since recording the video. Not sure what you mean by the bad posture/head position though. Can you elaborate.
Simply as you are, the shoulders are working overtime to stabalise the Head .To compensate for Bad Biomechanics, the Feet are putting you under, being on the Front Foot, without any controlled distance, of the Backfoot. Making you off balance most of the time. Your Ears should be in line with your Coxxys, not your front Knee. Get an 18 inch Woody Red type, put your feet inside of it. It will teach you to understand, Balance mechanics.
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