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Old 09-04-2012, 07:53 PM   #31
boranbkk
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Default Re: I feel MMA needs a massive change!

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Originally Posted by greathamza View Post
Im no expert in incomes around the world but 10k per fight isnt to bad in the US if you have 3 fights a year then you have 30k and people live on much less than that in the US.
In Thailand stuff are probably cheaper than in the US or most of the western countrys so i guess 17 bucks go a lot further in Thailand than in the US but what do i know i might be talking out of my ass
To put 500 baht into perspective at the time (over a deacde ago) it basically equaled 4 beers and a taxi home, in other words nothing. I did it as a favour for a friend. At the time in Bangkok the Stadium champions would earn upwards of 250,000 $8000 which is and was considered alot of money in Thailand. However, remember in Thailand it's a 50-50 spilt with your gym!
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Old 09-04-2012, 08:23 PM   #32
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Default Re: I feel MMA needs a massive change!

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30 k a year for say 10 years is not enough to retire on, especially when your brains are being scrambled
If you're fighting 3 times a year for 10 years and still only making 10k a fight, you've chosen the wrong career
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Old 09-04-2012, 10:40 PM   #33
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Default Re: I feel MMA needs a massive change!

I don't know how it works, in terms of pay, in mma. In boxing managers get around 30%, trainers get around 10%; and then you have seconds, training expenses, etc...

$10,000 drops to $6000 after the manager and trainer get their cut, then you have all the other expenses not to mention the income tax owed on what is left over.

$10,000 is nothing if it is split up similar to the way it is in boxing.
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Old 09-04-2012, 11:53 PM   #34
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Default Re: I feel MMA needs a massive change!

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I do think that points system is too complicated for a Fox audience, and I think a good compromise could be reached with 5 minute ''rounds'' just being a break period rather than a section of scoring to make it work with the Athletic comissions
I agree, and I believe that is a big part of the problem. The way it works now, fighters each start a round with 10 points and fight to preserve those points. There is no reason for a casual fan to inquire about what is going on.

If my scoring system were in place the fans would become more educated.

Commentator: So and so "just scored 3 points for passing his opponent's guard."

Casual fan: "What's a guard? What is a pass? Why is it worth 3 points?"

This sort of questioning will only happen if specific reasoning for a scoring techniques are listed in detail.

The 10 point must system was made for boxing. Boxing is pretty straight forward and easy to follow. Two people engage in a contest in which they are allowed to do nothing except punch each other, and this method of scoring works well with this sort of contest. MMA is too complex for this. There is a lot more going on in mma, and the fans are not going to be able to follow along as easy as if they were watching a boxing match.

Adopting a scoring system similar to what I proposed would force fans to become more knowledgeable. You brought up the Fox audience. My scoring system would be too complex for them now, but let it stay on a while. Have you ever looked at the rules for American Football/Hand Egg in your area? It is complex, changes almost yearly, and the fans keep up as if it were nothing.

I think a system like I suggested would make the sport more exciting as well. Imagine starting off 0-0, and numerous moves can change this total. Potentially every strike, every pass, every sweep, and every take down can be taken into account and mean the difference in the fight. Then imagine that there are no stand-ups, round endings, or restarts. What will this do to the person on the bottom if they know that no one is coming to rescue them from an bad position? That a sweep, reversal, or strike is needed to keep the points coming in.

Last edited by rekcutnevets; 09-05-2012 at 12:04 AM.
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Old 09-05-2012, 01:46 AM   #35
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Default Re: I feel MMA needs a massive change!

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Originally Posted by greathamza View Post
Im no expert in incomes around the world but 10k per fight isnt to bad in the US if you have 3 fights a year then you have 30k and people live on much less than that in the US.
In Thailand stuff are probably cheaper than in the US or most of the western countrys so i guess 17 bucks go a lot further in Thailand than in the US but what do i know i might be talking out of my ass

Well, without being too much of a prick, you are talking out of your ass.

30K a year for a few years isn't going to set anybody up in this country. An average family of four is considered to be living in poverty if the breadwinner(s) earn less than $23,000 a year.

You're also failing to take into account the cost of training and travel expenses and all of the other out-of-pocket expenses that fighters have to deal with. If a guy gets paid $10,000 for a fight, only 3 to 5 thousand is actually going into his bank account. I've heard plenty of fighters who are at the UFC level say that their "show money" is already spent by the time that they get to the fight. Many won't turn much of a profit without win bonuses and their sponsors. Most of the guys who fight have real jobs on the side and couldn't afford to train otherwise.
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Old 09-05-2012, 11:08 AM   #36
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Default Re: I feel MMA needs a massive change!

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Originally Posted by rekcutnevets View Post

Adopting a scoring system similar to what I proposed would force fans to become more knowledgeable. You brought up the Fox audience. My scoring system would be too complex for them now, but let it stay on a while. Have you ever looked at the rules for American Football/Hand Egg in your area? It is complex, changes almost yearly, and the fans keep up as if it were nothing.
I do like the scoring system and everyone agrees for the most part that the 10 pts must isnt ideally suited to MMA. I like your system aswell, Id be all for it

But at then end of the day, I dont think the majority of the people tuning in want to be more knowledgeable. The concept of hang egg and fighting remain very simple though the techniques/tactics involved. People want to see a fight at the end of the day, and I think having to understand what scores in that type of system would just turn alot of viewers off and maybe lose revenue. People just want to see someone get their ass kicked at then end of the day. look at the difference in popularity between WWE and Collegiate Wrestling as a basic example of what Im trying to say

But I do think your system would be absolutely perfect for a Junior or Amateur level of competition. More emphasis on technique and less on full contact strikes. Parents wouldnt worry about Junior getting their kids made bitchblike, and the technique would be the main emphasis. Could do wonders for the sport at grass root level, I can honestly see them adopting something similar if the sport ever got to an Olympic level
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Old 09-05-2012, 11:09 AM   #37
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Well, without being too much of a prick, you are talking out of your ass.
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Old 09-05-2012, 02:14 PM   #38
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Default Re: I feel MMA needs a massive change!

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To put 500 baht into perspective at the time (over a deacde ago) it basically equaled 4 beers and a taxi home, in other words nothing. I did it as a favour for a friend. At the time in Bangkok the Stadium champions would earn upwards of 250,000 $8000 which is and was considered alot of money in Thailand. However, remember in Thailand it's a 50-50 spilt with your gym!
WTF dude!! I was paying double that for Thai strippers
You must REALLY love your Muay Thai Them dudes on Walking St get paid peanuts in Pattaya...
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Old 09-05-2012, 03:32 PM   #39
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Default Re: I feel MMA needs a massive change!

Again, what other high profile sport where you reach the .00001% level gets you paid 10k per fight when 10s of millions are made in PPV.

As people have already stated, with expenses and taxes and partying, these guys may be on debt after the dust settles. Forget getting your body battered.
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Old 09-05-2012, 05:56 PM   #40
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Default Re: I feel MMA needs a massive change!

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WTF dude!! I was paying double that for Thai strippers
You must REALLY love your Muay Thai Them dudes on Walking St get paid peanuts in Pattaya...
"Thai strippers" that's a very very polite term for the wonderful creatures who make walking street such a welcoming place! I was never really a Pattaya guy and it's way worse these days, I was more of a Patpong, Nana, Cowboy kind of guy with the odd bit of Ratchada thrown in when hanging with Thais!

But to keep on with the theme of how abysmal a payday it was, in the lat 90s early 2000s just a Patpong barfine was anything from 350 to 450! (I think I'm divulging far too much personal info that may oy maynot allow other forum members to make certain judements about my weak moral fibre!)

And about lovin Muay Thai, at that stage I was lost and living in one giant amazing Muay Thai adventure. Anyway in those day MT for farang wasn't as organised as it is now, it was way more a labour of love.
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Old 09-06-2012, 01:57 AM   #41
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Default Re: I feel MMA needs a massive change!

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"Thai strippers" that's a very very polite term for the wonderful creatures who make walking street such a welcoming place! I was never really a Pattaya guy and it's way worse these days,
Well you must know far better than i do that Pattaya is a den of iniquity. Disgraceful to see what 'us' Westerners have done to Thailand...
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Old 09-06-2012, 04:05 AM   #42
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Default Re: I feel MMA needs a massive change!

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Originally Posted by Thom View Post
Well, without being too much of a prick, you are talking out of your ass.

30K a year for a few years isn't going to set anybody up in this country. An average family of four is considered to be living in poverty if the breadwinner(s) earn less than $23,000 a year.

You're also failing to take into account the cost of training and travel expenses and all of the other out-of-pocket expenses that fighters have to deal with. If a guy gets paid $10,000 for a fight, only 3 to 5 thousand is actually going into his bank account. I've heard plenty of fighters who are at the UFC level say that their "show money" is already spent by the time that they get to the fight. Many won't turn much of a profit without win bonuses and their sponsors. Most of the guys who fight have real jobs on the side and couldn't afford to train otherwise.
So what?

What obligation does the UFC or any other organization have to make sure that all of their fighters are earning six figures?

When you become a professional mixed martial artist, you're chasing your dreams. You're in it for the competition and the glory. You're not choosing a stable, safe, high-earning career.

If nobody is buying tickets just to see you fight or tuning in on TV to watch you, if you have no fan following in any ethnic or local community and you can be replaced on short notice by any of dozens of guys who would fight for free just to get the chance to be seen, then why should you be earning six figures?

If your skills are world class and you are prepared to put the work in with the media and promotions, you will reap the rewards. Joe Lauzon has never been in line for a title shot. But he makes good money because fans like to cheer for him, his fights always have the crowd roaring, and he's a hardworking, reliable employee. He's not a millionaire, (I assume) but his earnings are well into six figures.

Chael Sonnen is not a champion, but he is at/near the top of his division and he works his ass off to promote himself and his organization. He is a millionaire because of that.

Professional MMA isn't a steady earner. It's not a path to easy riches, nor should it be. In fact, fighters SHOULD be fighting to pay their bills, because that makes them hungry. Otherwise, when they get rich, you get Floyd Mayweather fighting six times in six years and all the time avoiding the only fight anyone wants to see him in.

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Old 09-06-2012, 04:35 AM   #43
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Default Re: I feel MMA needs a massive change!

ok here is what we do...we have the cage covered in padded "square" tills. But under one tile...is a gun. Let the fun begin.
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Old 09-06-2012, 04:36 AM   #44
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**** off Johnstown!
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Old 09-06-2012, 08:38 AM   #45
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Default Re: I feel MMA needs a massive change!

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Originally Posted by scurlaruntings View Post
Well you must know far better than i do that Pattaya is a den of iniquity. Disgraceful to see what 'us' Westerners have done to Thailand...
I know where you're coming from and agree about Pattaya, but no one surpasses the Thais in ruining thier own enviroments you should see how they've riuned Phuket, Krabi and Samui.
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