If YOU were Joe Calzaghe, would you come out of retirement to fight Andre Ward?

[dinovelvet]

Baileys double standards agan.

If Loudon assumes Joe meant millions by the crown jewels, which he more than likely did, and unless you know for fact that he didn't, which you dont, than that is just your opinion. The exact figure is of no bearing to anything and is just a tool for you to try ridicule Loudon. Trying to get to the bottom of what the figure was will go nowhere. What it really meant was a price out.

By your method of proving how good a fighter is, if Kessler beat Froch and Froch beat Bute, than would Ward beat Bute?

You evaluate Joe's record on that theory, which is clearly bullshit.

[Loudon]

Bailey,

Then he hasnt beaten any great fighters full stop. But it was Calzaghe who took his 0 and Calzaghe that has other great names on his resume like Eubank, Hopkins and Jones who have all had over 20 world title fights.
Why do so many call Jirov a great win for Toney? What were Jirovs top 5 wins? .

You're the only one arguing. I like Kessler. The thing with you is, you don't allow for circumstances, when you post facts like these. Roy was one of the greatest fighters who ever lived. Joe easily beat him. Does that mean that Joe was better than Roy, and Joe was one of the greatest fighters that's ever lived? Of course not. Joe was great, but he'll never be classed as one of the greatest ever, like Roy. Jirov was a good win for Toney.

You asked a question after trying to argue a point. Which proved you didnt know what you were going on about, yet you cannot see that because you believe your opinions are a fact when the facts have buried you, yet you argue and then ask questions about what you are arguing to defend. You showed yourself up with that one

Ha! I asked a question after I'd argued my point. It didn't matter what the answer to the question was. The question was, did he beat Cummins for a vacant title? You laughed and said no. My point was, that Kessler was a good fighter, but he'd never beaten an elite fighter, going into the fight with Joe. That was my point that I was arguing. Cummins, Sciaca, Andrade, Mundine, beyer were all good but not GREAT WINS. That was my argument. It didn't matter if he beat Cummins for a vacant title or not. Stop being stupid. It's you who's showing himself up.

Calzaghe didnt beat Hopkins on workrate, he beat Hopkins because he was able to land his left more than Hopkins could land his right and you forget that Hopkins strongest moments are down the stretch and that is where Calzaghe took that away from him, something that nobody has been able to do before or since.

That's your opinion, and I respect that.

Eubank was no older than Kessler in career and age. Both 31

That's fair enough, but Eubank was an old 31, like Hearns and Ali were. It doesn't seem old, but he aged a lot quicker than most other fighters of similar age.

Very tough to say. As said I could argue it for Eubank, Lacy, Kessler and Hopkins. Possibly Eubank as he was the best SMW out the bunch who had never clearly been beaten and went on to put weights in his clothes to appear heavier and take on a massive punching CW world champ to a close decision which could have gone either way.
The only CW to beat unified CW champ D Haye.
I would like to see any SMW today give away such weight and face a CW champ of today, but none of todays hit as hard as Thompson

Correct. Carl Thompson was a strong guy, and Eubank pushed him really close twice. But the point still stands, that Eubank wasn't fully prepared, and he was at the end of his career. But I class that win as a good win for Joe. He came of age that night. I can see where you're coming from. Like I say, you could make arguments for the others too. But I went with Kessler, becasue he was at his peak, and it was to unify the title, that Joe had waited so long to do. Do you think Joe would have beaten the best versions of Eubank, Benn and Collins?

My arguement was that you didnt have any details or facts which was proven. I dont know how Zod correcting you affected me.
You had no facts and were arguing something you didnt even know and was then corrected.

Yes but it's a minute irrelevant little fact, the same as Cummins. My Kessler argument was, that he hadn't beaten any elite fighters. It didn't matter if I was right or wrong saying asking if he'd beaten Cummins for a vacant title.

The same applies here. My argument was that Grant got paid less than a million to fight Roy, and based on Joe's crown jewels comment, we know that he wouldn't have fought Roy for a under a million. That was my main point. The specific amount isn't important in the grand scheme of things. It doesn't matter if he got paid $10 or $900,000. My point was, Grant was willing to fight for a purse, that Joe wouldn't have fought for. If you think that Joe would have fought Roy for $300,000 when he'd said he'd want the crown jewels, then you're an idiot!

To know the facts.
You keep saying and insinuating millions but cant even come remotely close to knowing what you are talking about
So once again you ave no idea.
So why not say you dont know.

I don't know the exact amount. So let me ask you. How much do you think he was talking about?

Anyone with a brain can safely assume, that he was talking about more than a million.

You dont know what was offered. If anything
You dont know what he wanted money wise
You dont know what he was being paid and how much he would have taken
You dont know what he insinuated by an off the cuff remark
You dont know anything about the subject do you!
What we do know is that Jones wanted 10mil. To make it happen. The crown Jewels
We can assume he wanted more than normal, but what was he being paid? You dont know

You like to twist and turn things to suit your argument.

We don't need to know the exact figure that Joe would have wanted. Why? Because we know it would DEFINITELY have been more than what Grant, Frazier and Woods got. This is a safe assumption to make.

Once again, you copy and paste Joe's claims, but then when someone like me rips his ridiculous claims, the only thing you can say is, oh it was off the cuff. No it wasn't off the cuff. It was a fucking lie!

You're happy to claim that he CHASED Roy after McIntyre, but when I ask how? You can't answer! Just saying he kept winnin, is not enough. I've asked you this question three times, and you haven't answered, so I'll try for the 4th time.

After McIntyre, Joe remained at 168, to fights the likes of Miguel Jiminez.

HOW WAS STAYING AT 168, TO FIGHT THE LIKES OF MIGUEL JIMINEZ, GOING TO GET HIM A BIG MONEY FIGHT AGAINST ROY JONES, WHO WAS THE UNIFIED 175 CHAMPION??

Once again Loudon, that is your opinion. YOUR opinion. You dont know what he was talking about. Hatton wanted big money to defend against Witter when British champ but I doubt at that time he wanted millions
This is where you pwn yourself because as you say you dont know and where has the word millions been said by anyone other than you and Jones who wanted 10 mil?

What's your opinion? There's only me mentioning millions? Ha!

How much do you think he was referring to?

"I think I could give Roy Jones a tough fight. Maybe the toughest he's ever had. But I know what my CAPABILITIES are, and unless I got paid the Crown Jewels, I wouldn't want it."

Now does that sound like he was talkng about millions, or a few hundred grand? I know you like an argument, but don't be thick!

YOU DONT KNOW THAT. What are you a mindreader now .
This shows why I cant take you seriously. You have no idea of what was wanted and now say you have an idead what he wanted by reading his mind

I'm an intelligent guy, that's logical, and I think it's safe for me to assume, that he was talking about a lot of money!

Fact is, Jones didnt put out an offer, Calzaghes team did.
If someone was getting 50K a fight and said I want the crown jewels for this next one and was offered 500K they would likely jump at the chance because it is so much more. It can mean anything Loudon, not just what you think. Get it, not just what YOU think

Fact is, Joe wanted huge money, when outside of Europe, he was relatively unknown.

That's also a bad analogy. Why would Joe be offered ten times his normal amount to fight Roy?

YOU DONT KNOW THAT . He wasnt offered. though I would add he probably would have wanted more because he would have been a bigger fight. But I dont know that and unlike you cant assume, only stick to facts.
Luckily Loudon reads minds and has close ideas even when his buddy Zod does correct him

Ha! Why would Joe have been offered anything?

Clinton Woods was offered an amount. Do you know why?
Because he was Roy's mandatory at 175.

Frazier was offered an amount. Do you know why?
Because he was Roy's mandatory at 175.

Otis was offered an amount. Do you know why?
Because he was willing to fight Roy at 175.

None of the above applied to Joe at the time.

What do you think would have happened, if Joe had've been offered $900,000 to fight Roy? Do you think he'd have accepted it? Ha!

[knockout artist]

Originally Posted by Loudon

Great debating with you mate!


Regards, Loudon.

Hi mate, thanks for the responses, as I have a lot of work on over the next couple of days I'll get back to you on thursday or friday

[Loudon]

Part 2.

Who said he wanted millions other than you. WHO??
We know Jones wanted 10 mil. Were HBO going to pay that for him to fight Calzaghe?
Also Calzaghe was with Showtime

We're going around in circles. You would have to be an IDIOT to think that he wasn't talking about millions.

What was he being paid at the time?
Maybe he would/wouldnt have excepted 300K, if lesser fighters were getting that, but we dont know and dont know what he would have accepted because an offer wasnt put to him

Maybe he would have accepted 300K? Haha!

Once again. WHAT PAYDAY DID HE WANT?
YOU DONT KNOW AND HAVE NO IDEA

Ha! More than 300K!

Nothing to say there is either, so once again this ios your opinion only. We know Jones wanted 10mil.
You dont know Loudon and are just making assumptions.
Also what were the terms of that 5mil to DM and where is the link, because any fighter can say they offered X amount but terms would need to be mentioned also.
Once again Im not expecting you to know, just for you to cast an opinion and then try and argue it.

Yes it's only my opinion, that he could have beaten DM. But that was an avenue he could have explored to get Roy in the ring. It's you who believes Joe, when he says that he chased him for 5 to six years.

Look, you're not going to believe anything that you don't want to believe. If I give you the link to Roy's interview, you'll not believe him anyway. If I got you a link discussing the exact terms, you'd still dismiss it. How many links has Zod posted, that you still dismiss?

We've got a credible link of Joe saying "I'm not chasing Roy Jones. Roy Jones is a good fighter, but I don't want tough fights, I just want to be well paid!"

It was there in black and white, and still you try to fight his corner.

KO Artist produced video proof of Jones saying Calzaghe wanted to fight him and that he had other things to do.

And? That accounts for one year.

You tell me. What method did O Grant use

The method he used, was to fight in America, up at 175.

Joe didn't want to fight at 175 or in America. He didn't do either til 2008.

Said it before and after

And then he continued to do what he'd be doing, which was fighting guys like Jiminez, at 168, in Britain. That wasn't going to get him a Roy Jones fight for big money.

Well he didnt say any other name

He said he wanted big money fights against the likes of Roy, and DID NOTHING else to back up what he'd said.

Mandatories like Frazier was
No point in losing a title for a fight that may not happen.
Still there was also Mitchell

No but to get Roy in the ring, what were his options?

He either had to continue to fight at 168 and forget all about Roy.

Or he had to give up his 168 belt, to make a real push for the fight.

It would have been a big gamble, but it would have showed he was genuine.

What facts do you have rather than opinions
Roy said it himself, was he lying or are you forgetting Roy said that?
Maybe you can read Jones mind also and tell me he was lying

Joe said in the pre fight build up in 2008, that Joe had wanted to fight him for a while.

Is that your interpretation of Roy agreeing that Joe had chased him for 6 years to no avail? Ha!

I think that was just a comment that he had been chasing for a while because as we know it was longer than that
Kept winning.

You mean you can't give me an answer.

Ha! It's longer than 6 years now is it? Ha! But you can't tell me when exactly?

Kept winning

Against who?

Jiminez? Again, how was that going to secure him a big money fight with Roy?

Made an offer and as you know Jones didnt accept

What about the other 5 years?

Havent seen the words desperate, you will have to show me that.
Or maybe you were mindreading again

Why do you deny that Hopkins backed out of fighting him in America all those years ago?
He agreed to fight in America for those fights.

The Hopkins negotiations were 2001/2002. Joe didn't end up in America for another 6 years.

How has it proved he was lying?

Because his bullshit claims don't add up. I've proven this, but all you can say is, it was off the cuff.

He claims he chased Roy for years.

You can't SERIOUSLY chase someone if you don't fight at their weight class or in their country. Which Joe didn't do until 2008, when Roy was nearly 40!

THAT PROVES HE WAS FULL OF SHIT!

Hatton fought in America, but didnt say he wanted to fight Floyd, those words never were said by Hatton, when asked he just said you saw more action in those 4 rounds than his career, but wouldnt answer about wanting the fight.

Ha! Why the fuck else would he try and embarrass Floyd like that? Floyd was at home fuming. He got straight on the phone to Leonard Ellerbe and demanded that the fight be made.

Calzaghe did call Jones out.

No! He mentioned his name and then did nothing to back up what he'd said.

How did Hatton build a fanbase? He fought there 3 times in a completely different division and didnt call out Mayweather and his fans were mainly British who travelled

How did he build a fanbase? By fighting there like you've just mentioned. The casual American PPV fans picked up on him, and they watched him beat Castillo.

When he mocked Floyd, people watched and knew who he was.

When Joe mentioned Roy, hardly anyone had seen him him fight, and knew nothing about him.

Because of what Ricky said, there was interest in a Hatton vs Mayweather fight.

How many American fans do you think would have spoke about a potential Roy Jones vs Calzaghe fight?

Nobody knew who he was unitl he'd beaten Lacy in 2006, at 34.

Now Loudon before this continues can you please stick to facts and not just your opinion.

Read what has been written where things have only been your opinion and stick to facts.

FACTS ONLY LOUDON. I know you can read minds but not everyone else can

Such as this one,

"I'm not chasing Roy Jones. I don't want tough fights!" - Joe Calzaghe in 1999.


Regards, Loudon.

[Loudon]

Originally Posted by knockout artist

Hi mate, thanks for the responses, as I have a lot of work on over the next couple of days I'll get back to you on thursday or friday

No problem mate, no rush, just reply back whenever you have time.



Regards, Loudon.

[HerolGee]

Originally Posted by MAJR

But the WBC Super Middleweight Belt didn't go back decades. .

yeah.. no.

the difference in respect we are debating is between the wbo compared to the other bodies. nobosy wantesd the wbo title not because it was a SMW title, that would be absurd, they regarded it lightly because it was a WBO title. That was the only reason given in the wikipedia entry, there is no reference to individual weight divisions. Its like having a Fiat badge on a car, it becomes less wanted instantly. I try to explain this but I suspect you are taking the piss by not noticing that now.

We are not debating the difference in respect for the smw titles alone. The smw title is a subset of the wbo body, its not the other way round.

[MAJR]

Originally Posted by HerolGee

yeah.. no.

the difference in respect we are debating is between the wbo compared to the other bodies. nobosy wantesd the wbo title not because it was a SMW title, that would be absurd, they regarded it lightly because it was a WBO title. That was the only reason given in the wikipedia entry, there is no reference to individual weight divisions. Its like having a Fiat badge on a car, it becomes less wanted instantly. I try to explain this but I suspect you are taking the piss by not noticing that now.

We are not debating the difference in respect for the smw titles alone. The smw title is a subset of the wbo body, its not the other way round.

I'm sorry but we must have our wires cross somewhere, because I was talking specifically about the WBO Super Middleweight Title and its worth in relation to the titles in the division, not the WBO and the worth of the organization as a whole.

Being a WBO Title made it lesser to the WBC, WBA or IBF, I dont deny that, but being lesser to the other three didn't make it worthless, and in the Super Middleweight Division the IBF Title was the only one with a significantly longer history than the WBO, and the IBF Title was the only one that could boast bigger names and title fights than the WBO between 1988 and 1997.

Summarizing, I wouldn't have a problem with you saying the WBO Super Middleweight Title was not as important a title as the other three based on the importance of its sanctioning body, but I do have a problem with you calling it worthless when it had no less history in its division and had not had a significantly weaker level competitor than the WBC or WBA

[HerolGee]

Originally Posted by MAJR

I'm sorry but we must have our wires cross somewhere, because I was talking specifically about the WBO Super Middleweight Title and its worth in relation to the titles in the division, not the WBO and the worth of the organization as a whole.

Being a WBO Title made it lesser to the WBC, WBA or IBF, I dont deny that, but being lesser to the other three didn't make it worthless, and in the Super Middleweight Division the IBF Title was the only one with a significantly longer history than the WBO, and the IBF Title was the only one that could boast bigger names and title fights than the WBO between 1988 and 1997.

Summarizing, I wouldn't have a problem with you saying the WBO Super Middleweight Title was not as important a title as the other three based on the importance of its sanctioning body, but I do have a problem with you calling it worthless when it had no less history in its division and had not had a significantly weaker level competitor than the WBC or WBA

yeah I specifically am referring to the body giving ALL the wbo titles historcially less weight than the major boxing body counterparts.. It wasnt me at any stage who was being division specific.

[MAJR]

Originally Posted by HerolGee

yeah I specifically am referring to the body giving ALL the wbo titles historcially less weight than the major boxing body counterparts.. It wasnt me at any stage who was being division specific.

No it wasn't you, it was me asking why you thought a specific title in a specific division was worthless. If you'd just said "it's because the WBO didn't have any real legitimacy at the time" in the first place rather than accusing me of being Bailey we wouldn't be here now.

[Mind Reader]

Why argue against Calzaghe's own words? He never pushed for a Roy fight in his prime... He spoke it with his own words, but his actions spoke even louder..

What did he do to get it?

Nothing.

It was not Roy's job at that point in his day to go after Calzaghe... Roy went after Calzaghe when it was his job. And he got the fight.

Dominating undefeated Hanshaw, highly ranked Ajamu, and destroying ATG Tito Trinidad... Was more than enough for Joe to see Roy a threat, and a big money fight.

[HerolGee]

Originally Posted by MAJR

No it wasn't you, it was me asking why you thought a specific title in a specific division was worthless. If you'd just said "it's because the WBO didn't have any real legitimacy at the time" in the first place rather than accusing me of being Bailey we wouldn't be here now.

Bailey does have a lot of alts to swing polls his way.

[bailey]

[quote]

Originally Posted by dinovelvet

Baileys double standards agan.

Show me the double standards?

If Loudon assumes Joe meant millions by the crown jewels, which he more than likely did, and unless you know for fact that he didn't, which you dont, than that is just your opinion.

Correct. He doesnt know what Joe had in mind. Nobody does, so assumption means nothing other than that.
All irrellevant because he wasnt made an offer and Jones wanted 10mil. But of course that wasnt the crown jewels

The exact figure is of no bearing to anything and is just a tool for you to try ridicule Loudon.

Loudons doing it to himself by making assumptions where he has no idea and doesnt even get facts straight

Trying to get to the bottom of what the figure was will go nowhere. What it really meant was a price out.

How did Calzaghe price out when he wasnt offered anything?

By your method of proving how good a fighter is, if Kessler beat Froch and Froch beat Bute, than would Ward beat Bute?

Not sure what this alledged method of mine is. Probably now you making assumptions.
In answer to your question, we wont know as Ward didnt want to fight Bute

You evaluate Joe's record on that theory, which is clearly bullshit

Evaluate it for what it is. The greatest SMW ever

[MAJR]

Originally Posted by HerolGee

Bailey does have a lot of alts to swing polls his way.

Well, as far as this poll goes, I voted no weeks ago. Calzaghe would be a fool to come out of retirement to fight Ward.

[The Mangler]

No. He been out too long and he'd get worked.

[bailey]

[quote]

Originally Posted by Loudon

You're the only one arguing. I like Kessler. The thing with you is, you don't allow for circumstances, when you post facts like these. Roy was one of the greatest fighters who ever lived. Joe easily beat him. Does that mean that Joe was better than Roy, and Joe was one of the greatest fighters that's ever lived? Of course not. Joe was great, but he'll never be classed as one of the greatest ever, like Roy. Jirov was a good win for Toney.

Joe was better than Roy when they fought

What were Jirovs top 5 wins
Do answer

Ha! I asked a question after I'd argued my point. It didn't matter what the answer to the question was. The question was, did he beat Cummins for a vacant title?

You were talking world titles, not just a title

You laughed and said no. My point was, that Kessler was a good fighter, but he'd never beaten an elite fighter, going into the fight with Joe.

Alot of highly rated fighters havent. Take Ward who has been put in the top 5 P4P for example.
Fact is Calzaghe beat prime Kessler, who was on a run of good wins and undefeated. Weather you think his record of beating 5 SMW champs coming in is good or bad with 2 being champs and one former/soon to be champ again

That was my point that I was arguing. Cummins, Sciaca, Andrade, Mundine, beyer were all good but not GREAT WINS. That was my argument. It didn't matter if he beat Cummins for a vacant title or not. Stop being stupid. It's you who's showing himself up.

I think you showed yourself up with that mistake.
Cummings wasnt for a world title in any shape or form. Not sure why you keep bringing him up?

That's fair enough, but Eubank was an old 31, like Hearns and Ali were. It doesn't seem old, but he aged a lot quicker than most other fighters of similar age.

You say that to suit your agenda, but I would argue that Froch and Kessler are older, and not as good at 31 as Eubank was there and now watching Bute at around that age, it appears he isnt as good at 31 either

Correct. Carl Thompson was a strong guy, and Eubank pushed him really close twice. But the point still stands, that Eubank wasn't fully prepared, and he was at the end of his career.

How was Eubank not fully prepared?
He was much smaller and lighter and put weights in his pockets to appear heavier when weighing in with his clothes on.
Fact that escapes you is Eubank ran Thompson to a close decision and was ahead in the rematch before his eye injury ended matters. You forget that this was prime Thompson who when past best became the only fighter to beat unifed CW champ Haye. Tells you how good Eubank was and what a good win it was.

Tell me one SMW that you think could go straight up to CW and compete with a massive punching CW today? I admit it is tough to gaige and Thompson is a much harder hitter than any around today

Do you think Joe would have beaten the best versions of Eubank, Benn and Collins?

Yes.
In fact he agreed to meet Collins twice only for Collins to retire

The same applies here. My argument was that Grant got paid less than a million to fight Roy, and based on Joe's crown jewels comment, we know that he wouldn't have fought Roy for a under a million.

No you dont
Loudon you must be completely daft here.
You dont know what he would or wouldnt have taken especially as he wasnt offered.
BUT YOU DONT KNOW.

I said stick to facts and you go back to your opinion which means nothing as YOU DONT KNOW

The specific amount isn't important in the grand scheme of things. It doesn't matter if he got paid $10 or $900,000. My point was, Grant was willing to fight for a purse, that Joe wouldn't have fought for.

YOU DONT KNOW THAT.
He wasnt offered. You dont know that.
Loudon you are completely thick to go by on just assumptions that you dont know.
Perhaps he wouldnt have fought for the same as Grant got, as he was a bigger fighter, but YOU DONT KNOW THAT

If you think that Joe would have fought Roy for $300,000 when he'd said he'd want the crown jewels, then you're an idiot!

300K would be the crown jewels if you only get 50k a fight.
YOU DONT KNOW THAT.
How many more times do I have to let you know that you dont know what you are going on about?
Jones didnt make an offer.

I don't know the exact amount. So let me ask you. How much do you think he was talking about?

How can I answer that? Only he can say what he wanted, but fact is he wasnt offered.
I would guess he wants more than normal because its a bigger fight, but how much only he knows what he would/wouldnt take

Anyone with a brain can safely assume, that he was talking about more than a million.

Maybe BUT YOU DONT KNOW.
We do know Jones wanted 10mil.

You like to twist and turn things to suit your argument.

Where?
It is you who is making statements that you have no idea about

We don't need to know the exact figure that Joe would have wanted. Why? Because we know it would DEFINITELY have been more than what Grant, Frazier and Woods got. This is a safe assumption to make.

YOU DONT KNOW THAT
As said it probably would be, but he was a bigger fight and if you remember rightly Jones mentioned about Calzaghe after the Woods fight but still didnt make an offer. So Jones knew who he was and thought of it as a potential fight.
But im sure you can speak for whatever Jones or Calzaghe were thinking at that time

Once again, you copy and paste Joe's claims, but then when someone like me rips his ridiculous claims, the only thing you can say is, oh it was off the cuff. No it wasn't off the cuff. It was a fucking lie!

How was it a lie? JONES EVEN SAID IT.
Do you think they were both lying now

You're happy to claim that he CHASED Roy after McIntyre,

You are aware McIntyre was a late sub arent you?

but when I ask how? You can't answer!

Called him out, made an offer. The usual ways dummy.
Same as most do.
I answered but you didnt answer me.

What did O Grant do to call out Jones?

After McIntyre, Joe remained at 168, to fights the likes of Miguel Jiminez.

Not just Jimenez as you like to keep insinuating. Brewer a SMW champ was between those fights, and training for Brewer he was still calling out Jones and Hopkins.

HOW WAS STAYING AT 168, TO FIGHT THE LIKES OF MIGUEL JIMINEZ, GOING TO GET HIM A BIG MONEY FIGHT AGAINST ROY JONES, WHO WAS THE UNIFIED 175 CHAMPION??

He wasnt at home against Jiminez. Another mistake by you there.
Jiminez was a mandatory, but as said you dont note Brewer who was known in America, or Mitchell who was also who he both fought. See your bias agenda has been unravelled again.

Roy as unified champ was fighting Frazier, Kelly etc, so lets not pretend Jones may not have wanted a bigger fight

"I think I could give Roy Jones a tough fight. Maybe the toughest he's ever had. But I know what my CAPABILITIES are, and unless I got paid the Crown Jewels, I wouldn't want it."

Fair comment. He wants good money for a big fight.
Do you think he wanted 10mil like Jones?
He was calling Jones out and his team made an offer, so he obviously was interested just wanted to be paid more than normal which he should have been

Now does that sound like he was talkng about millions, or a few hundred grand? I know you like an argument, but don't be thick!

Depends what he was getting and YOU DONT KNOW!!
YOU DONT KNOW WHAT HE WOULD FIGHT FOR

Fact is, Joe wanted huge money, when outside of Europe, he was relatively unknown.

Known enough for Jones to mention him when he was training for Woodhall, only for Jones to change his mind.
Known enough for Jones to mention him before he fought Sheika.
Known enough for Jones to mention him after he beat Woods

Forget that Loudon. tell me if you did, or was that just selective?

That's also a bad analogy. Why would Joe be offered ten times his normal amount to fight Roy?

I didnt say he would be. I noted that if someone was getting 50k a fight and said they wanted the crown jewels to fight fighter x and was offered 500k, they would probably take it as its far more than normal to what they get paid. Its not millions as you try and make out.
I was trying to give an example to this intelligent guy that he could understand

What do you think would have happened, if Joe had've been offered $900,000 to fight Roy? Do you think he'd have accepted it?

I deleted the bit about Woods and Frazier etc but as you know Grant wasnt a Jones mandatory .
As for if he was offered 900k, I dont know, but YOU DONT KNOW either, we know Jones wanted 10 mil

I said stick to facts and for this intelligent guy you based your arguement on your personnal thoughts again