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Old 01-31-2008, 10:06 PM   #1
Amsterdam
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Default Let's get a consensus list of all of fighters...

That fought at 135-147 that would smoke Floyd Joy Boy at his best at these weights.

I'll add them as they are listed and discussed.
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Old 01-31-2008, 10:10 PM   #2
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Default Re: Let's get a consensus list of all of fighters...

My list between 130 and 147.

Red- I would favor them
Blue- 50/50 fight

Azumah Nelson- 130
Hector Camacho- 130-135
Julio Cesar Chavez-
130-135-140
Henry Armstrong- 130-147
Alexis Arguello- 130-135
Pernell Whitaker- 135-147
Roberto Duran- 135-147
Carlos Ortiz- 135-140
Beau Jack- 135
Duilio Loi- 140
Wilfred Benitez- 140-147
Aaron Pryor- 140
Oscar De La Hoya- 140-147
Ray Robinson- 147
Ray Leonard- 147
Emile Griffith- 147
Jose Napoles- 140-147
Kid Gavilan- 147
Tommy Hearns- 147
Donald Curry- 147
Felix Trinidad- 147
Mickey Walker- 147
Charley Burley- 147
Miguel Cotto- 147
Paul Williams-147
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Old 01-31-2008, 10:12 PM   #3
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Default Re: Let's get a consensus list of all of fighters...

Thankyou for taking the time to list out a list of fantastic fighters that would serve Floyd either an extremely tough fight, or a loss, or even a 'getting smoked' loss SP.

But before we list them, let's get some discussion going and see a general consensus view.
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Old 01-31-2008, 11:10 PM   #4
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Default Re: Let's get a consensus list of all of fighters...

Barney Ross
Tony Canzoneri
Billy Graham
Lou Ambers
Carmen Basilio
Ted Kid Lewis
Sammy Angott
Beau Jack
Meldrick Taylor
Jackie Kid Berg
Shane Mosley
Luis Rodriguez
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Old 02-01-2008, 12:18 AM   #5
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Default Re: Let's get a consensus list of all of fighters...

Barney Ross is red of couse. We all should know that. The Pride of the Ghetto. He was for real. first man to hold 3 weight titles at the same time. He did it 4 or so years before Herny Armstrong would repeat the feat.
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Old 02-01-2008, 03:22 AM   #6
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Default Re: Let's get a consensus list of all of fighters...

Benny Leonard and Joe Gains at 135 could also beat him.
I don't see anyone "smoking" Mayweather. I think a win over Mayweather would be hard earned.
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Old 02-01-2008, 04:41 AM   #7
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Default Re: Let's get a consensus list of all of fighters...

I can only assume this thread is going to be turned back on the classic forum in some way, given that the thread starter believes any modern fighter beats any fighter who fought longer than twenty years ago in a first round KO, so I don't know how seriously I should be taking it.

Nevertheless, I think,

Pep would beat Floyd at 130lbs, not as rock solid techniquely, but I think his fluidity and courage would see him squeak out a decision,

Aaron Pryor at 140lbs is a good bet, you can't counterpunch against that sort of perpetual motion.

I'd take Floyd over Duran or Armstrong - I don't think Armstrong had the handspeed and recklessness of Pryor, something which would usually favour him, but not against a fighter of Floyds nature.

The only current fighter from 130-147lbs who has a chance of beating Floyd is Paul Williams, and that's only a marginal chance based on him being, stature-wise, a ridiculously big welterweight.

Cotto has NO chance. He's a better fighter than Hatton, but he's not a better PRESSURE fighter. Hatton has remarkably quick footwork which enabled him to get on the inside Vs Floyd, he just was just outboxed when he got there. Cotto would attempt to put the pressure on Floyd, but he's just too flatfooted and methodical to trouble him, not to mention he's never been difficult to catch clean.

Thomas Hearns is an interesting one, I think I'd have to favour him for similar reasons to Paul Williams, only he's a much better puncher who held his own at lightheavy of course.

Ray Robinson at 147lbs, I would favour 70/30. Ray Leonard at 147lbs, I would favour by even greater odds. His speed of hand and foot would overwhelm Floyd.

Some interesting ones have been suggested, like Meldrick Taylor, but I'm not neccessarily convinced. I'd probably favour Floyd 65/35 for his better overall skillset, if slightly slower.

As for Ross, Canzoneri etc, haven't seen enough to judge accurately. However, another interesting one is Kid Chocolate, who from what I've seen was good enough to trouble anybody. Skill, speed, power and scintillating on his feet, I'd love to pit him against Floyd in a mythical matchup.
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Old 02-01-2008, 06:00 AM   #8
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Default Re: Let's get a consensus list of all of fighters...

Quote:
Originally Posted by ripcity
Benny Leonard and Joe Gains at 135 could also beat him.
I don't see anyone "smoking" Mayweather. I think a win over Mayweather would be hard earned.
Gans would get smoked. I am not convinced Leonard wins or is competitive either.
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Old 02-01-2008, 06:01 AM   #9
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Default Re: Let's get a consensus list of all of fighters...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sizzle
I can only assume this thread is going to be turned back on the classic forum in some way, given that the thread starter believes any modern fighter beats any fighter who fought longer than twenty years ago in a first round KO, so I don't know how seriously I should be taking it.

Nevertheless, I think,

Pep would beat Floyd at 130lbs, not as rock solid techniquely, but I think his fluidity and courage would see him squeak out a decision,

Aaron Pryor at 140lbs is a good bet, you can't counterpunch against that sort of perpetual motion.

I'd take Floyd over Duran or Armstrong - I don't think Armstrong had the handspeed and recklessness of Pryor, something which would usually favour him, but not against a fighter of Floyds nature.

The only current fighter from 130-147lbs who has a chance of beating Floyd is Paul Williams, and that's only a marginal chance based on him being, stature-wise, a ridiculously big welterweight.

Cotto has NO chance. He's a better fighter than Hatton, but he's not a better PRESSURE fighter. Hatton has remarkably quick footwork which enabled him to get on the inside Vs Floyd, he just was just outboxed when he got there. Cotto would attempt to put the pressure on Floyd, but he's just too flatfooted and methodical to trouble him, not to mention he's never been difficult to catch clean.

Thomas Hearns is an interesting one, I think I'd have to favour him for similar reasons to Paul Williams, only he's a much better puncher who held his own at lightheavy of course.

Ray Robinson at 147lbs, I would favour 70/30. Ray Leonard at 147lbs, I would favour by even greater odds. His speed of hand and foot would overwhelm Floyd.

Some interesting ones have been suggested, like Meldrick Taylor, but I'm not neccessarily convinced. I'd probably favour Floyd 65/35 for his better overall skillset, if slightly slower.

As for Ross, Canzoneri etc, haven't seen enough to judge accurately. However, another interesting one is Kid Chocolate, who from what I've seen was good enough to trouble anybody. Skill, speed, power and scintillating on his feet, I'd love to pit him against Floyd in a mythical matchup.
You'd favor Floyd over Duran, but take Pep over Floyd? Let's just say I strongly disagree.
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Old 02-01-2008, 06:29 AM   #10
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Default Re: Let's get a consensus list of all of fighters...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sweet Pea
You'd favor Floyd over Duran, but take Pep over Floyd? Let's just say I strongly disagree.
Styles makes fights. Floyd is just a bad style match up for Duran. Too much movement, too much handspeed , and overall boxing ability. Duran never did match well against pure boxers that knows how to keep thier distance and stay on the outside. He beat Leonard the first time because he frustrated him and sucked him into a brawl. I see Floyd staying far on the outside (the way he did with Corales) avoiding exchanges and boxing smart. Competitive fight no doubt and Duran has his moments, but Mayweather prevails by close descision.
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Old 02-01-2008, 06:34 AM   #11
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Default Re: Let's get a consensus list of all of fighters...

Floyd Mayweather and Henry Armstrong would be a great fight and Amstrong has the perfect style to get it done but the question is would he be able to keep up that pressure for an entire fight? Tough one to call IMO. Armstrong has to be in Mayweather chest and stay there for the entire fight, and Mayweather has to keep his distance, counter effectivley and stay off of the ropes.
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Old 02-01-2008, 07:28 AM   #12
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Default Re: Let's get a consensus list of all of fighters...

Quote:
Originally Posted by slicksouthpaw16
Styles makes fights. Floyd is just a bad style match up for Duran. Too much movement, too much handspeed , and overall boxing ability. Duran never did match well against pure boxers that knows how to keep thier distance and stay on the outside. He beat Leonard the first time because he frustrated him and sucked him into a brawl. I see Floyd staying far on the outside (the way he did with Corales) avoiding exchanges and boxing smart. Competitive fight no doubt and Duran has his moments, but Mayweather prevails by close descision.
Totally disagree with your assessment here. Whenever someone has "taken it" to Mayweather he has either run away and looked average (e.g. the Jose Luis Castillo fights) or stood his ground and tried to let the other man tire out before coming on late (Chavez, Hatton).

If he is looking average running away from lead-foot Castillo how bad will he look with Duran on his trail?

He was losing rounds to no defense, no punch guys like Chavez and Hatton by trying to stand his ground, what happens when he meets a guy that punches much harder and can actually defend himself? I have an idea: he gets outworked and loses lopsidedly on points.
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Old 02-01-2008, 10:29 AM   #13
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Default Re: Let's get a consensus list of all of fighters...

Ray Robinson
Ray Leonard
Thomas Hearns
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Old 02-01-2008, 11:15 AM   #14
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Default Re: Let's get a consensus list of all of fighters...

Quote:
Originally Posted by slicksouthpaw16
Styles makes fights. Floyd is just a bad style match up for Duran. Too much movement, too much handspeed , and overall boxing ability. Duran never did match well against pure boxers that knows how to keep thier distance and stay on the outside. He beat Leonard the first time because he frustrated him and sucked him into a brawl. I see Floyd staying far on the outside (the way he did with Corales) avoiding exchanges and boxing smart. Competitive fight no doubt and Duran has his moments, but Mayweather prevails by close descision.
Duran would have seriously roughed Floyd up at 135 or 147. He would have made Floyd go into a defensive shell.
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Old 02-01-2008, 11:19 AM   #15
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Default Re: Let's get a consensus list of all of fighters...

I'll stick to fighters post-1960 for you Amsterdam

135
Roberto Duran
Pernell Whitaker
Carlos Ortiz
Julio Cesar Chavez

140
Aaron Pryor
Julio Cesar Chavez
Pernell Whitaker
Roberto Duran
Oscar De La Hoya
Wilfred Benitez

147
Emile Griffith
Jose Napoles
Sugar Ray Leonard
Thomas Hearns
Roberto Duran
Wilfred Benitez
Donald Curry
Felix Trinidad
Ike Quartey
Vernon Forrest
Oscar De La Hoya
Shane Mosley
Paul Williams
Miguel Cotto
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