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Old 11-13-2012, 06:10 AM   #76
Player3
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Default Re: Fat Dan: Wlad "one of the greatest heavyweight champions in history"

Nope. He barely rates historically. He'll be feintly remembered by boxing historians as a decent, somewhat talented Heavy, who has no notable or standout victories. And inherited the worst Heavyweight division of the past 80-90 years... And also as that big boring robot who got KO'd by Deontay Wilder in 1 rd.

In reality, Ross Puritty & Corrie Sanders completely destroyed any chance he had at having a respectable legacy.
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Old 11-13-2012, 06:24 AM   #77
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Default Re: Fat Dan: Wlad "one of the greatest heavyweight champions in history"

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Originally Posted by MAJR View Post
The problem in placing Wlad or Vitali in the top ten heavyweights of all time is the fact that they studiously avoided fighting their most dangerous potential opponent for the entire time the Klitschko's have been the dominant force in heavyweight boxing - that is to say, each other.

The dominance of the Klitschko's has been such that it has made thier era of heavyweight boxing appear weak in comparison and has given rise to the feeling that there are no potential challengers that are on their level.

In past era's the top active boxers in the heavyweight division fought each other - Patterson/Liston, Liston/Ali, Foreman/Fraizer, Ali/Fraizer, Ali/Foreman, Holmes/Witherspoon, Holmes/Spinks, Tyson/Spinks, Holyfield/Bowe, Tyson/Holyfield, Lewis/Holyfield, etc, etc - but in this one they dont because their brothers.

The career defining fight that would put one of the brothers in amungst the best of all time will never happen because they wont fight each other, so, to this date, the only career defining fight either brother has had is Vitali's valiant loosing effort against Lewis

In my opinion you cannot be in the top ten of all time if you dont fight the best opposition available to you, or, rather, if you make a point of openly avoiding a fight with the best potential opponent available to you.

So while I'm all for the idea of Wlad being the best now, and for him being in the top 20 or so all time greats, I cannot place him or Vitali in with the best of the best.
I rate Holmes and Lewis very high (Lewis as the GOAT for me)
But Holmes never unified and dropped a belt.
Lewis actively dodged/ducked/avoided southpaws
Bowe threw his belt in the trashcan so he didn't have to fight Lewis.
frazier and Norton never fought each other because they were friends.
Ingemar Johanson was scared of Liston
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Old 11-13-2012, 06:32 AM   #78
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Default Re: Fat Dan: Wlad "one of the greatest heavyweight champions in history"

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Originally Posted by Dan-Vano View Post
Every person you put no to has a better single win than Wlad, have more depth, and ultimately achieved more in the sport
wins against over the top name fighters, don't make for a better legcy
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Old 11-13-2012, 06:38 AM   #79
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Default Re: Fat Dan: Wlad "one of the greatest heavyweight champions in history"

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Originally Posted by Player3 View Post
Nope. He barely rates historically. He'll be feintly remembered by boxing historians as a decent, somewhat talented Heavy, who has no notable or standout victories.
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Old 11-13-2012, 06:43 AM   #80
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Default Re: Fat Dan: Wlad "one of the greatest heavyweight champions in history"

Well of course he is? It's not like he's saying he is THE greatest heavyweight, he is one of them.

My list;


Muhammad Ali
Lennox lewis
Joe fraizer
Larry Holmes
Mike tyson
Wladimir Klitschko
George Foreman
Vitali Klitscko
Joe Louis
Rocky marciano



And that's about it.
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Old 11-13-2012, 06:50 AM   #81
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Default Re: Fat Dan: Wlad "one of the greatest heavyweight champions in history"

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Originally Posted by Ahurath View Post
Well of course he is? It's not like he's saying he is THE greatest heavyweight, he is one of them.

My list;


Muhammad Ali
Lennox lewis
Joe fraizer
Larry Holmes
Mike tyson
Wladimir Klitschko
George Foreman
Vitali Klitscko
Joe Louis
Rocky marciano



And that's about it.
Nice to see Lennox that high.
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Old 11-13-2012, 07:08 AM   #82
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Default Re: Fat Dan: Wlad "one of the greatest heavyweight champions in history"

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Originally Posted by dyna View Post
I rate Holmes and Lewis very high (Lewis as the GOAT for me)
But Holmes never unified and dropped a belt.
Lewis actively dodged/ducked/avoided southpaws
Bowe threw his belt in the trashcan so he didn't have to fight Lewis.
frazier and Norton never fought each other because they were friends.
Ingemar Johanson was scared of Liston
That list was about the best heavyweight active at the time of specific fights, not of the best boxers of the era - which is why I did not add Lewis/Tyson to that list since Tyson was not one of the best active fighters at the time.

I dont rate Bowe in the top ten but in his first fight with Holyfield both of them were two of the best three active heavyweight - Lewis was the other - but his open ducking of Lewis and his extremely quick decline/short prime means he'll never be rated highly by me.

What southpaws did Lewis duck that were credible challenges to him?

Michael Moorer? He came along while Lewis was rebuilding his career after loosing to McCall and would get KOed by Foreman before Lewis reached the top again. Moorer was the IBF Champ while Lewis was still rebuilding and chasing the WBC Title and shortly after Lewis became WBC Champ again Moorer would loose his title to Holyfield. In 1994 they passed like ships in the night, Lewis loosing his title while Moorer won his, and in 1997 it they repeated the process but in reverse. Moorer fell into obscurity after his loss to Holyfield in 1997 and I dont recall him showing any interest in fighting Lewis anyway.


Chris Byrd? Lewis didn't see him as a challenge, the public weren't clammering for a fight and I recall reports of Don King paying Lewis $1million and giving him a car not to take the fight so he could protect his assest and make a unification fight between Ruiz and Byrd (which, obviously, didn't come about because Jones beat Ruiz). Bryd didn't make a big deal out of it either and was perfectly happy getting a title Lewis threw aside.

Who else?

As to the others, I'm not familiar enough with those era's to counter.
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Old 11-13-2012, 07:18 AM   #83
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Default Re: Fat Dan: Wlad "one of the greatest heavyweight champions in history"

Of course he is


Your a moron if you believe otherwise
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Old 11-13-2012, 07:22 AM   #84
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Default Re: Fat Dan: Wlad "one of the greatest heavyweight champions in history"

Top 15
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Old 11-13-2012, 07:24 AM   #85
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Default Re: Fat Dan: Wlad "one of the greatest heavyweight champions in history"

What does that make Corrie Sanders?
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Old 11-13-2012, 07:30 AM   #86
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Default Re: Fat Dan: Wlad "one of the greatest heavyweight champions in history"

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Originally Posted by Boom1989 View Post
What does that make Corrie Sanders?
Your point is ****ing idiotic


Pac has losses to Medgoen Singsurat and Rustico Torrecampo. That dosnt mean their anybody + Pac will be rembered as one of the greatest.


Wlad has dominated an era, and just like anyone who dominates an era will be remembered accordingly
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Old 11-13-2012, 08:38 AM   #87
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Default Re: Fat Dan: Wlad "one of the greatest heavyweight champions in history"

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Originally Posted by oibighead View Post
Wlad has dominated an era, and just like anyone who dominates an era will be remembered accordingly
Exactly HOW has Wlad "dominated an era" when he's NEVER beaten the second best HW of said era?

Care to explain?
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Old 11-13-2012, 08:43 AM   #88
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Default Re: Fat Dan: Wlad "one of the greatest heavyweight champions in history"

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Originally Posted by Nay_Sayer View Post
Exactly HOW has Wlad "dominated an era" when he's NEVER beaten the second best HW of said era?

Care to explain?
He beat Haye
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Old 11-13-2012, 08:48 AM   #89
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Default Re: Fat Dan: Wlad "one of the greatest heavyweight champions in history"

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Originally Posted by dyna View Post
He beat Haye
Since when has Haye been the second best HW in the world?
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Old 11-13-2012, 08:51 AM   #90
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Default Re: Fat Dan: Wlad "one of the greatest heavyweight champions in history"

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Originally Posted by Nay_Sayer View Post
Since when has Haye been the second best HW in the world?
Since Vitali is overrated.
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