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View Poll Results: ESB's 2012 "Fighter Of The Year"
Nonito Donaire 80 30.42%
Andre Ward 35 13.31%
Sergio Martinez 36 13.69%
Danny Garcia 57 21.67%
Brian Viloria 7 2.66%
Abner Mares 6 2.28%
Robert Guererro 4 1.52%
Adrien Broner 11 4.18%
Other 27 10.27%
Voters: 263. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 11-15-2012, 12:58 PM   #121
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Default Re: ESB's 2012 "Fighter Of The Year"

Donaire for me. Even if he didn't look very impressive at pointsóWV Jr., Mathebula fightsóhe fought all the top guys outside of Rigondeaux, who he'll likely fight in 2013 (I hope!), and if he beats Arce, he'll have 4 wins this year! It's rare to see a top 5 P4P guy fight so often. I think he's a shoe-in.
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Old 11-15-2012, 01:07 PM   #122
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Default Re: ESB's 2012 "Fighter Of The Year"

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For me, Sergio Martinez.

He beat Macklin, who is entirely under-rated at Middleweight considering he beat Sturm in all but the final result. Then to dominate Chavez Jr - a giant at the weight, so thoroughly was impressive.

Donaire has been active but looked average against Vazquez Jr and Mathebula.

Garcia scored two thrilling knockouts, but Morales was well past his best.

Ward has only had one fight, and, as superb as it was, that isn't enough for me.
Sergio also looked average vs Macklin, and got dropped real hard by Chavez. Chavez was a giant vs Zbik as well, but didn't manage to drop him, and maybe should have lost on fair cards. Macklin is not underrated for Sturm, more like over, that was his only noteable fight. Lots of second raters have a claim at beating Sturm
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Old 11-15-2012, 03:23 PM   #123
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Default Re: ESB's 2012 "Fighter Of The Year"

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Sergio also looked average vs Macklin, and got dropped real hard by Chavez. Chavez was a giant vs Zbik as well, but didn't manage to drop him, and maybe should have lost on fair cards. Macklin is not underrated for Sturm, more like over, that was his only noteable fight. Lots of second raters have a claim at beating Sturm
Macklin put an end to El****, Asikainen and Alcine within a combined 5 round period. Then he goes to Germany and does damn near as good a job as Geale did, but doesn't get the decision. Suddenly people are harking on about Golovkin (as much as I like GGG) when his best win is a guy who was one fight removed from a defeat to Kerry Hope!??

Macklin is a quality middleweight, I'd say the 3rd best in the world, much better than either Vazquez Jr or Mathebula at their respective weights. Martinez struggled with him as he should have done, before knocking him out pretty spectacularly.

Then Chavez Jr, one of the biggest men middleweight has ever seen, and Martinez dominates him for 11 rounds, before getting too brave, going down and surviving to take a comfortable points win. A fight many thought would be close, and one punch aside, it was utterly one-sided.

Donaire's knockout over a tentative, aging Nishioka and Garcia's over a Khan, a man culpable to being timed and hurt, do not best Martinez' work.
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Old 11-15-2012, 03:32 PM   #124
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Macklin put an end to El****, Asikainen and Alcine within a combined 5 round period. Then he goes to Germany and does damn near as good a job as Geale did, but doesn't get the decision. Suddenly people are harking on about Golovkin (as much as I like GGG) when his best win is a guy who was one fight removed from a defeat to Kerry Hope!??

Macklin is a quality middleweight, I'd say the 3rd best in the world, much better than either Vazquez Jr or Mathebula at their respective weights. Martinez struggled with him as he should have done, before knocking him out pretty spectacularly.

Then Chavez Jr, one of the biggest men middleweight has ever seen, and Martinez dominates him for 11 rounds, before getting too brave, going down and surviving to take a comfortable points win. A fight many thought would be close, and one punch aside, it was utterly one-sided.

Donaire's knockout over a tentative, aging Nishioka and Garcia's over a Khan, a man culpable to being timed and hurt, do not best Martinez' work.
Sure they do, Donaire will have fought 4 times winning 3 titles in his 4th division, vs 3 top 10 fighters at least, including the guy rated #1. It's no contest.

Look, Chavez has been a joke for years, only started getting a little respect after dispatching far fringe Lee. He got very fortunate against another scrub, featherfisted Zbik. That MD is his only Ring top 10 rated win.

By listing Asikainen, El**** and Alcine as good wins you're pretty much conceding Macklin's resume is very thin. How you have him above Vazquez or Mathebula, I have no idea. I'm pretty sure they would not be eeking out wins over the likes of Varon, Ajetovic, ancient Campas.
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Old 11-15-2012, 03:34 PM   #125
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Default Re: ESB's 2012 "Fighter Of The Year"

Garcia.
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Old 11-15-2012, 03:39 PM   #126
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Default Re: ESB's 2012 "Fighter Of The Year"

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Sure they do, Donaire will have fought 4 times winning 3 titles in his 4th division, vs 3 top 10 fighters at least, including the guy rated #1. It's no contest.

Look, Chavez has been a joke for years, only started getting a little respect after dispatching far fringe Lee. He got very fortunate against another scrub, featherfisted Zbik. That MD is his only Ring top 10 rated win.

By listing Asikainen, El**** and Alcine as good wins you're pretty much conceding Macklin's resume is very thin. How you have him above Vazquez or Mathebula, I have no idea. I'm pretty sure they would not be eeking out wins over the likes of Varon, Ajetovic, ancient Campas.
Who are Mathebula and Vazquez's best wins? I'm not even going to argue with you over who is the better win, Macklin by knockout or Mathebula or Vazquez by points wins, it should be clear. Did you watch the Mathebula fight? Donaire - by his standards, looked mince.

Chavez - Zbik was a competitive fight that could have gone either way, what makes you think Julio was fortunate? I'm no idiot, I've seen little Chavez' career pan out, I understand where people ridicule him and their reasons for doing so. But for a guy who was never even meant to be a Middle (Martinez) to beat Chavez as handily as he did, pretty good.

I commend Donaire for being active, but the numbers mean nothing to me, I don't care if it's his 6th weightclass, the only real quality opponent he faced was Nishi and, as seen in the fight itself, he is on the slide.
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Old 11-15-2012, 03:40 PM   #127
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Default Re: ESB's 2012 "Fighter Of The Year"

Who voted for Broner? Get 'em out of here.
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Old 11-15-2012, 03:41 PM   #128
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Default Re: ESB's 2012 "Fighter Of The Year"

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Who voted for Broner? Get 'em out of here.
Money.
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Old 11-15-2012, 03:45 PM   #129
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Who are Mathebula and Vazquez's best wins? I'm not even going to argue with you over who is the better win, Macklin by knockout or Mathebula or Vazquez by points wins, it should be clear. Did you watch the Mathebula fight? Donaire - by his standards, looked mince.

Chavez - Zbik was a competitive fight that could have gone either way, what makes you think Julio was fortunate? I'm no idiot, I've seen little Chavez' career pan out, I understand where people ridicule him and their reasons for doing so. But for a guy who was never even meant to be a Middle (Martinez) to beat Chavez as handily as he did, pretty good.

I commend Donaire for being active, but the numbers mean nothing to me, I don't care if it's his 6th weightclass, the only real quality opponent he faced was Nishi and, as seen in the fight itself, he is on the slide.
If you count Sturm as a win for Macklin, I'll count Ring top 10 p4p, unified titlist Caballero at 122 for Mathebula. It was about as close as Sturm Macklin, except Math was not out on his feet in rd 12
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Old 11-15-2012, 04:02 PM   #130
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Default Re: ESB's 2012 "Fighter Of The Year"

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If you count Sturm as a win for Macklin, I'll count Ring top 10 p4p, unified titlist Caballero at 122 for Mathebula. It was about as close as Sturm Macklin, except Math was not out on his feet in rd 12
I've never actually seen that fight. Nonetheless, I don't count Sturm as a win for Macklin, he did everything but get the result, as I said. Macklin is closer to his prime than Mathebula is though and, like I said Donaire looked horrible against Mathebula. He hurt him but did not/could not close the show.

I favour Martinez' more spectacular performances over Donaire's consistency and activity.
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Old 11-15-2012, 04:06 PM   #131
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Default Re: ESB's 2012 "Fighter Of The Year"

With one month away (Dec) is there still some fighter's out there that may qualify for the award that nobody has mentioned as of yet??

Broner/DeMarco winner?
"What If" Guerrero beats Berto, Does he qualify?
Ect...

*BTW Wladamir should have been in my poll as an option.
(****ed up)
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Old 11-15-2012, 04:32 PM   #132
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Default Re: ESB's 2012 "Fighter Of The Year"

No clear winner, but I think Doniare is the front runner just due to activity.

I'd follow up with Martinez at #2. Garcia, Klitschko and Ward round out the top 5.
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Old 11-15-2012, 08:40 PM   #133
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Default Re: ESB's 2012 "Fighter Of The Year"

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I've never actually seen that fight. Nonetheless, I don't count Sturm as a win for Macklin, he did everything but get the result, as I said. Macklin is closer to his prime than Mathebula is though and, like I said Donaire looked horrible against Mathebula. He hurt him but did not/could not close the show.

I favour Martinez' more spectacular performances over Donaire's consistency and activity.
Spectacular? He fought twice, made hard work of ham and egger Macklin, and barely made it out on his feet versus Chavez. When have you EVER seen Donaire in that kind of trouble?

And how the hell is Mathebula out of prime? He'd just won a world title, something Macklin may never accomplish.
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Old 11-15-2012, 08:48 PM   #134
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Default Re: ESB's 2012 "Fighter Of The Year"

It's gotta be Donaire.
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Old 11-15-2012, 08:50 PM   #135
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Default Re: ESB's 2012 "Fighter Of The Year"

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Spectacular? He fought twice, made hard work of ham and egger Macklin, and barely made it out on his feet versus Chavez. When have you EVER seen Donaire in that kind of trouble?

And how the hell is Mathebula out of prime? He'd just won a world title, something Macklin may never accomplish.
Look, at the end of the day it is a matter of opinion. I'm not going to go shouting should Donaire pick the award up.

Donaire's performance against Vazquez was okay. His performance against Mathebula was poor. His performance against Nishioka was good, he struggled to find openings against a hesitant and aging opponent, but finished him off in the end with aplomb. Arce, well he's tailor made for Donaire, and very much past his prime.

Donaire has not fought Mares, he has not fought Rigondeaux. In essence, his activity has been impressive, but did he fight the men people were calling for him to fight? No. Did he win spectacularly in any of these fights? No.

Martinez fought two quality fighters, in their primes, when people (at least in Chavez' case) were calling for them. There's an argument to be made for both, but I just favour Martinez' two performances over Donaire's three.
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