Packey McFarland - Page 2

Senya13 · 11-24-2012, 03:17 AM

If we go by when he became the best lightweight out there head-to-head, then, probably, Freddie Welsh bout on July 4, 1908, whish proved that Packey could do good in long-distance bouts, not just the short ones. Although some writers still doubted he could win over Nelson or Wolgast in a 45-round fight, but admitted in a 10-round or shorter bout neither of the two would have a chance.

Ray Bronson 20-round draw? McFarland finished much the stronger of the two, although not being able to finish his opponent, who weakened considerably somewhere around the 15th round and held a lot, trying to survive, may count against Packey's chances.

20-round draw with Welsh? McFarland forced the fight in every round and finished much the stronger of the two.

20-round bout with Tommy Murphy? Many were disappointed with his chances after this bout also, as usual claiming Packey didn't show the punch necessary to become a champion. He won practically every round, but claimed he injured his right wrist around the 13th round, and was generally not feeling well during his training there and during the fight. Both fought furiously till the end, although both were tired.

All in all, I don't think the long-distance would be that much of a disadvantage for Packey if he could persuade either Nelson or Wolgast to drop the condition of weighing in at 133 pounds ringside.

As for the punch, he said in some interviews that once he gets a championship fight, he'd not try to save his hands in that one. It's not like Nelson or Wolgast were big punchers themselves.

lufcrazy · 11-24-2012, 04:26 AM

like for instance I know McFarland was never the world champion but to put into a modern context:

Igarashi is the lineal world champion at flyweight but when viloria beat Marquez I don't think anyone would doubt he's the best flyweight out there.

Would you say the same is true when packer beat welsh? That gave him the credence of the best lightweight?

Senya13 · 11-24-2012, 06:12 AM

Officially, he didn't beat Welsh. I don't have time to look through the clippings, but after Packey's return to USA, the day he was to fight Dick Hyland, NY Times wrote:

"So far as condition is concerned, Packey McFarland, whom many good judges of pugilism believe to be the ablest lightweight in the business"

NY Sun writer (could be Hanna or Villa, I'm not sure who wrote "current sporting gossip" column at the time), wrote after the fight his opinion that if McFarland were allowed to weigh in at 135 pounds at 3 PM "He would probably have outpointed Wolgast with ease in a ten round bout"

lufcrazy · 11-24-2012, 06:44 AM

Cheers mate.

Senya13 · 11-24-2012, 06:48 AM

It'd be more difficult to find quotes from 1908, as Nelson beat Gans and McFarland drew with Welsh on the same day, there are too many write-ups. Had McFarland received the decision over Welsh, in all probability he'd have been the next opponent for Nelson.

lufcrazy · 11-24-2012, 07:33 AM

All in all he must rank very highly atg.

he also spent a while as the best WW imo after beating Bronson. Plus he beat the beat mw in the world in mike gibbons (some reports say bartfield beat him prior but I've read conflicting storied and see it more like a draw).

Shame he never got the fight with wolgast nor nelson.

Senya13 · 11-24-2012, 08:08 AM

Based on what I've seen, I also have Bartfield-Gibbons a draw.

lufcrazy · 11-24-2012, 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Senya13

Based on what I've seen, I also have Bartfield-Gibbons a draw.

I did come across a scathing report but it just seemed wholly biased against mike. Saying he lost clearly to soldier, packey and Lewis. It also referred to Lewis as a second rate welterweight!

Senya13 · 11-24-2012, 09:53 AM

I have

Bartfield: Brooklyn Daily Eagle, Brooklyn Citizen, Brooklyn Standard Union, Brooklyn Times (searched by Jack Kincaid).
Gibbons: NY Sun, George B. Underwood (NY Press).
Draw: NY Tribune, NY Times, NY Evening World, AP, other New York City newspapers (searched by Jack Kincaid).

lufcrazy · 11-25-2012, 07:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Senya13

I have

Bartfield: Brooklyn Daily Eagle, Brooklyn Citizen, Brooklyn Standard Union, Brooklyn Times (searched by Jack Kincaid).
Gibbons: NY Sun, George B. Underwood (NY Press).
Draw: NY Tribune, NY Times, NY Evening World, AP, other New York City newspapers (searched by Jack Kincaid).

yeah I had the 4 brooklyn as they're mentioned on boxrec. the rest seemed to paint a draw more than anything else like you say.

11-24-2012, 03:17 AM	#16
Senya13 Belt holder ESB Addict Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Russia Posts: 3,299 vCash: 1210	Re: Packey McFarland If we go by when he became the best lightweight out there head-to-head, then, probably, Freddie Welsh bout on July 4, 1908, whish proved that Packey could do good in long-distance bouts, not just the short ones. Although some writers still doubted he could win over Nelson or Wolgast in a 45-round fight, but admitted in a 10-round or shorter bout neither of the two would have a chance. Ray Bronson 20-round draw? McFarland finished much the stronger of the two, although not being able to finish his opponent, who weakened considerably somewhere around the 15th round and held a lot, trying to survive, may count against Packey's chances. 20-round draw with Welsh? McFarland forced the fight in every round and finished much the stronger of the two. 20-round bout with Tommy Murphy? Many were disappointed with his chances after this bout also, as usual claiming Packey didn't show the punch necessary to become a champion. He won practically every round, but claimed he injured his right wrist around the 13th round, and was generally not feeling well during his training there and during the fight. Both fought furiously till the end, although both were tired. All in all, I don't think the long-distance would be that much of a disadvantage for Packey if he could persuade either Nelson or Wolgast to drop the condition of weighing in at 133 pounds ringside. As for the punch, he said in some interviews that once he gets a championship fight, he'd not try to save his hands in that one. It's not like Nelson or Wolgast were big punchers themselves.
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11-24-2012, 04:26 AM	#17
lufcrazy requiescat in pace East Side VIP Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: England, Up North Posts: 22,708 vCash: 330	Re: Packey McFarland like for instance I know McFarland was never the world champion but to put into a modern context: Igarashi is the lineal world champion at flyweight but when viloria beat Marquez I don't think anyone would doubt he's the best flyweight out there. Would you say the same is true when packer beat welsh? That gave him the credence of the best lightweight?
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11-24-2012, 06:12 AM	#18
Senya13 Belt holder ESB Addict Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Russia Posts: 3,299 vCash: 1210	Re: Packey McFarland Officially, he didn't beat Welsh. I don't have time to look through the clippings, but after Packey's return to USA, the day he was to fight Dick Hyland, NY Times wrote: "So far as condition is concerned, Packey McFarland, whom many good judges of pugilism believe to be the ablest lightweight in the business" NY Sun writer (could be Hanna or Villa, I'm not sure who wrote "current sporting gossip" column at the time), wrote after the fight his opinion that if McFarland were allowed to weigh in at 135 pounds at 3 PM "He would probably have outpointed Wolgast with ease in a ten round bout"
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11-24-2012, 06:44 AM	#19
lufcrazy requiescat in pace East Side VIP Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: England, Up North Posts: 22,708 vCash: 330	Re: Packey McFarland Cheers mate.
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11-24-2012, 06:48 AM	#20
Senya13 Belt holder ESB Addict Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Russia Posts: 3,299 vCash: 1210	Re: Packey McFarland It'd be more difficult to find quotes from 1908, as Nelson beat Gans and McFarland drew with Welsh on the same day, there are too many write-ups. Had McFarland received the decision over Welsh, in all probability he'd have been the next opponent for Nelson.
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11-24-2012, 07:33 AM	#21
lufcrazy requiescat in pace East Side VIP Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: England, Up North Posts: 22,708 vCash: 330	Re: Packey McFarland All in all he must rank very highly atg. he also spent a while as the best WW imo after beating Bronson. Plus he beat the beat mw in the world in mike gibbons (some reports say bartfield beat him prior but I've read conflicting storied and see it more like a draw). Shame he never got the fight with wolgast nor nelson.
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11-24-2012, 08:08 AM	#22
Senya13 Belt holder ESB Addict Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Russia Posts: 3,299 vCash: 1210	Re: Packey McFarland Based on what I've seen, I also have Bartfield-Gibbons a draw.
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11-24-2012, 09:53 AM	#24
Senya13 Belt holder ESB Addict Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Russia Posts: 3,299 vCash: 1210	Re: Packey McFarland I have Bartfield: Brooklyn Daily Eagle, Brooklyn Citizen, Brooklyn Standard Union, Brooklyn Times (searched by Jack Kincaid). Gibbons: NY Sun, George B. Underwood (NY Press). Draw: NY Tribune, NY Times, NY Evening World, AP, other New York City newspapers (searched by Jack Kincaid).
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