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Old 02-05-2008, 01:16 PM   #1
SteveO
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Default Sonny Liston v. Larry Holmes

15 rounds (if that matters).
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Old 02-05-2008, 03:59 PM   #2
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Default Re: Sonny Liston v. Larry Holmes

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Originally Posted by SteveO
15 rounds (if that matters).
Liston's jab counters Larry's jab.

Liston can hurt Holmes, Holmes can't hurt Liston.

Liston by split decision.
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Old 02-05-2008, 04:22 PM   #3
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Default Re: Sonny Liston v. Larry Holmes

Holmes I believe was a more fundamentally sound fighter than Ali. He had a harder jab and was a more powerful puncher. However, he was not as athletically gifted as Ali, did not have as good a chin as Ali, not was he as fast as Ali. You cannot quantify the gifts that Ali had. Having said that, I think this is an awesome matchup. In their respective, absolute primes I would take Liston. His jab was on par with Holmes and Holmes could be hit.

Liston by decision
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Old 02-05-2008, 05:02 PM   #4
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Default Re: Sonny Liston v. Larry Holmes

liston win but i think a peak holmes takes him the distance
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Old 02-05-2008, 05:22 PM   #5
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Default Re: Sonny Liston v. Larry Holmes

My instinct is that Liston would close the show at some point.

Liston was a virtuoso ring general. He thought on his feet. My guess is that he would put Holmes in trouble and close the deal.
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Old 02-05-2008, 06:28 PM   #6
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Default Re: Sonny Liston v. Larry Holmes

Liston late knockout.
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Old 02-05-2008, 06:28 PM   #7
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Default Re: Sonny Liston v. Larry Holmes

Very interesting fight. Holmes is a bit susceptible to big right hands, but Liston's weakness seemed speed. Both would trouble each other a lot. I think much depends on how calm Holmes' approach is. When he knew he was in with a dangerous puncher (Cooney), he played it safe from a distance, based on speed and footwork. I think he'd do the same against Liston and befuddle him. How does Liston's heart hold up? We know Holmes can dig deep, deep and pull out the win.

Liston quit rather easily on his stool after 6 light rounds, right after his most impressive ring perfomance against Patterson. Liston may have the longer wingspan, but i don't think their actual reach will differ by much. Williams, who stood 6'3 80" on film has longer arms than Liston, so it's not implausible that Holmes has at least equal or a longer reach. On top of that, Holmes has top speed and great timing, which is at least as important; especially for the jab.

I would go with Holmes by decision.
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Old 02-06-2008, 10:10 AM   #8
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Default Re: Sonny Liston v. Larry Holmes

I believe I've already posted my prediction regarding this particular match-up. I got Holmes winning by close-- likely contested-- decision.

Anytime Holmes lags, falls back or hesitates, Liston's jab would ram hard into his face or chest area. By the end of 15, Larry would probably appear the worse from wear, but the verdict should go his way.

The reason I don't see him cruising to victory like Ali cruised against a poorly-conditioned Liston is speed and variety. While Holmes was a multi-lateral ring mover (something Ali rarely was), he was not as speedy or as creative. He was textbook. You only needed to go one direction against Liston anyway and that was to the left and fast.
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Old 02-06-2008, 10:13 AM   #9
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Default Re: Sonny Liston v. Larry Holmes

Holmes, split decision. After recovering from a KD (maybe two).
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Old 02-06-2008, 10:15 AM   #10
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Default A question to those picking Holmes

A question to those picking Holmes????????????

What strategy should Liston use to maximise his chances??????????
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Old 02-06-2008, 10:28 AM   #11
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Default Re: Sonny Liston v. Larry Holmes

Larry has superior fighting heart, better speed, a slight edge in durability and a jab on a par with Liston's. Skill wise close call, although Liston has that edge in power.

I think Liston should try and lure Holmes into traps and an out-and-out slugfest (deviate him from his gameplan, break his rythmn etc), although Holmes was immensely tough and never a quitter he didn't quite fave anybody with Listons strength and brutality (especially midrange in close).

I think extremely wary of Liston's greatness in this regard that Larry would box safely (not without risk of course) on the outside behind the jab with minimal risk, move out of range from Liston big right hand and would do enough eck out a narrow decision. Tough fight for both.

Last edited by boxingcar; 01-31-2007 at 08:43 AM.
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Old 02-06-2008, 10:45 AM   #12
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Default Re: Sonny Liston v. Larry Holmes

Quote:
Originally Posted by Holmes' Jab
Larry has superior fighting heart, better speed, a slight edge in durability and a jab on a par with Liston's. Skill wise close call, although Liston has that edge in power.

I think Liston should try and lure Holmes into traps and an out-and-out slugfest (deviate him from his gameplan, break his rythmn etc), although Holmes was immensely tough and never a quitter he didn't quite fave anybody with Listons strength and brutality (especially midrange in close).

I think extremely wary of Liston's greatness in this regard that Larry would box safely (not without risk of course) on the outside behind the jab with minimal risk, move out of range from Liston big right hand and would do enough eck out a narrow decision. Tough fight for both.
I think the key to wining it for Liston would be to go to the body at range while cutting down the ring. If he is suficiently dogged in doing this he might eventualy grind Holmes down and close the deal.

He might have to conceed some early rounds in order to win.
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Old 02-06-2008, 10:57 AM   #13
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Default Re: Sonny Liston v. Larry Holmes

Quote:
Originally Posted by janitor
I think the key to wining it for Liston would be to go to the body at range while cutting down the ring. If he is suficiently dogged in doing this he might eventualy grind Holmes down and close the deal.

He might have to conceed some early rounds in order to win.

Fair post. The possibility certainly isn't to be discounted.
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Old 02-06-2008, 10:58 AM   #14
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Default Re: Sonny Liston v. Larry Holmes

Quote:
Originally Posted by janitor
I think the key to wining it for Liston would be to go to the body at range while cutting down the ring. If he is suficiently dogged in doing this he might eventualy grind Holmes down and close the deal.

He might have to conceed some early rounds in order to win.
Exactly what I was about to type although I have many misgivings regarding Sonny's powers of 'cutting off the ring'. If he gets in a good amount of body work, Holmes would be in far worse form than even the Norton fight.
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Old 02-06-2008, 11:16 AM   #15
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Default Re: Sonny Liston v. Larry Holmes

It's quite facinating (though not a bad thing, of course) to see how Liston's reputation has improved so much over the years.
You could say the same about Larry, but it's been such a renaissance for Liston over time.
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