Nacho: Pacquiao-Marquez is not a Toe-To-Toe fight

[divac]

Originally Posted by this_and_that

No.

Firstly, both of them have good footwork.
Even JMM acknowledges this.

What Pac was saying is he knows he can't catch JMM cleanly unless they brawl.
All of his KD's of JMM was because JMM was lured into a brawl.
It has absolutely nothing to do with ring cutting because JMM doesn't "run" per se.
He's just in front of Pac all night long. i.e. He's not gonna pull a Mosley.

Learn some boxing.

Convince the hardcore Pactards of what you just correctly said!

[Farmboxer]

Is Marquez and Nacho counting on the PEDS from their new conditioning coach? I mean this guy testified against his own so-called friends to save his own arse. He knew how to cheat the drug tests. If I were Roach I would have canceled the fight until drug tests could be in place that can detect Marquez' new coach drugs. If he is still using them. How else did Marquez gain so much muscle/weight in such a short time? Hiring a known drug cheat? Is that their strategy?

[Doc]

Originally Posted by divac

Exactly! Pacquiao is calling for toe to toe action, yet it was he in various parts of all three fight, and especially in the first fight, who was being driven to cover when Marquez countered him unmercifully and chased Pacquiao aggressively to the ropes!

Nacho is right. Pacquiao attacks in a short quick burst and then steps back to reset. He's never been a toe to toe fighter, but since he could'nt find Marquez in their last fight to land a clean hard punch, he's now asking Marquez to stand still.

Pacquiao- "Its not fair that Marquez does'nt stand still for me, I am Manny Pacquiao and I say stand still for the fans!"

Marquez stand the fuck still act your age and get ktfo, plz we can't beat u unless u do us this favor thanksm

[IsaL]

Pacquiao is quite the athlete, but needless to say he's a fucking moron, and very ignorant too. I've heard from Pacturds he only went to school until the 1st grade... Hence the reason why he has been exploited by everyone in his circle, from Arum, to Ariza, to that other asshole that isn't shit... And Pacquiao's fans must be bigger fucking morons to support Pacquiao's stupidity and for really considering him for office in the stinky PI.

[divac]

Originally Posted by IsaL

Pacquiao is quite the athlete, but needless to say he's a fucking moron, and very ignorant too. I've heard from Pacturds he only went to school until the 1st grade... Hence the reason why he has been exploited by everyone in his circle, from Arum, to Ariza, to that other asshole that isn't shit... And Pacquiao's fans must be bigger fucking morons to support Pacquiao's stupidity and for really considering him for office in the stinky PI.

C'mon bro, we can all have fun picking on eachother but keep the race calling out of it, thats not cool.

I'll add I know lots of people without a school education that are common sense smart. Lets not go there either, its not needed as far as I'm concerned.

[SuperHut]

Originally Posted by hofbrau

Nacho said he doesn't expect Pacquiao vs. Marquez to be a toe to toe encounter - because the styles of the two fighters would never allow for such a scenario.

"This can never be a toe to toe fight. It can never be that way because of their styles. Marquez is a smart boxer and Pacquiao doesn't fight toe to toe either. Pacquiao attacks his opponent and then pulls back. He doesn't stand toe to toe. He attacks his opponent, pulls back and makes them feel comfortable and then he jumps on them again and hurts them,"

"We just have to be smart [with our strategy to get the knockout]. If Pacquiao wants to come in all wild and reckless, trying to get a knockout, that's better for us. But we are going to fight smart," said Nacho.

Interesting...

Before the 3rd fight, Nacho said the wild and reckless Pacquiao was a pain in the ass because wild and reckless made Pacquiao unpredictable.

[divac]

Originally Posted by SuperHut

Interesting...

Before the 3rd fight, Nacho said the wild and reckless Pacquiao was a pain in the ass because wild and reckless made Pacquiao unpredictable.

Nacho has said the reckless wild Pacquiao is harder to handle. If Pacquiao boxes its an easy night for Marquez.
However, since Nacho know Marquez needs a knockout to get an official win, the reckless Pacquiao gives Marquez a better chance to catch Pacquiao coming in with something big and score a KO!

[SuperHut]

Originally Posted by divac

Nacho has said the reckless wild Pacquiao is harder to handle. If Pacquiao boxes its an easy night for Marquez.
However, since Nacho know Marquez needs a knockout to get an official win, the reckless Pacquiao gives Marquez a better chance to catch Pacquiao coming in with something big and score a KO!

I agree that if Manny tries to be a "boxer", it will make things easier for Marquez.

As for Manny going in wild and reckless, it also increases Manny's chances to land something big on Marquez to score the knockout.

This is a good fight. The history of boxing encyclopedia is going to devote an entire chapter to their series.

[Skilletscuz]

Originally Posted by hofbrau

Nacho said he doesn't expect Pacquiao vs. Marquez to be a toe to toe encounter - because the styles of the two fighters would never allow for such a scenario.

"This can never be a toe to toe fight. It can never be that way because of their styles. Marquez is a smart boxer and Pacquiao doesn't fight toe to toe either. Pacquiao attacks his opponent and then pulls back. He doesn't stand toe to toe. He attacks his opponent, pulls back and makes them feel comfortable and then he jumps on them again and hurts them,"

"We just have to be smart [with our strategy to get the knockout]. If Pacquiao wants to come in all wild and reckless, trying to get a knockout, that's better for us. But we are going to fight smart," said Nacho.

aye... thats what makes these two fighters styles so compelling when together. Its a conflict but also a chess match on both sides. Neither sides want to stay in the pocket long and both disengages in their own way.

Pacquiao can have a better chance of winning by staying in the pocket longer and taking more risks. Because counter-punchers attempts to limit 1 punch against them at a time, while managing and minimizing small 2-3 punch bursts. Pacquiao can't expect to outbox Marquez in that way and he'll need to hit a minimum of 60+ punches to expectedly win a round. When Marquez limits him down to 50- punches, Marquez will win that round.

[Skilletscuz]

Originally Posted by divac

Nacho has said the reckless wild Pacquiao is harder to handle. If Pacquiao boxes its an easy night for Marquez.
However, since Nacho know Marquez needs a knockout to get an official win, the reckless Pacquiao gives Marquez a better chance to catch Pacquiao coming in with something big and score a KO!

imo, i feel the judges will have pressure to make a different route BECAUSE of the history of the judging. I feel if its a close fight, Marquez will get the nod this time, because that's human nature.

I feel the deck is kinda stacked against Pacquiao in winning. I think Marquez would get a close decision.... so its best to work for a KO. But Pacquiao had dropped him 4 times over w/o too much effect in the longterm of the fight. He's gonna have to more aggressive than ever to get that KO or a strong win in his favor. And there's a good chance Marquez will catch him with an unrecoverable punch with that...

[yingyang]

This fight would be the same as the 3rd fight. Boring as fuck. Pac aint gonna bring nothing new to this fight Ped's or no Ped's. JMM wants this fight more than Manny.

Manny doesnt have the intelligence of floyd to beat JMM.

[divac]

Originally Posted by SuperHut

I agree that if Manny tries to be a "boxer", it will make things easier for Marquez.

As for Manny going in wild and reckless, it also increases Manny's chances to land something big on Marquez to score the knockout.

This is a good fight. The history of boxing encyclopedia is going to devote an entire chapter to their series.

I agree, I knockout is more probable on either side if Pacquiao is wild and reckless.

If you have'nt watched all three fight, take a look at the first two fights, they're going ot be replaying them this week I think on HBO.
Take note that when Pacquiao gets aggressive, Marquez fights fire with fire and its Pacquiao who ends up backing up when the exchanges get up close.
As soon as they touch shoulders, Pacquiao backs out to reset. Its from there that Marquez starts to circle to his left away from Pacquiao's straight left.
Most of the time Pacquiao comes in reckless, Marquez drives him back with hard, clean, crisp, combinations.
Marquez would keep on throwing those combos if Pacquiao stayed on the inside and was'nt bothered by Marquez' connects.
But because Pacquiao is bothered, he wont stay on the inside, he backs out both hands to his face not wanting to taste what Marquez is dishing.

Dont take my word for it, check it out.

[divac]

Originally Posted by Skilletscuz

imo, i feel the judges will have pressure to make a different route BECAUSE of the history of the judging. I feel if its a close fight, Marquez will get the nod this time, because that's human nature.

I feel the deck is kinda stacked against Pacquiao in winning. I think Marquez would get a close decision.... so its best to work for a KO. But Pacquiao had dropped him 4 times over w/o too much effect in the longterm of the fight. He's gonna have to more aggressive than ever to get that KO or a strong win in his favor. And there's a good chance Marquez will catch him with an unrecoverable punch with that...

The fight was'nt close last time and one judge had it 8 rounds to 4 for Pacquiao. Just ridiculous!
There are many here on ESB that agree with me that its difficult to point to a round that Pacquiao clearly won in fight 3 because there is'nt one.

[SuperHut]

Originally Posted by divac

I agree, I knockout is more probable on either side if Pacquiao is wild and reckless.

If you have'nt watched all three fight, take a look at the first two fights, they're going ot be replaying them this week I think on HBO.
Take note that when Pacquiao gets aggressive, Marquez fights fire with fire and its Pacquiao who ends up backing up when the exchanges get up close.
As soon as they touch shoulders, Pacquiao backs out to reset. Its from there that Marquez starts to circle to his left away from Pacquiao's straight left.
Most of the time Pacquiao comes in reckless, Marquez drives him back with hard, clean, crisp, combinations.
Marquez would keep on throwing those combos if Pacquiao stayed on the inside and was'nt bothered by Marquez' connects.
But because Pacquiao is bothered, he wont stay on the inside, he backs out both hands to his face not wanting to taste what Marquez is dishing.

Dont take my word for it, check it out.

Yes. I have seen all three fights. Marquez is very good at firing combinations when he is countering Pacquiao and I believe Marquez knows that countering Pacquiao with combinations is the key to victory.

That is why this fight/series is more interesting to me than if Pacquiao were fighting Mayweather. I think Pacquiao would beat Mayweather to a bloody pulp and even knock him out, even though Mayweather played with Marquez. And the reason is in Marquez uses combination punches as his counter to Pacquiao.

Mayweather would do the same thing Mosley and Bradley did. Just back away until safely out of Pacquiao's reach while at the same time, out of reach to land any of their own punches. And when counters would present themselves, they would only throw one or two punches at the most then go back to defense and running away from the action.

Marquez knows it takes balls and skill to fight Manny effectively and that is why after 3 fights and a 0-2-1 record against Pacman, the public is still interested in a 4th fight.

[divac]

Originally Posted by SuperHut

Yes. I have seen all three fights. Marquez is very good at firing combinations when he is countering Pacquiao and I believe Marquez knows that countering Pacquiao with combinations is the key to victory.

That is why this fight/series is more interesting to me than if Pacquiao were fighting Mayweather. I think Pacquiao would beat Mayweather to a bloody pulp and even knock him out, even though Mayweather played with Marquez. And the reason is in Marquez uses combination punches as his counter to Pacquiao.

Mayweather would do the same thing Mosley and Bradley did. Just back away until safely out of Pacquiao's reach while at the same time, out of reach to land any of their own punches. And when counters would present themselves, they would only throw one or two punches at the most then go back to defense and running away from the action.

Marquez knows it takes balls and skill to fight Manny effectively and that is why after 3 fights and a 0-2-1 record against Pacman, the public is still interested in a 4th fight.

If the 3rd fight with Marquez told us anything about what could transpire for Pacquiao against Mayweather, it showed that Pacquiao becomes even more clueless when the pace is slowed and punches in two's and three's from the opponent becomes the norm.

Marquez swiveled and played with waist movments more than he had done the two previous fights. He incorporated less combinations into the 4's and 5's and concentrated more on a better defense, parrying and riding with the shots (something that Mayweather is much more versed that Marquez is) and it turned out to be the consensus easiest fight of the three for Marquez.