The Black Murderers Row - rank them

[jaffay]

Charley Burley
Lloyd Marshall
Holman Williams
Joe Carter
Jack Chase
Tiger Wade
Bert Lytell
Eddie Booker

Rank them basing on their talent and achievments. I know that Burley will be #1 for most of you guys but I wonder what do you think about other great BMR fighters.

[My2Sense]

Originally Posted by jaffay

Charley Burley
Lloyd Marshall
Holman Williams
Joe Carter
Jack Chase
Tiger Wade
Bert Lytell
Eddie Booker

I'd say the best BMR member is the one not on there: Jimmy Bivins.

As for the ones you listed:

1. Williams
2. Marshall
3. Burley
4. Booker
5. Chase
6. Lytell
7. Wade
8. Carter

[bodhi]

1. Williams, Burley
2. Marshall, Bivins
3. Booker
4. Lytell, Carter
5. Chase
6.Wade

[PowerPuncher]

Depends if you want to include Charles/Moore. I'd rank on H2H, natural size, overall legacy and resume. The problem is the Row has a group of fighters ranging from Welters to LHWs and William and Kid started at LW. You also have the likes of Oakland Billy Smith, Baroudi, Hogue

Burley
Williams
Marshall
Bivins (great H2H but he was bigger)
Booker
Chase
Lytell
Shorty Hogue
Wade
Carter

I find Cocoa Kid very hard to rate, you never know if he was losing because he was taking a dive or because it was on the level. As a whole you cant be sure on that for most of the era

[jaffay]

Originally Posted by My2Sense

I'd say the best BMR member is the one not on there: Jimmy Bivins.

As for the ones you listed:

1. Williams
2. Marshall
3. Burley
4. Booker
5. Chase
6. Lytell
7. Wade
8. Carter

[Minotauro]

1. Williams
2. Burley
3. Marshall
4. Bivins
5. Booker
6. Chase
7. Lytell
8. Carter
9. Wade

Not sure if I should have Marshall at two many of the guys are close, I'll stick with this for now.

[Legend X]

Ezzard Charles and Archie Moore ought to be among that group.


I think Lloyd Marshall, Jimmy Bivins and Ezzard Charles were the best. Three of the greatest at 160-175 of all-time.
But then Burley and Williams were a bit smaller.

[frankenfrank]

p4p ?
Charley Burley
Eddie Booker
Lloyd Marshall
Bert Lytell
Holman Williams
Jimmy Bivins

fitting Charles , Cream and Wright in :
Charles and Cream r p4p swappable and will b also swappable with Booker , which means each 1 of them 3 will b no lower than #4 in d combined list and no higher than #2 .
Wright resides below Booker and above Marshall which means #5 in d combined list .
h2h :
Cream
Charles
Burley
Booker
Wright
Marshall
Bivins
Lytell
Williams

4 a measure of interchronological perspective i'd say that p4p Doug Jones ranks lower than Burley but is also interchangable with Charles , Cream and Booker and i actually rank him above them but can bare disagreements on this .

h2h i think that if he did 2 young Clay what he did and lasted as much as he did against Chuvalo and Frazier , i think it's safe 2 say that he would have given Rocco Markegiano more problems than Wright gave him and Floyd Patterson more problems than either Wright , Rademacher or Joey Maxim gave him which means he could very well defeat Patterson and a stoppage is not out of d question .
All of these Doug Jones thoughts were brought in order 2 put Wright , Charles , Cream etc in their correct place historically and 2 answer some of their worshippers' exaggeration . They were greats who fought each other but so was Doug Jones except that he fought d more formidable opposition . His opponents were bigger than theirs in average , not icluding Cream's .

[lufcrazy]

I need to look further into detail regarding most of them bu tI have a hard time splitting burley and williams.

[PowerPuncher]

Originally Posted by lufcrazy

I need to look further into detail regarding most of them bu tI have a hard time splitting burley and williams.

Burley got the better of their series despite official results

[SLAKKA]

I would argue Holman Williams days as a lightweight qualify him as best pound 4 pound.

[lufcrazy]

Originally Posted by PowerPuncher

Burley got the better of their series despite official results

yeah after stopping him he was robbed, i'm aware of that. but both did really well in sharing the war time era.

from aug 42 till apr 46 I have Burley on top of the division for 19 months and Williams on top for 16 months.

both seemed to beat the same sorts of opponents.

basically saying it's not a given, imo, that burley ranks above williams.

[Vysotsky]

Originally Posted by My2Sense

I'd say the best BMR member is the one not on there: Jimmy Bivins.

As for the ones you listed:

1. Williams
2. Marshall
3. Burley
4. Booker
5. Chase
6. Lytell
7. Wade
8. Carter

People aren't even including Cocoa Kid yet he was 8-3-2 i believe against Holman Williams