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Old 01-01-2013, 12:26 AM   #136
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Default Re: Greatest Middleweight once and for all- Greb? Monzon? Hagler?

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I'm glad we settled this once and for all
exactly: kelly pavlik
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Old 01-01-2013, 04:29 AM   #137
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Default Re: Greatest Middleweight once and for all- Greb? Monzon? Hagler?

hagler
monzon
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Old 01-01-2013, 05:49 AM   #138
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Default Re: Greatest Middleweight once and for all- Greb? Monzon? Hagler?

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Define middleweight.
Greb, or somebody of under 160lbs who is not as good!
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Old 01-01-2013, 07:17 AM   #139
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Default Re: Greatest Middleweight once and for all- Greb? Monzon? Hagler?

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Greb, or somebody of under 160lbs who is not as good!
j , the ultimate description of a middleweight....
P.S. HE WAS THAT GOOD !
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Old 01-01-2013, 02:04 PM   #140
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Default Re: Greatest Middleweight once and for all- Greb? Monzon? Hagler?

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Originally Posted by Surf-Bat View Post
C'mon Luf. I'm a Hagler fan, but Marvin does not have a single win that even remotely compares with Greb's wins over Walker, let alone Gibbons and several others.
I rate the hearns victory above both.
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Old 01-01-2013, 02:09 PM   #141
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Default Re: Greatest Middleweight once and for all- Greb? Monzon? Hagler?

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I rate the hearns victory above both.
I find this incomprehensible.
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Old 01-01-2013, 02:15 PM   #142
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Default Re: Greatest Middleweight once and for all- Greb? Monzon? Hagler?

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I find this incomprehensible.
Probably because you can't comprehend it.
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Old 01-01-2013, 02:18 PM   #143
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Default Re: Greatest Middleweight once and for all- Greb? Monzon? Hagler?

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Originally Posted by lufcrazy View Post
Probably because you can't comprehend it.
Not to take anything away from Hearns.

He was a great fighter at welterweight, jr middleweight and pound for pound, but did he realy do enough at middleweight to be classed as a great fighter at that weight, or career defining win?

Walker is one of the greatest middlweights who ever drew breath, and Gibbons is one of the greatest light heavyweights.
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Old 01-01-2013, 02:30 PM   #144
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Default Re: Greatest Middleweight once and for all- Greb? Monzon? Hagler?

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Not to take anything away from Hearns.

He was a great fighter at welterweight, jr middleweight and pound for pound, but did he realy do enough at middleweight to be classed as a great fighter at that weight, or career defining win?

Walker is one of the greatest middlweights who ever drew breath, and Gibbons is one of the greatest light heavyweights.
I'm starting to come round to the idea of placing more significance on a fighters abilities. Just something I'm mooting at the moment (my main reason for having Hagler first is achievement combined with a solid resume and a solid skillset)

I wouldn't necessarily say Hagler does have a better resume than Greb within the MW division by standard criteria but when you consider the h2h worth of an opponent at that weight I'm not sure Greb defeated anyone who I'd favour to beat Hearns.

As I said its not something I'm sold just something I'm beginning to consider. (fwiw i of course consider Walker a greater Mw than Hearns).
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Old 01-01-2013, 02:47 PM   #145
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Default Re: Greatest Middleweight once and for all- Greb? Monzon? Hagler?

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Originally Posted by lufcrazy View Post
I'm starting to come round to the idea of placing more significance on a fighters abilities. Just something I'm mooting at the moment (my main reason for having Hagler first is achievement combined with a solid resume and a solid skillset)

I wouldn't necessarily say Hagler does have a better resume than Greb within the MW division by standard criteria but when you consider the h2h worth of an opponent at that weight I'm not sure Greb defeated anyone who I'd favour to beat Hearns.

As I said its not something I'm sold just something I'm beginning to consider. (fwiw i of course consider Walker a greater Mw than Hearns).
Even if we go by the head to head criteria, Hearns beating Walker seems improbable, and Hearns beating Gibbons seems highly unlikley.
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Old 01-01-2013, 03:01 PM   #146
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Default Re: Greatest Middleweight once and for all- Greb? Monzon? Hagler?

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Originally Posted by janitor View Post
Even if we go by the head to head criteria, Hearns beating Walker seems improbable, and Hearns beating Gibbons seems highly unlikley.
Id favour him over both in mw contests.
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Old 01-01-2013, 03:15 PM   #147
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Default Re: Greatest Middleweight once and for all- Greb? Monzon? Hagler?

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Originally Posted by lufcrazy View Post
Id favour him over both in mw contests.
If I matched him against Mickey Walker, would you not pick Walker based on durability? Hearns didn't do to well at middleweight against people who could take his power.
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Old 01-01-2013, 03:21 PM   #148
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Default Re: Greatest Middleweight once and for all- Greb? Monzon? Hagler?

It's like this:
1. Monzon
2. Hagler
3. Greb
4. Whoever yoiu decide to choose....ditto all additional mentions.
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Old 01-01-2013, 03:25 PM   #149
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Default Re: Greatest Middleweight once and for all- Greb? Monzon? Hagler?

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Originally Posted by janitor View Post
If I matched him against Mickey Walker, would you not pick Walker based on durability? Hearns didn't do to well at middleweight against people who could take his power.
Good point. Check out Juan Roldan and the success he had against Tommy. Hurt him and rushed him off his feet before his lack of durability (and Tommy's crippling power) sealed his fate. Walker would charge in the same way, but Mick was a man who took it from heavyweights. I doubt Hearns is going to stop his charges. He's going to find Walker rushing just as furiously in the mid to late rounds as the early. Not sure Tommy could handle that sort of pressure for so long.
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Old 01-01-2013, 03:27 PM   #150
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Default Re: Greatest Middleweight once and for all- Greb? Monzon? Hagler?

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Originally Posted by Surf-Bat View Post
Good point. Check out Juan Roldan and the success he had against Tommy. Hurt him and rushed him off his feet before his lack of durability (and Tommy's crippling power) sealed his fate. Walker would charge in the same way, but Mick was a man who took it from heavyweights. I doubt Hearns is going to stop his charges. He's going to find Walker rushing just as furiously in the mid to late rounds as the early. Not sure Tommy could handle that sort of pressure for so long.
You make a good point as usual Surf-Bat.
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