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Old 01-14-2013, 05:38 PM   #31
mcvey
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Default Re: Post Johnson Fight Interview Proves Burns Did Not Have Jaundice

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Originally Posted by Mendoza View Post
If hitting Burns and flooring him on the break is "fighting fairly ", Mcvey, you are more delusional than I thought. Once again, watch the films. McIntosh did Burns no favors on film in this fight. Quite the opposite.

Besides McIntosh had limited experience as a ref prior to this fight.
McIntosh was Burns best friend, he had refereed the Lang /Burns world title fight just 3 months before.
If Burns was dissatisfied with McIntosh's refereeing ,one wonders why he accepted him as the third man two years later, when Burns fought Lang again , this time for the British Commonwealth and Empire title?

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Old 01-15-2013, 02:35 PM   #32
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Default Re: Post Johnson Fight Interview Proves Burns Did Not Have Jaundice

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mcvey says : After the Jeffries fight, Johnson said Burns gave him a harder fight than Jeffries.

Part of the problem here is we are talking about a known liar in Jack Johnson. What he says is often contracted by himself at a later date. In a way you two are similar.

“ In evaluating Burns, Johnson said he is the easiest man I ever meet. Page 231 “

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Which draws did Johnson say he held back in?
Read his auto bio. Its in there.
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Old 01-15-2013, 02:37 PM   #33
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Default Re: Post Johnson Fight Interview Proves Burns Did Not Have Jaundice

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Originally Posted by mcvey View Post
McIntosh was Burns best friend, he had refereed the Lang /Burns world title fight just 3 months before.
If Burns was dissatisfied with McIntosh's refereeing ,one wonders why he accepted him as the third man two years later, when Burns fought Lang again , this time for the British Commonwealth and Empire title?
McIntosh was the promoter, and a key for Burns getting paid. Stop ignoring the fact that he sucked as a ref, and did not warn Johnson for hitting on the break, which again can be seen on the FILM.
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Old 01-15-2013, 03:54 PM   #34
mcvey
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Default Re: Post Johnson Fight Interview Proves Burns Did Not Have Jaundice

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Originally Posted by Mendoza View Post
Part of the problem here is we are talking about a known liar in Jack Johnson. What he says is often contracted by himself at a later date. In a way you two are similar.

“ In evaluating Burns, Johnson said he is the easiest man I ever meet. Page 231 “

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Read his auto bio. Its in there.
Actually Im pretty sure he said, Burns is the easiest man I ever met .

Johnson "contracted himself", was he trying to appear smaller?



What would you call a fighter who asserts he was only beaten because of "drugged tea"? Honest Jeff? We have been over this before ,ad nauseum the paperback comic you refer to as Johnson's" autobiography " was NOT WRITTEN BY HIM .Entitled" Mes Combats " it is a three times translated collection of "as told to" fairy tales, with no credited collaborator. Johnson's autobiography is entitled" Jack Johnson In The Ring And Out" it is on my desk as I type.


Johnson's autobiography.


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NB This has an afterword by Damon Runyon ,and is a reprint.

It was written in1927 and reprinted in 1975.
Mine has an afterword by Gilbert Odd


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God bless you.
What a sad chump you are.

Last edited by mcvey; 01-15-2013 at 06:11 PM.
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Old 01-15-2013, 04:04 PM   #35
mcvey
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Default Re: Post Johnson Fight Interview Proves Burns Did Not Have Jaundice

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Originally Posted by Mendoza View Post
McIntosh was the promoter, and a key for Burns getting paid. Stop ignoring the fact that he sucked as a ref, and did not warn Johnson for hitting on the break, which again can be seen on the FILM.
Have you any idea how desperate you are to traduce Jack Johnson?



"Why dont you pass the time by playing a little solitaire"

Or masturbating to a Jim Jeffries photo.



Here brush up on yuor reading skills, you need it.




Jack Arthur Johnson, often called "Lil’ Arthur" and the "Galveston Giant" by his contemporaries, became heavyweight champion of the world in 1908. In so doing he destroyed the colored barrier by stopping Tommy Burns in 14 rounds to become the first black heavyweight boxing champion. He had a 10 year unbeaten streak during which time he defeated all of the top fighters of the period. He fought the other highly avoided black fighters of his day, including the clever master strategist Joe Jeannette 10 times, the hard punching Sam McVey 3 times, and gave the great Sam Langford a beating in their only meeting. His championship reign covered the years 1908-1915 when the giant “white hope” Jess Willard finally defeated him.
The Ring Magazine, in an article, The 50 greatest heavyweights of all time (1998 Holiday Issue p 32), said that Johnson was “years ahead of his time stylistically, he revolutionized boxing footwork, defense, and the concept of ring generalship.”
One cannot judge entirely on the available film as Randy Roberts wrote in Papa Jack, “Watching the films of Johnson is like listening to a 1900 recording of Enrico Caruso played on a 1910 gramophone. When Johnson fought Burns film was still in its early days, not yet capable of capturing the subtleties of movement. Nuance is lost in the furious and stilted actions of the figures, which move about the screen in Chaplinesque manner, as if some drunken cutter had arbitrarily removed three of every four frames. When we watch fighters of Johnson’s day on film, we wonder how they could be considered even good. That some of them were champions strains credulity. They look like large children, wrestling and cuffing each other, but not actually fighting like real boxers, not at all like Ali captured in zoom-lensed, slow-motion, technological grace. But the films mislead.”
[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]Consider that Nat Fleischer, the founder of Ring Magazine, who saw Johnson fight and those up to the Ali era, said, in his book Black Dynamite Vol 4., p. 6), “Jack Johnson boxed on his toes, could block from most any angle, was lightning fast on his feet, could feint an opponent into knots…he possessed everything a champion could hope for punch, speed, brains, cleverness, boxing ability and sharp-shooting.”
Fleischer also reported in 1958, that Johnson’s “mastery of ring science, his ability to block, counter, and feint, are still unexcelled.”
Jack Johnson is widely regarded as the greatest defensive heavyweight of all time. In recent years some revisionists have tried to downplay Johnson’s defensive capabilities, which is an injustice to both the man and those who saw him fight. The key to understanding the defensive mastery of men like Johnson, Joe Gans, and George Dixon comes in their ability to block an opponent's leads. That is where the old masters like Johnson truly shined. You have to jab to get inside and to set up your punches and they could block and pick off an opponent's jabs and counter. Trainer Eddie Futch said, that Ken Norton gave Ali 3 very tough fights because he knew how to block a jab with an open glove and counter-jab.
An interesting comparison can be made by looking at two different boxing training manuals one published in 2000 and the other published in 1943 (Naval Aviation Training Manual 1st edition). The old National Police Gazette’s often had famous boxers demonstrate their techniques. Some of these types of techniques can be seen in the Naval Aviator boxing manual but are absent from the modern instruction book. The modern manual is not at all bad showing parries, covering, and ducking, slipping, as well as shoulder and forearm blocks. The older book however also explains stopping (or pinning/trapping), cuffing, weaving, shifting (quick shift, drop shift, rear shift), folding, and open glove blocking –catching the opponent’s leads in the butt of the glove. The older masters had a greater variety of defensive techniques at their disposal than what is being taught in most gyms today.
It is noteworthy that although Johnson fought often and with only 5 ounce gloves, his defensive skills kept his face largely unmarked. This demonstrates his effectiveness as a defensive fighter.
John Durant wrote in The Heavyweight Champions of Johnson, “He was a genius in the ring. He was a flawless boxer with an almost perfect defense, and he could hit hard with either hand. A superb counter puncher, he was never off balance, always in position to hit, and he was a master of the art of feinting."
John McCallum stated, in his Encyclopedia, "Johnson was a reputation breaker. He could make most any opponent look bad, without looking invincible himself. It is doubted if the prize ring has ever known a more muscular champion. Yet despite his size, he used his colossal strength primarily for defense. He gave the lasting impression of always fighting under wraps of never going all out."
Johnson was like a bigger, stronger and more technically sound version of Roy Jones Jr, but with greater defensive capability. Johnson, like Jones was exceptionally fast, able to leap in with quick counters, was a strong puncher, and was a master feinter. His opponents were weary of his speed and power and he was able to dominate them without taking great risks. Unlike Jones, Johnson did not throw wide looping punches that exposed himself to counters, but instead held his hands properly and threw lightning quick straight punches outside and uppercuts safely from the inside.
Veteran fight manager Dan Morgan, who saw Johnson fight agrees, saying, "I had a feeling he could demolish an opponent any time he chose."
This fact is revealed by the descriptions given of some of his great fights with Sam McVey. In his second bout with Sam, billed as the "colored heavyweight championship", one reporter noted that McVey went through the "worst hell" ever witnessed in a Los Angeles prize ring. In their third meeting, Fleischer wrote, "It became pretty plain after the tenth round that Galveston Jack was the master." Mcvey took "blow after blow to the chin and Johnson kept sinking rights to the heart and left smashes to the stomach." McVey showed courage but, "In the twentieth round Jack decided he had punished Sam sufficiently and ended the contest with a right to the heart and a pretty left hook to the jaw." McVey took such a beating he decided he never wanted to face Johnson again.
Likewise, in his battle with Al Kaufman, the San Francisco Chronicle reported on Sep. 10, 1909 that "Kaufman badly whipped by Johnson in ten rounds. Kaufman hardly lays a glove on colored opponent, who is a marvel of cleverness." Johnson pitched a shut out, "All rounds for Johnson" the Chronicle reported.
[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]The biggest fight of his career was against former champion Jim Jeffries, who came out of a long 6-year retirement "to win the title back for the white race.” In the days preceding the fight Johnson predicted, “Jeffries can’t touch me.” This turned out to be the case as Johnson dominated the hulking former champion from the very first round. According to the July 5, 1910 Chronicle, “Round after round Johnson handled the burly Jeffries as he pleased” and stated Johnson “blocked every punch” that the former champion attempted to land. The Chronicle said it was Johnson’s “body blows” that wore down Jeffries and eventually resulted in a knockout victory for the splendid black heavyweight champion.
Historian and writer Gilbert Odd discussed Johnson's ability in The Great Champions, “Jack’s skill at leading, picking his punches and whipping in precision blows was unequaled, so too was his uncanny ability to deflect punches aimed at him or to make them miss by a fraction of an inch as he drew back his head. His left jab was straight and true, his right-cross sheer artistry, while his uppercuts were devastating. He was an expert at drawing an opponent into his blows, and of course, as they advanced so met with double impact, “They just knock themselves out”, he was fond of saying.”
Johnson also used some unique tactics in the ring. Mike Aoki wrote that Johnson liked to “shoot a punch at a foe’s bicep while the fellow began to launch a haymaker. This not only kept the blow from arriving, but it gradually numbed or paralyzed the arm.”
Jack Dempsey said of Johnson, “He was the greatest catcher of punches that ever lived (glove blocker). And he could fight all night. He was a combination of Jim Corbett and Louis. I’m glad I didn’t have to fight him.”
Trevor Wignall agrees saying, "He could box as well as fight. He was a tremendously hard hitter, while, for a man his size, he was amazingly swift on his feet."
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Old 01-15-2013, 06:08 PM   #36
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Default Re: Post Johnson Fight Interview Proves Burns Did Not Have Jaundice

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Originally Posted by Mendoza View Post
McIntosh was the promoter, and a key for Burns getting paid. Stop ignoring the fact that he sucked as a ref, and did not warn Johnson for hitting on the break, which again can be seen on the FILM.
Do you really think it would matter who refereed their fight?
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