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Old 01-04-2013, 02:21 AM   #1
Rise Above
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Default Jack Carroll

Anyone know where I can find footage of the great welterweight of the 1920's and 30's Jack Carroll?
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Old 01-04-2013, 02:54 AM   #2
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Default Re: Jack Carroll

I saw some footage in the That's Boxing DVD that was made by Grantlee Kieza I think. Grantlee is a sports writer at the Courier Mail, he may be able to direct you to where he got his footage from.
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Old 01-04-2013, 03:12 AM   #3
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Default Re: Jack Carroll

Yeah Ive got that DVD. I'll see if I can get in contact with Grantlee. Thanks mate.
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Old 01-04-2013, 03:49 PM   #4
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Default Re: Jack Carroll

If you have some success, any chance you might be able to throw it up on Youtube?? I'd love to see more of Carroll
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Old 01-04-2013, 04:35 PM   #5
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Default Re: Jack Carroll

I spoke with Grantlee last night and he has given me a number to call so if all goes well Ill definitely put it up on youtube mate.

Whats your thoughts on Carroll's career Bugger?
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Old 01-04-2013, 09:01 PM   #6
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Default Re: Jack Carroll

Cheers mate. Much appreciated.

He has a reputation of being our best from that era and one of the best we ever produced. Tall, lanky WW with a big punch and an awkward style. Wins over the bigger Henneberry and Richards speak volumes, but I must admit i do have trouble understanding the level of his competition, being from such a deep era, i am quite unfamiliar with alot of them.

Been learning about Jimmy Leto (Carroll beat him 3 times) who seems a genuinely tough fighter, has wins over Cocoa Kid and Charley Burley of the black murders row, as well as wins over Fritzie Zivik and Battling Battalino. Been meaning to start a thread in the classic forum to get a little more info on Leto.

Pretty sure Bep Van Klaveren was quite highly ranked (possibly 1 or 2??) when Carroll mopped the floor with him. Little by little i am starting to get a little more of a grasp on just how good some of these guys were that Carroll beat.

Its a shame that apparently a world title fight between Carroll and champion Barney Ross was all set to go right ahead here in Australia.... one of the conditions in the contract though was for Ross to recieve his guaranteed purse before leaving the USA. When Carroll's manager Charlie Lucas couldnt gain enough financial backing to pay the guaranteed purse upfront, Sam Pian, Ross' manager pulled the plug on the fight. After that attemp fell through, another promoter Jack Munro opened up talks with Pian again. Pian agreed to the original terms and Murro felt he could get the financial backing... but when he approached Carroll about it, he said that he wanted to stay loyal to his manager Lucas, so it didnt go any further than that... i believe he retired not long after that
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Old 01-04-2013, 09:34 PM   #7
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Default Re: Jack Carroll

Leto had some great wins as you mentioned. He also had a draw against Lou Ambers.

Van Klaveren was ranked as the number 1 contender to Ross' title when he came to Australia after he had beat Ceferino Garcia a few months prior.

Another great win was against Tod Morgan, who he beat twice. Morgan held the junior lightweight title for almost 5 years and although he was the smaller man he was the more experienced fighter when they fought with almost 150 bouts.

Jack Portney lost one and drew one with Carroll and he had a good record with a win over Benny Bass.

If only Carroll would have travelled or Ross had made the trip over here then we wouldnt have to think what if.

When I spoke with Grantlee yesterday he said that when he had interviewed Fred Hennebury, Fred didnt rate Carroll too highly, said he cut alot of guys with the laces of his gloves with that flicking left he used. Many thought that particular punch gave Jack an unfair advantage and would have been penalised if he had fought in America.

Either way he was a great talent and as far as Im concerned his potential went unfulfilled.

The bloke I need to speak to about the footage is on holidays till the 14th Jan so fingers crossed its out there and we get to see it. Would be good to decide for ourselves just how good Carroll was.
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Old 01-04-2013, 10:29 PM   #8
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Default Re: Jack Carroll

Be interested to find out what other footage he has. Would love to see some Ron Richards footage.
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Old 01-04-2013, 10:39 PM   #9
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Default Re: Jack Carroll

Cheers for the info RA. Some really interesting stuff there, i am always looking to learn a little more about these guys. Will check out Morgan and Portney.

Fred would have been a great guy to sit down and have a chat with... i reacon he'd have some pretty interesting opinions of some of the guys he fought too
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Old 01-04-2013, 10:43 PM   #10
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Default Re: Jack Carroll

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bwgcolman View Post
Be interested to find out what other footage he has. Would love to see some Ron Richards footage.


ohhhh id love to see more of Richards slapping seven shades of shit out of Gus Lesnivich.... that knock down he suffered was iincredible
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Old 01-04-2013, 10:45 PM   #11
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Default Re: Jack Carroll

The footage for the Thats Boxing dvd came from the ABC. The thought is that hopefully rather than just the highlights we seen there is footage of full fights available. Ill ask about Richards, Palmer, Henneberry footage too when I get in contact with this guy.

Hopefully they dont want some astronomical amount of money for the fights!
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Old 01-04-2013, 11:01 PM   #12
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Default Re: Jack Carroll

Someone mentioned to me once that due to the price of film, only short highlights were taken for the newsreel. Fingers crossed though.
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Old 01-04-2013, 11:48 PM   #13
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Default Re: Jack Carroll

Old film like that is usually considered of high cultural value and copies are normally kept in state libraries or the national library. The only problem is that you would have to physically go their to view it and you wouldn't be able to loan it
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Old 01-05-2013, 12:33 AM   #14
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Default Re: Jack Carroll

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bwgcolman View Post
Old film like that is usually considered of high cultural value and copies are normally kept in state libraries or the national library. The only problem is that you would have to physically go their to view it and you wouldn't be able to loan it
I kind of think this is going to be the case to be honest. I dont understand it though. I think if its such a valuable part of our cultural identity/history then why wouldnt they want more people to see it.

I guess Ill find out soon.
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Old 01-05-2013, 04:47 AM   #15
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Default Re: Jack Carroll

I read somewhere that Barney Ross was warned by Slapsie Maxie Rosenbloom (who fought here and saw Jack first hand) not to come to Australia to fight Carroll as not only would he lose his title he'd be cut to pieces.

Carroll by all accounts was a true featherfist but he had fast hands and great skills and often punched with his gloves open which caused cuts and led to the bulk of his stoppage victories.

He's largely forgotten by the general public now but in the Depression he used to pack out venues (ironically for a bloke who couldn't crack an egg) and was a source of pride for a country on it's arse much like the Don and Phar Lap.

A true legend.
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