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Old 01-25-2013, 05:11 PM   #1
ELECTRIC GURU
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Default The Jones-Tarver-Johnson-Woods-Dawson 175 era . . . . . . .

Was it one of the poorest standard 175 era's in boxing history?

Was the division just fortunate that it was hyped massively by HBO and the Ring Magazine just because it centred around American participants for the fans to focus upon?

One of the reasons i say this is because when the smoke had cleared, Tarver was sat as king of the era . . . . . . . yet looked what happened next :



- A 42 year old Hopkins made a 2 weight jump from 160 and dominated Tarver to become the main man at 175 in his first fight back at the weight

- Next a 36 year old Calzaghe moved up from 168 and in his 1st fight at the weight became the new king of the division

- Then when it looked like Dawson would be king of the 175 division, 168lb 'also ran' Jean Pascal moved up weight and owned Dawson to be the new king



What also adds weight to the sheer weakness of that 175 era was that after Glen Johnsons 1st loss to Hopkins at 160, Johnson then moved up to the tough 168 division and was passed around like a journey man, amassing 4 wins and 6 defeats at the weight before running away to the weak 175 era where Johnson handed out defeats to Tarver, Jones, and Woods and was considered unlucky versus Dawson.



Whats your thoughts on this?
Was this 175 era a really weak one that was just hyped and given some kind relevance because of the American tv coverage and Ring Magazine coverage it received?
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Old 01-25-2013, 05:42 PM   #2
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Default Re: The Jones-Tarver-Johnson-Woods-Dawson 175 era . . . . . . .

I consider Jones and Dawson to be from different eras. Jones was finished before Dawson made his rise.
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Old 01-25-2013, 05:53 PM   #3
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Default Re: The Jones-Tarver-Johnson-Woods-Dawson 175 era . . . . . . .

One things for certain. From 97-2006, it was a lot stronger than the 168 division that Joe stayed in!
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Old 01-25-2013, 06:00 PM   #4
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Default Re: The Jones-Tarver-Johnson-Woods-Dawson 175 era . . . . . . .

Calzaghe's rule with his paper lineal belt has to be the most weakest and cowardice reign in LHW history.

Just look at the LHW reign's of those you mentioned:-

Jones fought Johnson, Tarver, Hall, Hill, R Johnson, Woods
Tarver fought RJJ, Woods, Johnson, Hopkins, Dawson, Griffin (And called out Calzaghe)
Johnson fought RJJ, Woods, Cloud, Dawson, Griffin, Gonzales (And called out Calzaghe)
Woods fought RJJ, Tarver, Johnson, Cloud, Gonzales (And called out Calzaghe)
Dawson fought Tarver, Johnson, Pascal, Hopkins, Diaconu, Adamek (And called out Calzaghe)

Calzaghe fought Hopkins and RJJ then ran away from the sport.

Last edited by realsoulja; 01-25-2013 at 06:11 PM.
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Old 01-25-2013, 06:22 PM   #5
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Default Re: The Jones-Tarver-Johnson-Woods-Dawson 175 era . . . . . . .

WOW how suprising and original.........
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Old 01-26-2013, 09:47 AM   #6
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Default Re: The Jones-Tarver-Johnson-Woods-Dawson 175 era . . . . . . .

Quote:
Originally Posted by Loudon View Post
One things for certain. From 97-2006, it was a lot stronger than the 168 division that Joe stayed in!
What makes you say that Louden?

Glen Johnson is the perfect barometer and he was used as a punch bag in the tough 168 era, whilst it could be claimed that he was the main man in the entire Jones-Tarver-Johnson-Woods-Dawson 175 era.
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Old 01-26-2013, 09:52 AM   #7
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Default Re: The Jones-Tarver-Johnson-Woods-Dawson 175 era . . . . . . .

Quote:
Originally Posted by realsoulja View Post
Calzaghe's rule with his paper lineal belt has to be the most weakest and cowardice reign in LHW history.

Just look at the LHW reign's of those you mentioned:-

Jones fought Johnson, Tarver, Hall, Hill, R Johnson, Woods
Tarver fought RJJ, Woods, Johnson, Hopkins, Dawson, Griffin (And called out Calzaghe)
Johnson fought RJJ, Woods, Cloud, Dawson, Griffin, Gonzales (And called out Calzaghe)
Woods fought RJJ, Tarver, Johnson, Cloud, Gonzales (And called out Calzaghe)
Dawson fought Tarver, Johnson, Pascal, Hopkins, Diaconu, Adamek (And called out Calzaghe)

Calzaghe fought Hopkins and RJJ then ran away from the sport.
In some ways you're self-defeating yourself in this discussion because you are using the weak fighters that i already mentioned in the 175 era as though to prove that these fighters had strong resumes in this division.

Calzaghe's victory over Hopkins is perhaps the most significant victory the 175 division has seen for 20 years and neither of those 2 campaigned in the division until the latter stages of their careers, hence what a weak 175 era the Jones-Tarver-Johnson-Woods- Dawson era was.
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Old 01-26-2013, 10:07 AM   #8
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Default Re: The Jones-Tarver-Johnson-Woods-Dawson 175 era . . . . . . .

Tarver fought RJJ, Woods, Johnson, Hopkins, Dawson, Griffin (And called out Calzaghe)
Johnson fought RJJ, Woods, Cloud, Dawson, Griffin, Gonzales (And called out Calzaghe)
Woods fought RJJ, Tarver, Johnson, Cloud, Gonzales (And called out Calzaghe)
Dawson fought Tarver, Johnson, Pascal, Hopkins, Diaconu, Adamek (And called out Calzaghe)

Calzaghe fought Hopkins and RJJ then ran away from the sport.[/quote]

super joe would have schooled this lot easy
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Old 01-26-2013, 10:09 AM   #9
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Default Re: The Jones-Tarver-Johnson-Woods-Dawson 175 era . . . . . . .

The LHW division has been a barren wasteland for a long time, we had Jones and Darius who didn't want to fight each other

We had Tarver-Jones-Johnson fight each other with Hopkins (moving up 2 weight divisions) taking out Tarver who established himself as number 1, then Calzaghe in his first fight at LHW beating Hopkins. The likes of Johnson, Dawson, Pascal and a now 48 year old Hopkins have battled it out with no clear number 1 emerging.

The best LHW fight I've seen in recent years has been Cleverly-Bellew, these two could meet again as unified champions in the future. I hear Bellew is only 1 or 2 fights away from being Chad Dawson's mandatory? Another guy to look out for is Sergey Kovalev, in 18 months time I could see the LHW division looking like this:

1. Cleverly (unified champ)
2. Bellew (WBC champ)
3. Kovalev
4. Ward
5. Pascal


Look out for Saint George Groves to move up to LHW in the future as well, Groves-Cleverly could be a superfight on the horizon
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Old 01-26-2013, 12:44 PM   #10
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Default Re: The Jones-Tarver-Johnson-Woods-Dawson 175 era . . . . . . .

Quote:
Originally Posted by knockout artist View Post
The LHW division has been a barren wasteland for a long time, we had Jones and Darius who didn't want to fight each other

We had Tarver-Jones-Johnson fight each other with Hopkins (moving up 2 weight divisions) taking out Tarver who established himself as number 1, then Calzaghe in his first fight at LHW beating Hopkins. The likes of Johnson, Dawson, Pascal and a now 48 year old Hopkins have battled it out with no clear number 1 emerging.

The best LHW fight I've seen in recent years has been Cleverly-Bellew, these two could meet again as unified champions in the future. I hear Bellew is only 1 or 2 fights away from being Chad Dawson's mandatory? Another guy to look out for is Sergey Kovalev, in 18 months time I could see the LHW division looking like this:

1. Cleverly (unified champ)
2. Bellew (WBC champ)
3. Kovalev
4. Ward
5. Pascal


Look out for Saint George Groves to move up to LHW in the future as well, Groves-Cleverly could be a superfight on the horizon
Thats a well educated post and i find myself agreeing with much of it, the Cleverly victory over Bellew was an excellent one that will grow with time, much like the Groves victory over Degale that will appear an outstanding victory in 3 years time - How refreshing to see 4 highly respected prospects prepared to put their unbeaten records on the line at this stage up their career in such mouth-watering match-ups.

I don't think its beyond the realms of possiblity that in 4 years time the 175 rankings are

1 Cleverly
2 Degale
3 Groves
4 Bellew
5 Froch
6 Eubank Jnr
7 Kovalev
8 Pascal
9 Ward
10 Dawson
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Old 01-26-2013, 12:57 PM   #11
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Default Re: The Jones-Tarver-Johnson-Woods-Dawson 175 era . . . . . . .

Quote:
Originally Posted by knockout artist View Post
The LHW division has been a barren wasteland for a long time, we had Jones and Darius who didn't want to fight each other

We had Tarver-Jones-Johnson fight each other with Hopkins (moving up 2 weight divisions) taking out Tarver who established himself as number 1, then Calzaghe in his first fight at LHW beating Hopkins. The likes of Johnson, Dawson, Pascal and a now 48 year old Hopkins have battled it out with no clear number 1 emerging.

The best LHW fight I've seen in recent years has been Cleverly-Bellew, these two could meet again as unified champions in the future. I hear Bellew is only 1 or 2 fights away from being Chad Dawson's mandatory? Another guy to look out for is Sergey Kovalev, in 18 months time I could see the LHW division looking like this:

1. Cleverly (unified champ)
2. Bellew (WBC champ)
3. Kovalev
4. Ward
5. Pascal


Look out for Saint George Groves to move up to LHW in the future as well, Groves-Cleverly could be a superfight on the horizon
You really are a clown of the very hightest level, it must be said.
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Old 01-26-2013, 01:16 PM   #12
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Default Re: The Jones-Tarver-Johnson-Woods-Dawson 175 era . . . . . . .



Excellent thread that shows the quality of the poster.

That era was incredibly weak, and fighters that couldnt make it at SMW would jump to LHW and be called world class. It was that shocking, and the facts speak for themselves, dont they!

Jones wouldnt face the quality SMWs in Eubank, Collins, Benn, G-Man, Liles, Calzaghe etc, but would go on and compete at SMW without facing Michalczewski, Rocchigiani and Erdei.
Collins was saying in Boxing News this week how he couldnt get Jones to fight him, saying he wanted the fight and went round Jones house, climbed in the ring etc and Jones wouldnt face him. Now at 48 and inactive Jones seems willing to face him. Its that bad.

Johnson couldnt beat a single decent SMW yet goes up to LHW and becomes top man. Shocking

Woods who looked terrible in SMW fights, getting what some deemed a lucky decision against Baker, and beaten easily by D Starie, yet can go to LHW and fight evenly with G Johnson, who became the top LHW.
Work it out for yourselves

Dawson decided to not stay in the tougher SMW division then drops down and shows everyone why he didnt want to be a SMW.

Still that era did have some fantastic world champs that were very good.
Michalczewski, Erdei, Rocchigiani and they are 3 names that the above mentioned wouldnt go near.
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Old 01-26-2013, 01:19 PM   #13
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Default Re: The Jones-Tarver-Johnson-Woods-Dawson 175 era . . . . . . .

Quote:
Originally Posted by knockout artist View Post
The LHW division has been a barren wasteland for a long time, we had Jones and Darius who didn't want to fight each other

We had Tarver-Jones-Johnson fight each other with Hopkins (moving up 2 weight divisions) taking out Tarver who established himself as number 1, then Calzaghe in his first fight at LHW beating Hopkins. The likes of Johnson, Dawson, Pascal and a now 48 year old Hopkins have battled it out with no clear number 1 emerging.

The best LHW fight I've seen in recent years has been Cleverly-Bellew, these two could meet again as unified champions in the future. I hear Bellew is only 1 or 2 fights away from being Chad Dawson's mandatory? Another guy to look out for is Sergey Kovalev, in 18 months time I could see the LHW division looking like this:

1. Cleverly (unified champ)
2. Bellew (WBC champ)
3. Kovalev
4. Ward
5. Pascal


Look out for Saint George Groves to move up to LHW in the future as well, Groves-Cleverly could be a superfight on the horizon
Fantastic post and a very clear vision of the future rankings.
I dont think Groves will go up to LHW, but will be running SMW, while as you note, Cleverly and Bellew the leading LHW champs, who unlike Jones and Michalczewski, did meet and will do it again with their belts on the line, just like how Eubank and Benn met again
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Old 01-26-2013, 01:23 PM   #14
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Default Re: The Jones-Tarver-Johnson-Woods-Dawson 175 era . . . . . . .

Quote:
Originally Posted by ELECTRIC GURU View Post
Thats a well educated post and i find myself agreeing with much of it, the Cleverly victory over Bellew was an excellent one that will grow with time, much like the Groves victory over Degale that will appear an outstanding victory in 3 years time - How refreshing to see 4 highly respected prospects prepared to put their unbeaten records on the line at this stage up their career in such mouth-watering match-ups.

I don't think its beyond the realms of possiblity that in 4 years time the 175 rankings are

1 Cleverly
2 Degale
3 Groves
4 Bellew
5 Froch
6 Eubank Jnr
7 Kovalev
8 Pascal
9 Ward
10 Dawson
Very possible, these young fighters are coming through and coming on.
I think Froch may be retired, but wouldnt be shocked to see Campillo coming back from his heavy defeat and being at 10
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Old 01-26-2013, 01:26 PM   #15
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Default Re: The Jones-Tarver-Johnson-Woods-Dawson 175 era . . . . . . .

Quote:
Originally Posted by bailey View Post
Very possible, these young fighters are coming through and coming on.
I think Froch may be retired, but wouldnt be shocked to see Campillo coming back from his heavy defeat and being at 10
You think Bellew and Degale are going to take out Ward?
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