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Old 02-04-2013, 03:52 PM   #31
Bokaj
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Default Re: Duran vs Leonard who fought Hagler better?

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Originally Posted by MagnaNasakki View Post
I agree with this. 60%ish of folks have Leonard beating Hagler. Nobody but two judges had Duran up after 12. Hagler was in better form(Younger, really, he fought like shit) against Duran, but NOTHING is more of a handicap, NOTHING, then being retired for HALF A DAMN DECADE.
It's funny how easy this is to understand for everyone concerning some fighters (Jeffries, Dempsey and Tyson), and yet how so many have such a hard time accepting it when it comes to specifically Leonard and also Ali.

But Ali had tune-ups and faced a guy smaller than him, and still lost. Leonard walked straight into the lion's den and won. Those that can't accept the greatness of this aren't really worth debating with (I still find myself doing it every time though).
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Old 02-04-2013, 04:18 PM   #32
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Default Re: Duran vs Leonard who fought Hagler better?

Leonard & its not debatable.

Ps. the only ones that had Duran ahead after 12 rounds were the judges, Hagler was ahead on any sane card & I`m a big Duran fan. He fought well but lost clearly.
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Old 02-04-2013, 05:29 PM   #33
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Default Re: Duran vs Leonard who fought Hagler better?

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Did you actually watch Duran vs Hagler? Duran won a few rounds and that's it. Duran did well not to get hurt by Hagler, who for some reason showed him far too much respect and didn't really go after him.
True, Duran got by with a smoke and mirrors bluff,and Hagler was far too tentative.
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Old 02-04-2013, 05:31 PM   #34
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Default Re: Duran vs Leonard who fought Hagler better?

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Originally Posted by Bill Butcher View Post
Leonard & its not debatable.

Ps. the only ones that had Duran ahead after 12 rounds were the judges, Hagler was ahead on any sane card & I`m a big Duran fan. He fought well but lost clearly.
I never understood how people say Duran was ahead after 12. Duran had his moments but overall Hagler clearly outfought him. Duran got his shots in, but not enough to win.
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Old 02-04-2013, 09:40 PM   #35
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Default Re: Duran vs Leonard who fought Hagler better?

Duran vs Hagler was disappointing for me, they chose to box and it was a very boring fight. Duran was haglers only title defense (before leonard) that lasted the distance in a competitive fight. Hagler was very tentative against Duran a former lw which is strange I'm not saying he was afraid of Duran but he definitely was weary of him or respected him too much
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Old 02-04-2013, 09:42 PM   #36
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Default Re: Duran vs Leonard who fought Hagler better?

Duran fought Hagler better. No doubt about it.

The thread title was about fighting Hagler. Duran clearly edges Leonard in this sense.
If the thread title had said who BOXED Hagler better, I would give the edge to Leonard.

For those that believe a win is better than a loss, that may be true when you simply look at records. But if you go deeper, Duran fought Hagler,... a much better Hagler and made it a great fight.

Leonard boxed just enough to sqeak out a decision ( I dont think he won), a win yes... But the difference is in degrees to me and not just the quick look at records and wins and losses

Had Loenard fought Hagler when Duran did would he have won? I think everyone knows the answer to that. Because of this... Yes.... Duran performence is the greater of the two .
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Old 02-05-2013, 02:11 AM   #37
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Default Re: Duran vs Leonard who fought Hagler better?

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Had Loenard fought Hagler when Duran did would he have won? I think everyone knows the answer to that.
Yeah, and for an educated mind the answer would be "probably yes". There's no doubt in my mind that Leonard was farther past his prime when they actually met, so he should win a prime for prime match-up as well.

People make a lot of Hagler not being 100% convincing in his previous fight, against Mugabi. But he had after all one year before ruined a fearsome opponent and the consensus nr 1 challenger. Leonard's last fight was an unconvincing win three years earlier against someone that wasn't much better than journeyman status.

There was a reason that hardly anyone outside Leonard's camp gave Leonard a chance.
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Old 02-05-2013, 02:20 AM   #38
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Default Re: Duran vs Leonard who fought Hagler better?

Had Leonard actually done that, fought Hagler prime for prime and won. He would be a lock for a top 10 ATG.


BUt, I think the view that Leonard would be favored in such a match is going to far.

I think leonard waited for a reason, he knew Hagler would have beat him in prime ( when Duran fought him) I have to admit I think the view that leonard vs Hagler Prime for Prime would result in a leonard win is a very minority view.

Lord knows its possible, Leonard is that great, but still a minority opinion.
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Old 02-05-2013, 05:02 AM   #39
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Default Re: Duran vs Leonard who fought Hagler better?

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I have to admit I think the view that leonard vs Hagler Prime for Prime would result in a leonard win is a very minority view.

Lord knows its possible, Leonard is that great, but still a minority opinion.
Who gives a shit if it's a minority view or not. Fact remains that Leonard beat Hagler when farther past his prime than Hagler was his. So the best guess is that he would have done the same if both were in their primes.
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Old 02-05-2013, 09:32 AM   #40
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Default Re: Duran vs Leonard who fought Hagler better?

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Who gives a shit if it's a minority view or not. Fact remains that Leonard beat Hagler when farther past his prime than Hagler was his. So the best guess is that he would have done the same if both were in their primes.
Maybe past his physical best but he still knew how to exploit Hagler his weaknesses.
He wasn't ever going to KO Hagler anyway so as long as he could outbox Hagler even a little for 12 rounds, he would still win.
He knew how too, he exploited Hagler and made him look like the crude brawler many casuas think he was.

Props to Leonard.
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Old 02-05-2013, 09:47 AM   #41
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Default Re: Duran vs Leonard who fought Hagler better?

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Maybe past his physical best but he still knew how to exploit Hagler his weaknesses.
He wasn't ever going to KO Hagler anyway so as long as he could outbox Hagler even a little for 12 rounds, he would still win.
He knew how too, he exploited Hagler and made him look like the crude brawler many casuas think he was.

Props to Leonard.
Yes, and he did it with his legs gone for half the fight. Still don't understand how he did that. Hardest thing in the world to keep an opponent off you when you don't have your legs, never mind that opponent being Hagler.

Prime Leonard had a much better tank and recuperated much faster than the Leonard who faced Hagler.
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Old 02-05-2013, 09:51 AM   #42
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Default Re: Duran vs Leonard who fought Hagler better?

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Yes, and he did it with his legs gone for half the fight. Still don't understand how he did that. Hardest thing in the world to keep an opponent off you when you don't have your legs, never mind that opponent being Hagler.

Prime Leonard had a much better tank and recuperated much faster than the Leonard who faced Hagler.
Maybe that's why he survived Hearns too, in the end.

His psychological warfare against Hagler also worked really well, Hagler was a bit stupid probably for not directly fighting southpaw, but that was his choice.
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Old 02-05-2013, 11:51 AM   #43
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Default Re: Duran vs Leonard who fought Hagler better?

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Who gives a shit if it's a minority view or not. Fact remains that Leonard beat Hagler when farther past his prime than Hagler was his. So the best guess is that he would have done the same if both were in their primes.

and Duran was further past his prime and further past his prime weight than SRL.. and fought a better version of Hagler.
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Old 02-05-2013, 11:53 AM   #44
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Default Re: Duran vs Leonard who fought Hagler better?

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Yes, and he did it with his legs gone for half the fight. Still don't understand how he did that. Hardest thing in the world to keep an opponent off you when you don't have your legs, never mind that opponent being Hagler.

Prime Leonard had a much better tank and recuperated much faster than the Leonard who faced Hagler.
Sorry Bud, I think he and his crew knew his body and skills better than you. There was a reason he waited.. and it's not because he would've had a easier time beating Hagler when he was younger. If SRL disagrees with you, than I'm not sure what you have to stand on here.
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Old 02-05-2013, 01:06 PM   #45
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Default Re: Duran vs Leonard who fought Hagler better?

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Sorry Bud, I think he and his crew knew his body and skills better than you. There was a reason he waited.. and it's not because he would've had a easier time beating Hagler when he was younger. If SRL disagrees with you, than I'm not sure what you have to stand on here.
Is the "he went into retirement to hide from Hagler"-argument? If so that too stupid for me to debate.

He had his eye surgery and lost interest for the sport, already being set for life moneywise. Drugs and alcohol of course did their part. It had nothing to do with waiting Hagler out, and he has never said he had a plan like that. Would be kind of idiotic to waste your days doing coke if that was the plan. Is that how you understand humans to work in general?

If you do, fine, but I won't waste time debating something so idiotic.
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