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Old 03-18-2013, 09:39 PM   #1
MagnaNasakki
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Default Teach me about Marvin Hart

An interesting transitory figure in a sport that churns out more of those than most.

I know next to nothing about him beyond his eight months as king. Is there anything else there?
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Old 03-19-2013, 03:20 AM   #2
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Default Re: Teach me about Marvin Hart

First stop should be a pollack's book on him. Everything ya need to know is between those two covers
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Old 03-19-2013, 10:38 AM   #3
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Default Re: Teach me about Marvin Hart

This might be of interest.

[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]
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Old 03-19-2013, 10:46 AM   #4
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Default Re: Teach me about Marvin Hart

It's a very clever ploy, Magna. I think we're all onto the fact that you are Marvin Hart, by now.
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Old 03-19-2013, 02:06 PM   #5
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Default Re: Teach me about Marvin Hart

Marvin Hart was durable, aggresive and a fairly hard puncher.
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Old 03-19-2013, 02:08 PM   #6
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Default Re: Teach me about Marvin Hart

Hart did not have great ability. On the plus side he had a solid right hand. His best attribute was world class determination and guts. For some reason, Hart was psyched out in a title defense vs. Tommy Burns His best wins were over Jack Johnson and Jack Root. He also had name wins over past their prime versions of Ruhlin and Maher, as well as a draw with a past his prime Choynski.

One could say Hart was born at the right time as he was several years younger than Choynski, Corbett, Ruhlin, Fitzsimmons, and Sharkey. Jeffries retired in 1905 ( But said he would fight Hart after he defeated Johnson if the public wanted to see it. They did not, it was viewed as a mis-match. )

Trivia: Hartís signature is worth the most of all heavyweight champions. Hart had very poor vision in one of his eyes, and might have fought with impaired vision.
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Old 03-19-2013, 02:16 PM   #7
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Default Re: Teach me about Marvin Hart

He lost to Jack Johnson is the first thing of note.
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Old 03-19-2013, 02:22 PM   #8
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Default Re: Teach me about Marvin Hart

Quote:
Originally Posted by KuRuPT View Post
He lost to Jack Johnson is the first thing of note.
What makes you so sure? There is no film on the fight. Read Unforgivable Blackness. The author says Johnson's corner urged him to pick up the pace, but he did not.

Or read Adam's book on his take of the fight. Or read the Boxing Illustrated article titled " A case for Marvin Hart ", where Johnson is quoted saying Hart beat him good.
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Old 03-19-2013, 03:37 PM   #9
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Default Re: Teach me about Marvin Hart

OR we can read all the next day reports which basically ALL had Johnson outclassing Hart.. I mean really.. Let's be honest here... Hart NEVER hurt Johnson.. Johnson hurt Hart and even bloodied him up. So not only did Johnson laid the hardest shots of the fight.. he OUTCLASSED him in boxing as well. Just because Johnson was coasting doesn't mean Hart deserved to win for rushing in and doing nothing but landign some body shots and getting battered for his attempts when Johnson felt like it.
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Old 03-19-2013, 04:10 PM   #10
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Default Re: Teach me about Marvin Hart

kurupt yer hurting the cause!
I too believe jj won that fight but not all next day write ups said that.
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Old 03-19-2013, 04:16 PM   #11
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Default Re: Teach me about Marvin Hart

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Originally Posted by SLAKKA View Post
kurupt yer hurting the cause!
I too believe jj won that fight but not all next day write ups said that.
Dec. 1963 article "The case for and against Marvin Hart" reprinted in the June 1989 issue of Boxing Illustrated:

Johnson, in his autobiography In The Ring And Out says surprisingly little about the fight, and such remarks as he did make are caustic: "The fight was not an auspicious one for me, as Hart got the decision, owing, as Tad, the famous sportswriter says, to the fact that in his excitement the referee pointed to the wrong winner." Later, however, Jack, who never was one to heap accolades on an opponent, did admit: "I don't know of any fighter who was better than me when I was in my prime. But there was one who really beat me... and he beat me good. I'm talking about Marvin Hart."


^^^ So according to this source, Hart won fair in square.
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Old 03-19-2013, 04:17 PM   #12
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Default Re: Teach me about Marvin Hart

I read that for the bulk of his career (or maybe even all of it) Hart was fighting blind in one eye. If that's the case, then his record becomes a lot more impressive, because guys like Jack Root and Philadelphia Jack O'Briein were considered to be among the best fighters of the day.
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Old 03-19-2013, 05:30 PM   #13
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Default Re: Teach me about Marvin Hart

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Originally Posted by Mendoza View Post
Dec. 1963 article "The case for and against Marvin Hart" reprinted in the June 1989 issue of Boxing Illustrated:

Johnson, in his autobiography In The Ring And Out says surprisingly little about the fight, and such remarks as he did make are caustic: "The fight was not an auspicious one for me, as Hart got the decision, owing, as Tad, the famous sportswriter says, to the fact that in his excitement the referee pointed to the wrong winner." Later, however, Jack, who never was one to heap accolades on an opponent, did admit: "I don't know of any fighter who was better than me when I was in my prime. But there was one who really beat me... and he beat me good. I'm talking about Marvin Hart."


^^^ So according to this source, Hart won fair in square.
Care to name the interviewer for the B I?

The L A Times called the decision"A Queer One, George Siler, in the Police Gazette stated, " It was the opinion of all fair minded witnesses that Johnson beat Hart"
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Old 03-19-2013, 06:31 PM   #14
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Default Re: Teach me about Marvin Hart

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mendoza View Post
Dec. 1963 article "The case for and against Marvin Hart" reprinted in the June 1989 issue of Boxing Illustrated:

Johnson, in his autobiography In The Ring And Out says surprisingly little about the fight, and such remarks as he did make are caustic: "The fight was not an auspicious one for me, as Hart got the decision, owing, as Tad, the famous sportswriter says, to the fact that in his excitement the referee pointed to the wrong winner." Later, however, Jack, who never was one to heap accolades on an opponent, did admit: "I don't know of any fighter who was better than me when I was in my prime. But there was one who really beat me... and he beat me good. I'm talking about Marvin Hart."


^^^ So according to this source, Hart won fair in square.
Mendoza we've covered this hash time and time again, including jj quotes from his autobio recollecting his ass whipping of Hart.
please! lets just lay some cash on this and let me sucker bet you some.
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Old 03-19-2013, 06:37 PM   #15
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Default Re: Teach me about Marvin Hart

Call me fascinated by transitional champions lately. Those guys who aren't ATG or even great talents or craftsmen, but who had the stars align for them in order to over achieve.

Ordered the book as suggested guys. Amazon Prime, I'll get to read it soon. He sounds like the kind of plucky, thudding punching guy who gave a lot of effort and found success in consistency.

I'm going to do more research on Hart vs. Johnson. Seems like, frankly, a fairly epic win in the overachieving category if it has any legitimacy. I've seen Mendoza argue this point before, but I didn't internalize any of it, I fear. A lot of good points were made, I remember.
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