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Old 02-07-2013, 09:52 AM   #46
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Default Re: Rumors that C5 might be pulling out of boxing

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Originally Posted by JonnyBGoode View Post
Because it is a live TV event, that means having cameramen, directors, technical staff etc. all working on a Friday or Saturday night, plus paying the promoter whatever their fee is and then hoping it all works out OK. The reality is often that the main event may be a disappointment and if it is over very quickly means they have to show unheralded fighters on the undercard at primetime TV slots.

Compare the cost of that whole thing to the cost of a reality TV show when you have one cameraman, one producer (that does everything) and then a runner that probably gets paid almost nothing and it makes sense. Plus they don't have to pay the participants anything for those reality shows, TV execs simply think like this:

"What is the cheapest thing I can put on, that will get decent figures, that will appeal to advertisers, that is least likely to blow up in my face or get me sacked that won't offend viewers?"

That's how they think, the money is all in the advertising revenue and there are only so many Army recruitment ads or lager ads that will take up the spaces for a 90 minute or 2 hour boxing show. It's too much of a risk for them and doesn't present any obvious rewards other than a few boxing fans giving them the thumbs up and maybe a small string to their bow in terms of backing sport and getting live sport back on their screens, which means little or nothing to their shareholders.
Great post.

That's pretty much the long and short of it.
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Old 02-07-2013, 10:00 AM   #47
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Default Re: Rumors that C5 might be pulling out of boxing

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The BBC has made money from selling its shows and show concepts since the 60s. I don’t think it could make any money from licensing a third-party content owner’s (a promoter, in boxing’s case) material. The Beeb owns the broadcast, but not the rights to screen that fight outwith its original licensing terms.

Anyway…

This notion that the BBC won’t show boxing for political reasons is just stupid. The BBC doesn’t show boxing because it’s a pain in the backside for them. How often does it show one-off sporting events? Single-showing dramas?

It’s incredibly rare because the BBC’s strategy is based around serial content. So, football is a weekly sport, generating hours of content for the schedules. Wimbledon gives it two weeks worth of material, spread over its flagship channels (1, 2 and HD). Even the more obscure sports it covers are on a regular basis (curling, snooker, etc) with large, flagship events that last days or weeks.

Boxing is completely irregular and short-form by nature. It’s a single night of material and there’s no guarantee of its length or quality. In addition, it’s expensive to broadcast, you can’t build economies of scale when every new card requires separate mounting, publicising it is hard when there’s no rhythm to it, and the efforts of dealing with multiple promoters and, often disproportionate costs, mean it’s just not worth the Beeb’s while.

The left/right wing thing makes very little sense anyway. If the BBC is more left-leaning, it should be MORE inclusive of the lower classes (hence why socialism is a left-wing ideology). I suspect it points to how the “ruling class” are completely bereft of any political ideology other than that which supports their own personal gain.
Being left leaning doesn't mean that they take the lower class seriously. Hey, they may well look down on them as having "racist" "bigoted" views.

Are middle class liberals fans of combat sports? Probably not so much. Do some of them even have moral objections to it and think it's "brutal"? Yes some of them do object to it.
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Old 02-07-2013, 10:03 AM   #48
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Default Re: Rumors that C5 might be pulling out of boxing

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Originally Posted by dftaylor View Post
The BBC has made money from selling its shows and show concepts since the 60s. I don’t think it could make any money from licensing a third-party content owner’s (a promoter, in boxing’s case) material. The Beeb owns the broadcast, but not the rights to screen that fight outwith its original licensing terms.

Anyway…

This notion that the BBC won’t show boxing for political reasons is just stupid. The BBC doesn’t show boxing because it’s a pain in the backside for them. How often does it show one-off sporting events? Single-showing dramas?

It’s incredibly rare because the BBC’s strategy is based around serial content. So, football is a weekly sport, generating hours of content for the schedules. Wimbledon gives it two weeks worth of material, spread over its flagship channels (1, 2 and HD). Even the more obscure sports it covers are on a regular basis (curling, snooker, etc) with large, flagship events that last days or weeks.

Boxing is completely irregular and short-form by nature. It’s a single night of material and there’s no guarantee of its length or quality. In addition, it’s expensive to broadcast, you can’t build economies of scale when every new card requires separate mounting, publicising it is hard when there’s no rhythm to it, and the efforts of dealing with multiple promoters and, often disproportionate costs, mean it’s just not worth the Beeb’s while.

The left/right wing thing makes very little sense anyway. If the BBC is more left-leaning, it should be MORE inclusive of the lower classes (hence why socialism is a left-wing ideology). I suspect it points to how the “ruling class” are completely bereft of any political ideology other than that which supports their own personal gain.
I agree with all that post other then the last part, you're kind of going on the basis that the people at the BBC are working-class socialists and therefore more likely to support a working class sport. It's nothing like that though, the organisation is primarily made up of left wing, lib-dem voting, soya milk drinking graduates, the type that think boxing is "just two men punching each other" and think it should be banned. The type that think horse racing should be banned because they whip the horses, the type that wouldn't be particularly inclined to back the sport of boxing.

If it is a socialist organisation then it is very much a champagne socialist organisation rather than a grass roots, working class, man in the street type of arrangement. I don't really for a moment think that is why they no longer show boxing any more, as we've already pointed out it's more for cost and scheduling reasons but I seriously doubt there are many boxing fans or supporters at the BBC beating the drum to bring it back. Highly unlikely.
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Old 02-07-2013, 10:04 AM   #49
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Default Re: Rumors that C5 might be pulling out of boxing

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Being left leaning doesn't mean that they take the lower class seriously. Hey, they may well look down on them as having "racist" "bigoted" views.

Are middle class liberals fans of combat sports? Probably not so much. Do some of them even have moral objections to it and think it's "brutal"? Yes some of them do object to it.
Beat me to it by a few seconds with that post
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Old 02-07-2013, 10:06 AM   #50
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Default Re: Rumors that C5 might be pulling out of boxing

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The BBC doesn’t show boxing because it’s a pain in the backside for them. How often does it show one-off sporting events?
You can do a deal with a promoter for X number of shows a year.

But yes, as people have mentioned, it isn't as regular and easy as getting the rights to footballl etc. (ignoring the massive cost of football rights)
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Old 02-07-2013, 10:08 AM   #51
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Default Re: Rumors that C5 might be pulling out of boxing

Has there been any legitimate hints that Channel 5 are pulling the plug? Or is all this fuss just because Eddie Hearn cheekily suggested it? If that's the case then people need to calm down, promoters are always bullshitting to try and unsettle rival promoters and their fighters.
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Old 02-07-2013, 10:09 AM   #52
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Default Re: Rumors that C5 might be pulling out of boxing

no surprise when their cash cow is a bum called fury
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Old 02-07-2013, 10:17 AM   #53
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Default Re: Rumors that C5 might be pulling out of boxing

To speak up for Hennessy, I think the Channel 5 shows have been fine. Tyson Fury, Chris Eubank Jr., and DeGale are all good fighters to watch, and they have been matched OK.
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Old 02-07-2013, 10:21 AM   #54
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Default Re: Rumors that C5 might be pulling out of boxing

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To speak up for Hennessy, I think the Channel 5 shows have been fine. Tyson Fury, Chris Eubank Jr., and DeGale are all good fighters to watch, and they have been matched OK.
That said, the production values of Hennessy's shows are awful. Every show is in some shit, shed of an arena. The lighting it awful, the commentators (apart from Al Bernstein) are crap and the layout looks cheap as ****. In Fury's last fight with Kevin Johnson at the Odyssey the place was half empty and there were boos coming from the crowd. All of this doesn't look good on TV from an Channel 5 executive's point of view.

I doubt these rumours are true also, but to say that Mick is doing a great job with his dates isn't exactly true.
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Old 02-07-2013, 10:36 AM   #55
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Default Re: Rumors that C5 might be pulling out of boxing

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Beat me to it by a few seconds with that post
I'm not saying the BBC is or isn't left wing, just that the definition doesn't really make sense in the context of boxing. The business reasons to avoid it are more compelling than any political ones. I've yet to see political imperatives ever stop someone in the media from doing something. If it drives views, reads or whatever - they do it.

Incidentally I'm middle class, work in communications and marketing, and love boxing. The stereotypes aren't necessarily true.
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Old 02-07-2013, 10:39 AM   #56
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Default Re: Rumors that C5 might be pulling out of boxing

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You can do a deal with a promoter for X number of shows a year.

But yes, as people have mentioned, it isn't as regular and easy as getting the rights to footballl etc. (ignoring the massive cost of football rights)
Audley put paid to that.
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Old 02-07-2013, 10:57 AM   #57
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Default Re: Rumors that C5 might be pulling out of boxing

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The stereotypes aren't necessarily true.
I agree that boxing fans are judged unfairly, there are a lot of middle and upper class fans of the sport too believe it or not. Also, a lot of public boarding schools in particular still encourage boxing and make it a part of their curriculum. Obviously it retains its working class roots as well but people don't dwell on the good that the sport and the gyms do for their communities, they focus on the negatives most of the time.

However, when you attend the live shows it does tend to attract a certain type of punter and usually that punter is a white, middle aged, slightly over weight man with a sovereign ring on at least one finger, usually drunk and often found sniffing beak in the toilets. Whilst that is horrible generalisation it is also true of the majority of shows that I have attended and while it is like that it puts off the general public. We've been discussing the BBC, I remember the Harrison fight with Matthew Ellis, after a very dull one sided fight there was an enormous riot in the arena, the BBC doesn't want anything to do with that!

Any sane, non violent person wouldn't have attended a football match in the 80's either because of the crowd and the hooligan problem and it pretty much tool the Hillsborough disaster to get the clubs and authorities to sort it out. Boxing is less accessible to the general public if they're scared to attend shows and it's not exactly a family atmosphere most of the time. It would be nice to think that boxing fans are less tribal then football fans but that doesn't seem to be the case so much, incidents of crowd trouble maybe fairly rare in reality but they'll be highlighted by the people with a negative attitude towards the sport anyway. We need to try and get the old ladies, the mums and dads, the young kids, back into the sport and move away from these images of thuggish, aggressive fans if the sport is going to grow.
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Old 02-07-2013, 12:53 PM   #58
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Default Re: Rumors that C5 might be pulling out of boxing

I actually think Boxing is a sport that trancends class barriers. You only have to go and look at cambridge university boxing club to see. But I don't beleive advertisers or TV companys recognise that.

Look at the last two promoters to have terrestrial TV deals. Frank & Hennesey. Both of them ditched ITV when bigger fights came along for there fighters for Sateltie TV.

If I was going to sign a deal with the Promoter who get Anthony Joshua, why would O broadcast his first 20 fights for him to sign with Sky for the 21st a World Title fight.
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Old 02-07-2013, 12:55 PM   #59
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Default Re: Rumors that C5 might be pulling out of boxing

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no surprise when their cash cow is a bum called fury
Silliest post in a mostly excellent thread.
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Old 02-07-2013, 01:07 PM   #60
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Default Re: Rumors that C5 might be pulling out of boxing

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I'm not saying the BBC is or isn't left wing, just that the definition doesn't really make sense in the context of boxing. The business reasons to avoid it are more compelling than any political ones. I've yet to see political imperatives ever stop someone in the media from doing something. If it drives views, reads or whatever - they do it.

Incidentally I'm middle class, work in communications and marketing, and love boxing. The stereotypes aren't necessarily true.
This.

Pull outs, injuries, people not able to fight on certain networks.

It would be a pain in the arse of them to do.
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