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Old 02-09-2013, 06:28 PM   #31
salsanchezfan
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Default Re: Ray Leonard: Best Fighter of the 80's?

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Originally Posted by KidDynamite View Post
This

Tyson was operating on a different level in the 80s and hardly even lost a round.



Tyson was as skilled if not more skilled than Leonard. Did Leonard have the defense that Mike had? Tyson was never out boxed by anyone in the 90s ... Hearns was able to out box Leonard and so was Duran.

Tyson was the most skilled heavyweight during that time frame and he didn't rely on smoke and mirrors like Leonard.

This is simply incorrect, but...........I posted this thread to engender conversation, so have at it.
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Old 02-09-2013, 06:30 PM   #32
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Default Re: Ray Leonard: Best Fighter of the 80's?

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Originally Posted by KidDynamite View Post
This

Tyson was operating on a different level in the 80s and hardly even lost a round.



Tyson was as skilled if not more skilled than Leonard. Did Leonard have the defense that Mike had? Tyson was never out boxed by anyone in the 90s ... Hearns was able to out box Leonard and so was Duran.

Tyson was the most skilled heavyweight during that time frame and he didn't rely on smoke and mirrors like Leonard.
, being outboxed by Hearns or Duran is no shame.
Tyson is the most skilled 80s heavyweight yes, Duran might make case for being the most skilled of all time.
Hearns... name me one guy, just one man who can outbox Hearns at welterweight.
You can't because even Robinson would have to KO him.
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Old 02-09-2013, 06:31 PM   #33
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Default Re: Ray Leonard: Best Fighter of the 80's?

How do you rate this though?

I have an emotional reaction to Mike Tyson. In many ways he was a throw back - he fought the fighters that were in front of him. What more could be asked of him. He was so good he made it look easy, was that his fault?

With Sugar Ray Leonard I always got the feeling he was shrewd, picked the best time, picked the best weight, fought on his terms.

Tyson would fight anyone, anywhere, for a dime. I don't know.

You can't take it away from Leonard, he was incredible. He probably does have better names on his resume, but when people say - who was the fighter of the 1980s? My mind immediately says 'Mike Tyson'.

I'm not that big a Tyson fan, believe it or not - I just have to testify here because I think this is Mike's category.
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Old 02-09-2013, 06:42 PM   #34
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Default Re: Ray Leonard: Best Fighter of the 80's?

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Originally Posted by dyna View Post
, being outboxed by Hearns or Duran is no shame.
Tyson is the most skilled 80s heavyweight yes, Duran might make case for being the most skilled of all time.
Hearns... name me one guy, just one man who can outbox Hearns at welterweight.
You can't because even Robinson would have to KO him.
Leonard was beatable, Tyson was a machine who was never even close to being beaten. He was cutting through the entire division like it was nothing and within 3 years he accomplished everything there was to accomplish.

This "skill" stuff when comparing weight classes is flawed. You can only compare others with their contemporaries and go from there. Which heavyweight was as skilled as Mike during his reign with Rooney? Mike is like top 5 in terms of pure skill all time amongst heavyweights. Leonard wasn't the most skilled amongst his peers. Mike was the total package and was much better defensively if you want to compare them directly.
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Old 02-09-2013, 06:50 PM   #35
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Default Re: Ray Leonard: Best Fighter of the 80's?

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Originally Posted by KidDynamite View Post
Leonard was beatable, Tyson was a machine who was never even close to being beaten. He was cutting through the entire division like it was nothing and within 3 years he accomplished everything there was to accomplish.

This "skill" stuff when comparing weight classes is flawed. You can only compare others with their contemporaries and go from there. Which heavyweight was as skilled as Mike during his reign with Rooney? Mike is like top 5 in terms of pure skill all time amongst heavyweights. Leonard wasn't the most skilled amongst his peers. Mike was the total package and was much better defensively if you want to compare them directly.
Mike is top 5 HW

Leonard is like a top 2/3 welterweight

For reference.
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Old 02-09-2013, 06:53 PM   #36
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Default Re: Ray Leonard: Best Fighter of the 80's?

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Tyson was cutting through the entire division like it was nothing
Well in 'simplistic terms' as a comparison to Leonard et al, it kind of was. Leonard had Duran, Hearns and Hagler to play with; Tyson had fatties, old men and drug addicts...
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Old 02-09-2013, 06:55 PM   #37
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Default Re: Ray Leonard: Best Fighter of the 80's?

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Well in 'simplistic terms' as a comparison to Leonard et al, it kind of was. Leonard had Duran, Hearns and Hagler to play with; Tyson had fatties, old men and drug addicts...

Thank you. As I mentioned before, no one on Tyson's resume comes even close to what Leonard had on his.
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Old 02-09-2013, 07:01 PM   #38
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Default Re: Ray Leonard: Best Fighter of the 80's?

Mike Tyson may not have been the best boxer named Mike in the 1980's let alone boxer of the decade. Also is no one counting Hearns 2 against Ray. Not a criticism just saying if you only have 12 fights in the decade you might need to win ask of them to be number one. Maybe...
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Old 02-09-2013, 07:28 PM   #39
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Default Re: Ray Leonard: Best Fighter of the 80's?

I'd go for Chavez, his fights during the 80's weren't as high profile as Leonards but he did it all throught the 80's, unbeaten in the whole decade and busy, and a great fighter, you've only got to look at him on film.
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Old 02-09-2013, 07:36 PM   #40
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Default Re: Ray Leonard: Best Fighter of the 80's?

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Like Hagler? Fair point.
Revisonist history. Hagler was still a very good middle weight. Sure Mugabi gave him a tough go in his previous bout, but Mugabi a tough oppoent and a future champion. Could Leonard have fought him sooner? Yes, but Hagler was not on the down slide when they did fight.
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Old 02-09-2013, 09:32 PM   #41
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Default Re: Ray Leonard: Best Fighter of the 80's?

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well you know he did beat Hagler when they fought ...
Neh
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Old 02-10-2013, 09:35 AM   #42
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Default Re: Ray Leonard: Best Fighter of the 80's?

well he did get FOTD
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Old 02-10-2013, 09:41 AM   #43
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Default Re: Ray Leonard: Best Fighter of the 80's?

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Originally Posted by ripcity View Post
Revisonist history. Hagler was still a very good middle weight. Sure Mugabi gave him a tough go in his previous bout, but Mugabi a tough oppoent and a future champion. Could Leonard have fought him sooner? Yes, but Hagler was not on the down slide when they did fight.
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Old 02-10-2013, 06:54 PM   #44
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Default Re: Ray Leonard: Best Fighter of the 80's?

Leonard is as good a choice as any & likely the best choice, his retirements don`t sit well with me but his victories over Duran, Hearns & Hagler alone are absolutely stunning stuff, as legendary as it gets.

For what its worth, I think (probably controversially) that Salvador Sanchez was every bit as good as Ray Leonard p4p & likely would have been the fighter of the 80`s if not for his death, he is up there as it is but Leonard takes it in this one, everything considered.
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Old 02-10-2013, 07:58 PM   #45
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Default Re: Ray Leonard: Best Fighter of the 80's?

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Originally Posted by ripcity View Post
Revisonist history. Hagler was still a very good middle weight. Sure Mugabi gave him a tough go in his previous bout, but Mugabi a tough oppoent and a future champion. Could Leonard have fought him sooner? Yes, but Hagler was not on the down slide when they did fight.
Yes he was dont be silly
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