Lesnar Overeem, what was Lesnar thinking!

[kel]

He was scared

[BoxingFanMan]

I wonder how long it was for Joe Rogen to be able to get a hard on after that?

[scurlaruntings]

Originally Posted by EL BULLY

As I said at the time, and was ridiculed for it, Lesnar being good at wrestling was the biggest myth in MMA. He WAS good at wrestling at school, then he did the panto stuff then in MMA he had no wrestling whatsoever. I can't recall a single take down. He even missed a dazed Herring with a bull charge. Complete fraud.

His Takedowns were borderline pathetic. But hey the UFC had to sell him...And the fans believed the hype about his fabled NCAA credentials...

[Haggis McJackass]

Originally Posted by rusty nails

i thought the same thing at the time. he looked fragile (if you could ever call brock that) and seemed to have no gameplan whatsoever.
i picked overeem to win and i dont know if lesnar could beat him but he didnt even give himself a chance.

Yep. Soon as he took the knee to the body, he was looking for a way out. Maybe it was always a cash-out fight, or maybe he genuinely didn't realize just how much strength and confidence his illnesses had taken out of him. But he definitely looked very fragile, and was certainly mentally and physically badly declined. And fair enough, considering just how serious his illnesses were.

He gets a raw deal around here though. Some guys, they get a pass, and others just get hated on. I mean, Shogun's submission loss to Forrest is basically written off entirely because of his knee problems, but Brock losing to Reem and Cain is because he sucks and is a fraud and a joke.

[kel]

Originally Posted by Haggis McJackass

Yep. Soon as he took the knee to the body, he was looking for a way out. Maybe it was always a cash-out fight, or maybe he genuinely didn't realize just how much strength and confidence his illnesses had taken out of him. But he definitely looked very fragile, and was certainly mentally and physically badly declined. And fair enough, considering just how serious his illnesses were.

He gets a raw deal around here though. Some guys, they get a pass, and others just get hated on. I mean, Shogun's submission loss to Forrest is basically written off entirely because of his knee problems, but Brock losing to Reem and Cain is because he sucks and is a fraud and a joke.

I think it's a PRIDE thing

[Stoo]

Originally Posted by Haggis McJackass

He gets a raw deal around here though. Some guys, they get a pass, and others just get hated on. I mean, Shogun's submission loss to Forrest is basically written off entirely because of his knee problems, but Brock losing to Reem and Cain is because he sucks and is a fraud and a joke.

Yeah, the way Brock ran away from punches then quit the sport whilst Shogun came back won the belt and avenged his defeat are the same thing

''Pass''...nice one

[Haggis McJackass]

Originally Posted by Stoo

Yeah, the way Brock ran away from punches then quit the sport whilst Shogun came back won the belt and avenged his defeat are the same thing

''Pass''...nice one

Haven't seen too many guys in their 30s get so badly sick over a span of months - on two different occasions - go through such a dramatic operation as having a foot of colon taken out of their bodies, and then return at anything close to full strength.

Not that Brock was going to beat Reem even without the illness, but let's not pretend that his months and months spent dealing with two bouts of sickness, operations, and subsequent weight loss and muscle atrophy didn't have a MASSIVE impact on his MMA career.

And yes, many fighters get passes for certain losses. Shogun simply being the most notable. Besides, if you're going to trade excuses, Shogun never truly avenged the Forrest defeat.

[Stoo]

But no one has said the surgery didnt affect Brock in this thread, so your Shogun strawman is redundant

If your whining about why Shogun gets more respect than Brock, then, well...

[Haggis McJackass]

Originally Posted by Stoo

But no one has said the surgery didnt affect Brock in this thread, so your Shogun strawman is redundant

Let's see any of the "Brock sucks" crowd acknowledge that his repeated serious illnesses had a massive impact on his fighting ability and career. Months spent on a sick bed instead of learning in the gym, followed by months spent simply trying to recover what was lost instead of training new skills.

Brock was apparently a moron when it came to training anyway, but it's plain idiotic to not acknowledge his illnesses and surgeries and the part they played in his career. He overcame an incredible number of obstacles in his short career, he showed incredible balls just to get in the cage and fight, he never ducked a challenge, and he overachieved in the cage. That's the truth of Brock. His career is to be applauded, not shit on by wankers.

Originally Posted by Stoo

If your whining about why Shogun gets more respect than Brock, then, well...

Shogun should get more respect. He's a legend of the sport, and has several great victories along with a few embarrassing and one-sided defeats. And being a legend of the sport, he doesn't need the pathetic excuse-mongering that his nuthuggers come up with every time he loses.

[Stoo]

So Brock is getting a pass then, gotcha fella

[Haggis McJackass]

Originally Posted by benebox

I dont think people realize how much the surgery took out of Lesner. He wasn't the same fighter after and seemed timid and weak.

Yep. His whole life he'd always been bigger and stronger than everyone he was competing against. He was a physical monster.

Put him on a sickbed for months, take 40 pounds of muscle away from him and take away his confidence in his body, and he loses a lot. It's like taking away Liddell's chin - when he couldn't take the punches anymore, he couldn't beat anybody at the top level.

[Haggis McJackass]

Originally Posted by Stoo

So Brock is getting a pass then, gotcha fella

A pass for what? From who?

I said that he trained like a moron and would likely never have beaten Reem anyway, sickness or no sickness, so he isn't getting much of a pass from me.

I just don't shit on the guy, call him a fraud etc, and whine about Dana and Zuffa whenever a Brock thread comes up. I enjoyed Brock's career, I thought he brought a lot of interest and excitement to the division. I like that his high profile brought more eyes to the sport in a positive way, and I respect what he achieved and the hardship he overcame. That's it.

[Ne5ville14]

[macp1]

He was scared shitless of The Reem. And for some reason, he wasnt as much of an asshole in that fight as before, so he was easy pickings.

[Stoo]

It's about the context and connotations of your original statements regarding the redundant strawman you brought up
To sum up

Brock loses after surgery, and loses some of his best attributes in terms of strength, it's a reason

Shogun loses after knee surgery, loses some of his best attributes in terms of stamina, it's an excuse from his ''pathetic'' fans