Boxing  

Forum Home Boxing Forum European British Classic Aussie MMA Training
Go Back   Boxing News 24 Forum > Boxing > British Boxing Forum


Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 04-21-2013, 07:27 AM   #1
mcguirpa
Contender
ESB Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,302
vCash: 1000
Default So just what was Cunningham's/Nazim's plan??

Nazim and cunningham talked a lot about their 'plan' in the build up.

I expected it was along the lines of Cunningham sticking and moving, tiring Fury, picking up rounds along the way and maybe stopping Fury on his feet late on.

It would make sense... I don't think anyone would disagree that Cunningham is slicker, more skilled, more experienced and faster. Nazim is more experienced than anyone in Fury's corner.

But here's the thing... Whatever Cunningham's plan was Fury absolutely neutralised it and he's just not getting anough credit for this. I was dissapointed to see Cunningham whinging about the size difference after the fight. It's not like he didn't know beforehand. I think he expected to be able to do something along the lines of the Haye/Valuev fight. Back foot, stick and move. Nick the rounds.

But Fury just walked him down, threw more punches, took more punches, landed his combinations and just wouldn't let Steve off the hook. And for all Cunningham's supposed advantages in speed and conditioning he simply got tired first and took more shots than he could handle.

I've just watched the fight again this morning and Fury just ain't getting enough credit.
mcguirpa is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Old 04-21-2013, 07:37 AM   #2
PaulieMc
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Liverpool, England
Posts: 1,934
vCash: 416
Default Re: So just what was Cunningham's/Nazim's plan??

Their plan was as you said, to give Fury the run-around, pick up the rounds and catch Fury when he left himself exposed which is what he did brilliantly in the 2nd round.

It was working perfectly for the first 4 rds. After that Fury regained his head and started coming back into it. Fury leaned on him and tired him out, the exact thing Cunningham said wouldn't work against him in the press conference. His exact words were "he leans on guys, he gets them tired. I don't get tired, I get better." Cunningham got tired alright, he was getting battered towards the end because Tyson was just too strong and he complained about it afterwards, as did Richardson.

Fury got himself out of jail last night with some sneaky (but you could also say clever) tactics. He won't be able it use his size to get him off the hook against bigger opponents like the Klitschkos. Hopefully his uncle Peter gives him a right bollocking and makes him maintain his focus in future fights.

Still, was a great win and an epic comeback. I think it's exactly the same as when Hamed fought Kelley. Went over to the States making a big noise, was hyped up all around New York with the Americans unsure what to make of him. Put on his arse at the start and was the laughing stock, came back to show them what a heart he has and got them all cheering for him at the end.
PaulieMc is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2013, 07:44 AM   #3
Thuggin'
Gatekeeper
ESB Full Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 383
vCash: 500
Default Re: So just what was Cunningham's/Nazim's plan??

Cunninghams plan was to box on the move but Fury actually has quite good footspeed so it didn't work
Thuggin' is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2013, 07:45 AM   #4
Claypole
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Harlow, UK
Posts: 3,548
vCash: 922
Default Re: So just what was Cunningham's/Nazim's plan??

The plan may have been to hit and move, but then they realised that Fury could be hurt, and had no ring intelligence whatsoever. Fury's plan was to plod forward until the smaller man wore himself out, and that's what happened.

I don't think Fury should get too much credit for his performance. He showed zero ringcraft, and only won because of the size difference.
Claypole is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2013, 07:49 AM   #5
Thuggin'
Gatekeeper
ESB Full Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 383
vCash: 500
Default Re: So just what was Cunningham's/Nazim's plan??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Claypole View Post
The plan may have been to hit and move, but then they realised that Fury could be hurt, and had no ring intelligence whatsoever. Fury's plan was to plod forward until the smaller man wore himself out, and that's what happened.

I don't think Fury should get too much credit for his performance. He showed zero ringcraft, and only won because of the size difference.
Question for you.

Would Tye Fields have beaten Cunningham last night?
Thuggin' is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2013, 07:51 AM   #6
mcguirpa
Contender
ESB Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,302
vCash: 1000
Default Re: So just what was Cunningham's/Nazim's plan??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Claypole View Post
I don't think Fury should get too much credit for his performance. He showed zero ringcraft, and only won because of the size difference.
You see, I just can't get along with this line of thought. In fact it's the point of the thread... they knew how big he was, they knew his flaws, they're an incredibly experienced team who said they had a plan.

Yet they still didn't win. And people are suggesting Fury deserves no credit for this? Could it be that Fury was actually just a little faster, a little better conditioned and a bit more skilled than they thought. How can you possibly fail to get out of the way of someone who is just plodding forward?

If size was the only factor then Valuev would have beaten Haye.
mcguirpa is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2013, 07:55 AM   #7
Thuggin'
Gatekeeper
ESB Full Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 383
vCash: 500
Default Re: So just what was Cunningham's/Nazim's plan??

Quote:
Originally Posted by mcguirpa View Post
You see, I just can't get along with this line of thought. In fact it's the point of the thread... they knew how big he was, they knew his flaws, they're an incredibly experienced team who said they had a plan.

Yet they still didn't win. And people are suggesting Fury deserves no credit for this? Could it be that Fury was actually just a little faster, a little better conditioned and a bit more skilled than they thought. How can you possibly fail to get out of the way of someone who is just plodding forward?

If size was the only factor then Valuev would have beaten Haye.
If Tyson only won "because of his size" then the following fighters would all beat Cunningham

Tye Fields
Kelvin Price
Julius Long
Audley Harrison
That stiff guy from over there, Dallas?

If all those guys wouldn't beat Cunningham then fury didn not "only win because of his size"
Thuggin' is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2013, 07:57 AM   #8
mcguirpa
Contender
ESB Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,302
vCash: 1000
Default Re: So just what was Cunningham's/Nazim's plan??

And another thing - Fury actually outworked the supposedly faster, fitter man. I think that this is what they were actually unprepared for.

For all his size and clumsiness Fury does not plod. he fights every single round as fast and hard as he can. And that is a very handy pace for such a big guy.
mcguirpa is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2013, 08:41 AM   #9
Unforgiven
Undisputed Champion
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 12,583
vCash: 1000
Default Re: So just what was Cunningham's/Nazim's plan??

I thnk Fury gets under-rated in his ability coming forward, cutting off the ring and getting on top of his opponents.
He gets OVER-RATED in his ability to fight at long range.

Cunningham's plan was probably to get in, land some punches coming in and one of two on the inside, then get out and move a bit, and repeat. He has no other options.

People talk about Fury fighting foolish but I thought he adapted really well. I've never seen anything to suggest that Fury is capable to fighting a shut-out at long range against a determined decent opponent without getting caught. It's just something they say because he has such height and reach. He's okay behind the jab against punch bag opponents but It's when he's boxing at range that he starts lowering his guard.
The kind of looping right hands that he's vulnerable to are usually thrown from quite a distance.
Unforgiven is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2013, 09:04 AM   #10
SkillspayBills
Mandanda Running E-Pen
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 10,848
vCash: 500
Default Re: So just what was Cunningham's/Nazim's plan??

Here's my take..

Fury fought a sloppy fight early, He got caught yet against square on and in a terrible position defensively. He wasn't hurt IMHO Dave Farrar has a habit of going mental when Fury gets dropped. Which he should but sometimes he makes the situation seem a lot worse then it really is.

Fury found a way to win, He walked Cunningham down who i love as a boxer but he's a guy that gasses and can be bullied out of position. Fury did what any good big fighter should do and walked him down and leaned on U.S.S to drain him. He invested in the body and even early he was hurting Cunningham with jabs (facial expressions show this).

Fury was sloppy technically but he felt he could take those risks and it paid dividends. With regards to the finish well the body punch was a peach and set it all up and yes he does put the arm across face but it's more glove then forearm IMO and Cunningham was gone by then he turns away from Fury and cops for a right hander.

Fury showed a nasty streak which impressed me there last night. I must say i felt a bit annoyed by Cunningham's mentioning of size as my father says ''he wasn't made to fight Fury'' and lets be honest here Cunningham knew what he was going into he didn't have to move up to HW.

Naazim well i was going to make a thread on him, A man of wise words and catchy sayings but i'm starting to wonder about his work away from B-Hop.
SkillspayBills is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2013, 09:56 AM   #11
Flash Jab
Champion
East Side Guru
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 6,170
vCash: 100
Default Re: So just what was Cunningham's/Nazim's plan??

I think Cunningham was going for the knockout, fighting inside foolishly when Fury was doing the same and he's a mammoth guy. He was allowing the guy to hold onto him and put his weight on his shoulders. If Tyson was backing up, then going inside would've been a fair idea. But he wasn't. Tyson was storming forward without finding a smart way in, and Cunningham allowed him to. He abandoned the plan of getting the punch to the target and just started hunting it. But they both came to fight, and it was a great fight. I thought Cunningham could've handed him a boxing lesson if he'd approached the fight differently. Tyson could've still caught up to him eventually though because they're realistically two weight classes apart.

Great win for Fury though. Yeah he's never gonna be technically brilliant but he's far from a joke, and he's entertaining/. He's a godsend in today's Heavyweight division.
Flash Jab is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2013, 10:18 AM   #12
enpe
Journeyman
ESB Jr Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 178
vCash: 500
Default Re: So just what was Cunningham's/Nazim's plan??

Fury is most vulnerable at mid range, in close he's too tall to hit cleanly and will just smother anything coming at him. At long range he has too big a reach to hit without taking shots back, but at mid range, he's wide open to the overhand right, because he carries his left hand low. The best plan for Fury is to come in low with a jab to the body, overhand right, hook on the inside, then hold.
enpe is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2013, 10:23 AM   #13
craney91
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 2,474
vCash: 500
Default Re: So just what was Cunningham's/Nazim's plan??

Float like a butterfly, sting like a bee.

It worked when they led Fury into a false sense of security (as I predicted) people be saying before the fight, Cunningham was rattled and scared, I knew it would be the gameplan to lure Fury in and get him believing that.

Fury was bound to rush in and try to put a show on for his first fight in the US, and the best chance they had was to lure him into a shot. Which he did do, but he rocked Fury a few times in the fight. Fury was bravado and stupidly reckless, and the best bet Cunningham had, was by KO IMO.

Close, but no cigar.
craney91 is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2013, 10:23 AM   #14
Primadonna Kool
Champion
East Side Guru
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Liverpool
Posts: 9,790
vCash: 1000
Default Re: So just what was Cunningham's/Nazim's plan??

You have to respect USS for fighting a bigmans fight, i think he abandoned his gameplan to box and move! Due to his emotional involvement in the fight. That was a real fight guys, a real fight, not boxing.

I would like to see a rematch, i mentioned before the fight..? That USS is not that strong physically, and in the end the wheels did fall off. I think somebody like David Haye another old school heavyweight is slightly stronger than USS. Whcih was evident when David Haye fought a bull of a man in Derek Chisora.

When you fight buy guys like Tyson Fury, and you are a old school heavyweight! You do need that strength, because lets face it..? That was the only advantage Tyson Fury had! USS was the better fighter technically, and looked like the fitter fighter! Genetically i don't think Fury is the athlete some of these past super-heavyweights have been like Lewis, Bowe, Kiltschko etc

He's a exciting fighting but i saw problems the other night, genetic problems. Tyson Fury is doing everything right in training, but for me..? is struggling, when he faces more of these athlete type boxers! Like David Haye, i think he will be in big trouble.

But one thing i like about Tyson Fury, he can fight. Boxing and fighting are two totally different things, fighting is what he did last night! Boxing..? is what he did against Johnson but..? i don't think he could won, against USS in the same fashion so..? he chose to fight.
Primadonna Kool is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2013, 10:23 AM   #15
veritas
Journeyman
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 69
vCash: 500
Default Re: So just what was Cunningham's/Nazim's plan??

Fury did not look impressive last night. He fought at times with anger rather than intelligence, as he lumbered forward off balance looking for the KO. He was knocked off his stride for a couple of rounds after the knockdown, coming in with his hands low and without using his jab.

He certainly won by dint of his size, and judicious use of the forearm, against a much lighter and shorter opponent. For me Cunningham came out of the fight with a lot of credit. He was gutsy and never stopped trying to out gun his opponent. The fact is, guys like Fury, Price, and the Klits are super heavyweights. Pitting guys like Cunningham against giants like those guys is a travesty. I'd like to see Cunningham in with someone like Haye. Two skilled athletes around the same size. Would make for an interesting contest.

Finally, Fury made a c..t of himself both before and after the fight. He needs to get a grip of antics. They do him and the sport no favours.
veritas is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Reply

Boxing News 24 Forum > Boxing > British Boxing Forum

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump





All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:30 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Boxing News 24 Forum 2013