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Old 01-05-2014, 08:33 AM   #46
redrooster
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Default Re: Is Ali overrated, pound for pound?

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Originally Posted by DaveK View Post
An IQ of 67 is in the mentally retarded range. I seriously doubt Ali was that unintelligent...

Elroy, on the other hand....
I find it suspect also. I got it from a who's who of IQs

here's a few interesting ones:

Andy Warhol IQ of 86

Bobby Czyz 140

Dolph Ludgren - 160 which i can believe becuz of his line of work when he's not doing Sylvester Stallone movies (Chem. Eng)

Albert Einstein 160

James Woods 195

Marilan vos Savant highest recorded IQ of 228 though that too is suspect becuz of the way she tripped up on a physics question regarding a topic on momentum

Goyourownway - Iq of 60 (dumb personal trainer/stalker)
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Old 01-05-2014, 02:56 PM   #47
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Default Re: Is Ali overrated, pound for pound?

Rating Ali #1 p4p is overrating IMV. I do have him in my top 10 though. Remember it's easy to confuse famous with quality. He was a huge star and there may be an Ali halo around some of his opponents.
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Old 01-05-2014, 06:41 PM   #48
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Default Re: Is Ali overrated, pound for pound?

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Originally Posted by ribtickler68 View Post
I have no problem in anyone picking Ali as the best heavyweight ever; it would be hard not to have him in the top 5. My problem comes when people have him best pound for pound. I think there have been much better fighters at lower weights, with greater all round ability. Where would you put Ali in pound for pound terms?
Yes PFP he is overrated he outsized most of his opponents he had all the advantages save a few.
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Old 01-06-2014, 12:10 PM   #49
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Default Re: Is Ali overrated, pound for pound?

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Originally Posted by richdanahuff View Post
Yes PFP he is overrated he outsized most of his opponents he had all the advantages save a few.

He was n't THAT much bigger than his best opponents. And a couple,Liston and Foreman,were heavier.
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Old 01-06-2014, 12:13 PM   #50
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Default Re: Is Ali overrated, pound for pound?

#7, yo.
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Old 01-06-2014, 04:33 PM   #51
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Default Re: Is Ali overrated, pound for pound?

I think if you have Ali higher than 4th in P4P (ahead of Greb, SRR and Langford) you're over rating him. Since i see Ali as pretty clear pick as top HW, if you don't have him in top 10 P4P, you're ratings are biased against HWs. The only exception is if you have Joe Louis rated as top HW--I don't agree with that but it's it not a ridiculous rating. In that case Ali could be reasonably rated just outside the top 10 P4P.

Is Peter Dinklage the greatest actor of all time P4P?
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Old 01-06-2014, 04:42 PM   #52
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Default Re: Is Ali overrated, pound for pound?

Ali is probably one of the most overrated boxers of all time. This guy went life and death with Doug Jones. He had to take smelling salts to beat Henry Cooper.

Overrated to the max.
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Old 01-06-2014, 05:50 PM   #53
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Default Re: Is Ali overrated, pound for pound?

To be honest I'm more of a fan of the lighter weights for skill. I don't think for these pound for pound ratings you can really scale people up and compare like was mentioned in some of the early posts. What you can do though is rate their impact on their own division in their time taking into account how strong you think the division was.
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Old 01-06-2014, 10:07 PM   #54
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Default Re: Is Ali overrated, pound for pound?

Ali was a great fighter but by the lb he does not come close to top 10
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Old 01-07-2014, 01:33 AM   #55
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Default Re: Is Ali overrated, pound for pound?

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Originally Posted by redrooster View Post
he was the greatst interview i ever saw regardless of sport, or field of entertainment

supposedly with an IQ of 67, could hold his own in a coversation with lawyers of anyone else

and never came across as boring as with today's sports personalities; just so BORING!

even crazy people on interviews are so drab

as a fighter, I've seen better tho. Personally, I have him top 25
Who the fcuk was sufficiently STUPID to suggest Ali had an IQ of 67 ?
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Old 01-07-2014, 01:36 AM   #56
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Default Re: Is Ali overrated, pound for pound?

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Originally Posted by Bummy Davis View Post
Ali was a great fighter but by the lb he does not come close to top 10
If, by lb for lb, we mean overall greatness in terms of resume, legacy and demonstrated head to head ability, then he could certainly be placed anywhere from 4- 8. Any lower than 10 is hard to defend.
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Old 01-07-2014, 11:16 AM   #57
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Default Re: Is Ali overrated, pound for pound?

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Originally Posted by Elroy View Post
Honestly, lb for lb, it's unlikely ANY HW can really be even close to a top 10.

A HW in whatever era is expressly allowed to outweigh their opponents and indirectly substantially out-tall them as well, both of which can make their style specific to their body type.

Ali, Wladimir, Vitali, Lewis, Holmes all had a style that was dependant upon other factors on their height. None of these guys fought many opponents taller than themselves at all and when they did they were either not at their skill level (in the case of Wlad, Vits and Ali) or were severely challenged (Holmes vs Witherspoon).

If you consider Jerry Quarry and Muhammad Ali had similar styles but Ali was more successful because of his range.
They certainly had, lad.

When they fought, I could hardly tell them apart.

Good thing Jerry was White and Muhammad was black.



But uncannily similar styles !
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Old 01-07-2014, 11:24 AM   #58
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Default Re: Is Ali overrated, pound for pound?

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Originally Posted by Elroy View Post
Basically, in a lower division where all fighters are all approximately the same size (height is indirectly limited by weight)
???

I need to noodle on this a bit longer, maybe even get out my old biology and maths books.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Elroy View Post
So it's not because I dislike Ali, he is a great fighter. But he has no place at all on a toplist of lb for lb fighters at all! And neither does any HW.

I see.

Well, I will certainly ponder your words, E.
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Old 01-07-2014, 11:02 PM   #59
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Default Re: Is Ali overrated, pound for pound?

whats optimal height for say...welterweight ?
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Old 01-07-2014, 11:06 PM   #60
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Default Re: Is Ali overrated, pound for pound?

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Originally Posted by cuchulain View Post
They certainly had, lad.

When they fought, I could hardly tell them apart.

Good thing Jerry was White Irish and Muhammad was black Irish.



But uncannily similar styles !
Fixed.
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