If Armstrong Had Become a Four Division Champion...

Russell · 03-04-2008, 07:43 PM

An offical one, on paper, instead of being robbed...

Would he rank higher historically, on a P4P basis, all that?

Is it irrelevent considering what he already accomplished?

McGrain · 03-04-2008, 07:52 PM

He's a lock for the top four, Langford, Robinson, Armstrong then Greb for me personally, the elite, regardless.

But what about what he'd have done afterwards? With two miracle defences I think he'd be my#1. He deserved the chance.

03-04-2008, 08:43 PM

He's arguably number 1, pound-for-pound, of all-time.

Holding the middleweight crown would probably sway a large number more people towards his corner in the #1 p4p ATG debate.

Sweet Pea · 03-04-2008, 09:11 PM

Well, I for one consider him to be a 4 weight champion, being as he should've won that fight. An argument could be made for #1 as it is, but there's still guys like Langford, Greb, and Robinson, so it's hard to say definitively.

Barbados Joe Walcott is one who's been moving up my rankings, as well as Mickey Walker.

Russell · 03-04-2008, 09:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sweet Pea

Well, I for one consider him to be a 4 weight champion, being as he should've won that fight. An argument could be made for #1 as it is, but there's still guys like Langford, Greb, and Robinson, so it's hard to say definitively.

Barbados Joe Walcott is one who's been moving up my rankings, as well as Mickey Walker.

Why Walcott?

Sweet Pea · 03-04-2008, 09:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Russell

Why Walcott?

A 5'1 Welterweight who fought all the best up to Heavyweight, beating the top HW's of the time like Choyinski, and fighting the top guys at lower weights like Joe Gans and Sam Langford. Excellent resume, an absolute tank, and willing to fight any fighter of any size. The definition of P4P. A beast.

Sweet Pea · 03-04-2008, 09:36 PM

Great article on Walcott for Russell, though I'll try not to hijack this thread.

[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

Russell · 03-04-2008, 09:49 PM

Nope, no problems with that.

Thanks, Pea.

ThinBlack · 03-27-2012, 06:15 PM

Armstrong would be the #1 pound per pound fighter.

Vano-Irons · 03-27-2012, 06:30 PM

It's hard to say we would rate him higher, as almost everyone has him as a top 5 lock. But if he was given that decision, and made a successful defence, he would probably be my number 1 all time. As of now, he is my number 3

lufcrazy · 03-27-2012, 06:34 PM

Well I had him beating garcia anyways.

Some might not consider garcia to have been the true champion but any other claimant was merely a paper champ imo.

lufcrazy · 03-27-2012, 06:40 PM

By that I mean apostoli beat both thil and steele. He lost to corbett 3 then beat him in a rematch. Garcia then beat apostoli before getting his gift against armstrong.

DonBoxer · 03-27-2012, 06:57 PM

I think like McGrain said, with a few defenses thrown in he should be a lock for number 1.

swilson120 · 03-27-2012, 08:32 PM

henry no 1 my book

lufcrazy · 04-01-2012, 03:18 PM

Had armstrong been given the decision he deserved, I really can't see him staying in the division.

Surely history would remain unaltered apart from him getting the victory most attribute him with anyways?

Best in the world from feather to mw is remarkable. Especially the dominant fashion in which he achieved the accolades.

I just wish he wouldn't have ducked cocoa kid.

I see a lot of people comparing pac with armstrong in the general forum.

But pac was knocked out as flyweight champ. As fw champ he was schooled by marquez. I thought he did beat jmm in the rematch and he looked sensational against hatton at lww. The issue is he never really stamped his authority on any one division.

It's hard to gauge his ww with the looming shadow of floyd hanging over him: i'd bet the house on floyd beating pac but he's not active enough in the division. After beating mosley he went inactive for 14 months and when pac beat mosley he was the natural successor. Floyd can't just take his crown back without either facing pac or facing better guys than pac faces. Plus floyd has moved to lmw. Whilst I think pac has to be considered the top ww today it's a very dubious claim and one which i'm reviewing.

Either way I think it's a stretch comparing pac to hank.

03-04-2008, 07:43 PM	#1
Russell Undisputed Champion East Side VIP Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 12,165 vCash: 75	If Armstrong Had Become a Four Division Champion... An offical one, on paper, instead of being robbed... Would he rank higher historically, on a P4P basis, all that? Is it irrelevent considering what he already accomplished?
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03-04-2008, 07:52 PM	#2
McGrain Diamond Dog East Side VIP Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 63,274 vCash: 1000	Re: If Armstrong Had Become a Four Division Champion... He's a lock for the top four, Langford, Robinson, Armstrong then Greb for me personally, the elite, regardless. But what about what he'd have done afterwards? With two miracle defences I think he'd be my#1. He deserved the chance.
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03-04-2008, 08:43 PM	#3
Sonny's jab Guest Posts: n/a vCash:	Re: If Armstrong Had Become a Four Division Champion... He's arguably number 1, pound-for-pound, of all-time. Holding the middleweight crown would probably sway a large number more people towards his corner in the #1 p4p ATG debate.
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03-04-2008, 09:11 PM	#4
Sweet Pea P4P King East Side VIP Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: I never sleep, cuz sleep is the cousin of death Posts: 16,432 vCash: 1000	Re: If Armstrong Had Become a Four Division Champion... Well, I for one consider him to be a 4 weight champion, being as he should've won that fight. An argument could be made for #1 as it is, but there's still guys like Langford, Greb, and Robinson, so it's hard to say definitively. Barbados Joe Walcott is one who's been moving up my rankings, as well as Mickey Walker.
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03-04-2008, 09:36 PM	#7
Sweet Pea P4P King East Side VIP Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: I never sleep, cuz sleep is the cousin of death Posts: 16,432 vCash: 1000	Re: If Armstrong Had Become a Four Division Champion... Great article on Walcott for Russell, though I'll try not to hijack this thread. [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]
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03-04-2008, 09:49 PM	#8
Russell Undisputed Champion East Side VIP Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 12,165 vCash: 75	Re: If Armstrong Had Become a Four Division Champion... Nope, no problems with that. Thanks, Pea.
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03-27-2012, 06:15 PM	#9
ThinBlack Belt holder ESB Addict Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 3,985 vCash: 1000	Re: If Armstrong Had Become a Four Division Champion... Armstrong would be the #1 pound per pound fighter.
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03-27-2012, 06:30 PM	#10
Vano-Irons Team Ireland's Bitch Boy East Side Guru Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Stalking DFTaylor, letting him know he is wrong! Posts: 9,089 vCash: 75	Re: If Armstrong Had Become a Four Division Champion... It's hard to say we would rate him higher, as almost everyone has him as a top 5 lock. But if he was given that decision, and made a successful defence, he would probably be my number 1 all time. As of now, he is my number 3
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03-27-2012, 06:34 PM	#11
lufcrazy requiescat in pace East Side VIP Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: England, Up North Posts: 22,723 vCash: 330	Re: If Armstrong Had Become a Four Division Champion... Well I had him beating garcia anyways. Some might not consider garcia to have been the true champion but any other claimant was merely a paper champ imo.
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03-27-2012, 06:40 PM	#12
lufcrazy requiescat in pace East Side VIP Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: England, Up North Posts: 22,723 vCash: 330	Re: If Armstrong Had Become a Four Division Champion... By that I mean apostoli beat both thil and steele. He lost to corbett 3 then beat him in a rematch. Garcia then beat apostoli before getting his gift against armstrong.
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03-27-2012, 06:57 PM	#13
DonBoxer The Lion! East Side Guru Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: In Vitalis cut. Posts: 5,489 vCash: 75	Re: If Armstrong Had Become a Four Division Champion... I think like McGrain said, with a few defenses thrown in he should be a lock for number 1.
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03-27-2012, 08:32 PM	#14
swilson120 Contender ESB Senior Member Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 1,026 vCash: 1000	Re: If Armstrong Had Become a Four Division Champion... henry no 1 my book
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04-01-2012, 03:18 PM	#15
lufcrazy requiescat in pace East Side VIP Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: England, Up North Posts: 22,723 vCash: 330	Re: If Armstrong Had Become a Four Division Champion... Had armstrong been given the decision he deserved, I really can't see him staying in the division. Surely history would remain unaltered apart from him getting the victory most attribute him with anyways? Best in the world from feather to mw is remarkable. Especially the dominant fashion in which he achieved the accolades. I just wish he wouldn't have ducked cocoa kid. I see a lot of people comparing pac with armstrong in the general forum. But pac was knocked out as flyweight champ. As fw champ he was schooled by marquez. I thought he did beat jmm in the rematch and he looked sensational against hatton at lww. The issue is he never really stamped his authority on any one division. It's hard to gauge his ww with the looming shadow of floyd hanging over him: i'd bet the house on floyd beating pac but he's not active enough in the division. After beating mosley he went inactive for 14 months and when pac beat mosley he was the natural successor. Floyd can't just take his crown back without either facing pac or facing better guys than pac faces. Plus floyd has moved to lmw. Whilst I think pac has to be considered the top ww today it's a very dubious claim and one which i'm reviewing. Either way I think it's a stretch comparing pac to hank. Last edited by lufcrazy; 04-01-2012 at 03:31 PM.
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