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Old 03-15-2008, 07:46 AM   #61
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Default Re: Religious folks: Ever wonder why you tend to be less intelligent and less educated?

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Old 03-15-2008, 08:07 AM   #62
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Default Re: Religious folks: Ever wonder why you tend to be less intelligent and less educate

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kamus
This is all nice to talk about but I wonder what you would do if you got sick? Would you stay at home and pray to god to heal you, or would you go see a doctor? I know what I would do.
Some of these posts out here are frighteningly ignorant.

I'D DO BOTH!
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Old 03-15-2008, 08:17 AM   #63
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Default Re: Religious folks: Ever wonder why you tend to be less intelligent and less educated?

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Originally Posted by crippet
No. It's just a reality check for the gullible.

You have even quoted earlier that you believe praying has cured cancer!!

There really is no beginning to your intellect.
I said that prayer was the only thing between imminent death and her walking out of the hospital as stunned doctors stood by. That's first hand. There is no other explanation that I know of and in my life, there has been precedent for similar things that just defy explanation.

One thing I'm not is gullible. Another thing I'm not is stupid. But you remain a theological ignoramus who should consider silence during a conversation about religion.
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Old 03-15-2008, 08:57 AM   #64
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Default Re: Religious folks: Ever wonder why you tend to be less intelligent and less educate

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Originally Posted by ChrisPontius
Jesus is just a psychological concept. Nothing more. Have you ever seen Jesus? Seen him walk on water?

Probably you have "felt" Jesus. Just like you have felt love, happiness, etc. It's all in your mind.
First of all, the skeptical mind is a healthy mind. But you should keep it open just a little.

Have you ever seen Joe Walcott? Seen him stop Choynski? Seen him knock down and defeat a man 115 pounds heavier than him?

Incidentally, I don't claim to "feel" Jesus. I have spend a lifetime studying what is written about him and learning about Christian theology; my attraction is intellectual first. But we are more than simply intellectually capable beings. We also have a part of us that strives for meaning and hope and consolation. Now, perhaps you find those things in "p*ssy". I've tried that route and found it unfulfilling in the deeper sense. I believe that I have found it in another place. If you believe that I am a drooling idiot because of that, well, a part of me understands why... but this "fantasy" -if you like has saved my life and improved it markedly.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisPontius
Let's be real here. The only time that ugly bastard gets to see any ***** is when he came from his mother's fat womb. You think he'll have many friends and a social life? Why did God condemn him to a miserable life with that horrifying excuse of a face? Why does God make babies that miss limps? Did their parents not pray enough?
The happiest people I have ever known are those with down syndrome.

And let us refrain from making assumptions: How do you know he is miserable? Do you equate happiness with appearances? That's Hollywood theology, CP -and there is nothing uglier than those horrors. Have you ever read "The Picture of Dorian Gray" by Oscar Wilde? You'd find it interesting. The concept at least.

If my friends stopped being such because my face fell apart then good riddance to them. If I was born with one eye in the middle of my forehead and a nose that looked like your shoe, I would probably have learned to depend on God alot earlier in my life.

Let me ask you: if your favorite poster on ESB looked like that, would you be his friend?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisPontius
Okay, so according to you it doesn't really matter whether you're basically a slave who constantly has to work, worry about survival, food with no possesions at all or whether you're healthy and you can go through life with no worries about primary living needs and all the luxery/***** you need?

Be real here man. If you could choose to be born in a random place in Africa where they cut off hands and brutalize people for next to no reason at all, or be born in a wealthy country like Danmark, how long would you have to think?
How about asking Roberto Duran if he would have preferred to have been born and raised in Denmark?

There is gold in suffering -and anyone who follows boxing should be utterly convinced of that.

The full answer is actually a very long one. In sum, I think that you misunderstand the perspective of those who profess the Christian faith. My life hasn't been easy, and I would bet a good amount that I grew up poorer than anyone on this site. Every criminilogical risk factor leading to incarceration is in bold print in my background -welfare, fatherlessness, poverty, delinquent peers, overcrowded conditions in projects, blah blah blah, who cares. In basic terms, what Christianity teaches is not "self-reliance" directly, but reliance on something greater. The disadvantaged (like me) are perhaps more open (or prone) to this paradigm because they do not have the material things that you may have. But I think that it is arrogant and elitist to slur them with terms like "gullible" and "naive".
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Old 03-15-2008, 09:11 AM   #65
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Default Re: Religious folks: Ever wonder why you tend to be less intelligent and less educated?

Faith is a personal thing, its a personal relationship with GOD, I have been a horible sinner at times in my life and in trouble. I had a lot of people praying for me and I have seen Miracles and healings and I was a skeptic and a unbeliever. I always went through the motions of going to church on Easter and Funerals and Weddings but not until someone I knew close had a miraculas healing. It did not make sense to me in my mind but have seen simular things happen again, The thing is do not listen to anyone else's logic, its a personal thing, you either believe in SUPERNATURAL or you dont. There are many examples of People who have the wounds of Christ and Scientists had no answers,only to say it could be the power of the mind. There have been places like Lourdes,France and Medjugorie, Yugoslavia where millions have seen visions and miracles and there is no Logic or answer, there are storys of Scientists being converted in these places. I know there are religious fanatics that are brainwashed and used because of it and Phoneys that preach there own agenda for there own reasons but that is also in goverment, business and MAN and any form of life. All I have to say is I was a skeptic and unbeliever and leaned more towards societys and Governments bad guys then the Good, but there is good in every bad man and Bad in the good ones, its a battle to be the higher man and "Nothing is Impossible with GOD" but Faith is not only for those that are Cerebal (although there are many brilliant scholars that are of Faith) and educated people. The only thing I can say is that this is the last post or reponse I will have on this subject but I dont doubt anyones intellect and repect everyones opinion and postion in life. I will say a Prayer for everyone on this board and I ask those with a GLIMMER of faith to Pray to God and ask him for answers, some strange things could happen. AND NOW BACK TO BOXING
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Old 03-15-2008, 09:20 AM   #66
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Default Re: Religious folks: Ever wonder why you tend to be less intelligent and less educated?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stonehands89
I said that prayer was the only thing between imminent death and her walking out of the hospital as stunned doctors stood by. That's first hand. There is no other explanation that I know of and in my life, there has been precedent for similar things that just defy explanation.

One thing I'm not is gullible. Another thing I'm not is stupid. But you remain a theological ignoramus who should consider silence during a conversation about religion.
Touche' Stonehands.
Even a fool is thought wise if he keeps silent,
and discerning if he holds his tongue.
Prov. 17:28
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Old 03-15-2008, 09:32 AM   #67
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Default Re: Religious folks: Ever wonder why you tend to be less intelligent and less educate

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stonehands89
First of all, the skeptical mind is a healthy mind. But you should keep it open just a little.

Have you ever seen Joe Walcott? Seen him stop Choynski? Seen him knock down and defeat a man 115 pounds heavier than him?

Incidentally, I don't claim to "feel" Jesus. I have spend a lifetime studying what is written about him and learning about Christian theology; my attraction is intellectual first. But we are more than simply intellectually capable beings. We also have a part of us that strives for meaning and hope and consolation. Now, perhaps you find those things in "p*ssy". I've tried that route and found it unfulfilling in the deeper sense. I believe that I have found it in another place. If you believe that I am a drooling idiot because of that, well, a part of me understands why... but this "fantasy" -if you like has saved my life and improved it markedly.


The happiest people I have ever known are those with down syndrome.

And let us refrain from making assumptions: How do you know he is miserable? Do you equate happiness with appearances? That's Hollywood theology, CP -and there is nothing uglier than those horrors. Have you ever read "The Picture of Dorian Gray" by Oscar Wilde? You'd find it interesting. The concept at least.

If my friends stopped being such because my face fell apart then good riddance to them. If I was born with one eye in the middle of my forehead and a nose that looked like your shoe, I would probably have learned to depend on God alot earlier in my life.

Let me ask you: if your favorite poster on ESB looked like that, would you be his friend?


How about asking Roberto Duran if he would have preferred to have been born and raised in Denmark?

There is gold in suffering -and anyone who follows boxing should be utterly convinced of that.

The full answer is actually a very long one. In sum, I think that you misunderstand the perspective of those who profess the Christian faith. My life hasn't been easy, and I would bet a good amount that I grew up poorer than anyone on this site. Every criminilogical risk factor leading to incarceration is in bold print in my background -welfare, fatherlessness, poverty, delinquent peers, overcrowded conditions in projects, blah blah blah, who cares. In basic terms, what Christianity teaches is not "self-reliance" directly, but reliance on something greater. The disadvantaged (like me) are perhaps more open (or prone) to this paradigm because they do not have the material things that you may have. But I think that it is arrogant and elitist to slur them with terms like "gullible" and "naive".
Well, okay, if it makes you happy then you should believe in it.
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Old 03-15-2008, 09:46 AM   #68
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Default Re: Religious folks: Ever wonder why you tend to be less intelligent and less educated?

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I've never seen you in the Classic Section before. It looks to me like you went out of your way to slur not only a significant percentage of posters who happen to be religious, but the vast majority of boxers past and present.

Perhaps you should "Rise Above" your baser instincts.
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Old 03-15-2008, 10:02 AM   #69
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Default Re: Religious folks: Ever wonder why you tend to be less intelligent and less educated?

For those interested. I found this ironic with all the opinions flying about in here.
The Holy Bible.

What is the shortest chapter in the Bible?
Psalms 117.

What is the longest chapter in the Bible?
Psalms 119.

Which chapter is in the center of the Bible?
Psalms 118.

Fact: There are 594 chapters before Psalms 118.

Fact: There are 594 chapters after Psalms 118.

Add those numbers together and you get 1188.

What is the center verse in the Bible? Psalms 118:8.

What is that verse?
"It is better to trust the LORD than to put confidence in man"

Before attempting to discredit the Bible, why don't you please look up the facts for youself. It is an unparalleled book of history AND prophecy.
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Old 03-15-2008, 10:13 AM   #70
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Default Re: Religious folks: Ever wonder why you tend to be less intelligent and less educated?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stonehands89
I said that prayer was the only thing between imminent death and her walking out of the hospital as stunned doctors stood by. That's first hand. There is no other explanation that I know of and in my life, there has been precedent for similar things that just defy explanation.

One thing I'm not is gullible. Another thing I'm not is stupid. But you remain a theological ignoramus who should consider silence during a conversation about religion.
The fact that you believe that Cancer going into remission is an act of God petitioned by Prayer, really does illustrate the low level of education you received.
Do you believe that anyone photographing you is stealing your soul??

The sad self indulgent fact is that 'religious' folk cherry pick whichever passages from the bible suit their own personal moral code and dismiss anything whichdoesnt suit them as allegorical or metaphorical.

Or do you Stonehead89 acknowledge that you freely worship a brutal God who practices infanticide??, Who commands the brutal murder of women?. Who condemns homo***uals to death???

Or do you conveniently choose to ignore parts of your Bible which you don't agree with??

A Theological question for you ...

I have a neighbour who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself??
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Old 03-15-2008, 10:24 AM   #71
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Default Re: Religious folks: Ever wonder why you tend to be less intelligent and less educated?

I myself am a Christian believer and while Ithere are many who surpass me in intellect, I'm sure, I am also not unintelligent or undereducated for that matter. Without trying to shove a bible in anyones face and make an argument in favor of my faith, particularly not in this rather hostile forum, I will say that it is all a matter of faith in whatever you believe in. You live and die by your faith, whatever it's in. I only regret the lack of civility from those posters who are denigrating the belief in God, and particularly from none other than ChrisPontius, a poster whom I respect highly for his boxing opinions which I always find thought provoking and interesting even if I don't specifically agree each time. Why is it so necessary to vent such contempt and hatred against something you obviously don't believe in? Christianity is such a convenient and safe target in today's secular world because most Christians, real ones that is, don't retaliate with the venom and the violence and hostility that is often aimed at them, unlike the Moslems, for instance. The same expressions of vitriol aginst the Moslem faith, incidently can be very dangerous to your own physical safety, by the way, so it might be prudent for you to limit your hostility and such to Christians, who arent likely to seek violence against you in return. This is just a friendly word of warning to exercise your penchant for bigotry against a 'safe" target, like a Christian, and be careful lest you spark a "jihad" against you in return from a faithful follower of Islam. Also, do you know how many great boxers of the present, and particularly of the past that you're maligning? Diverse persons such as Tiger Flowers, Jersey Joe Walcott, Tommy Loughran, Floyd Patterson, Ezzard Charles, Paulie Ayala, just off the top of my head, not including so many others, not to mention the many of the faith of Islam as well, such as Ali, Saad Muhammad, Eddie Mustafa, Dwight Qawi, etc...,Let's get back to boxing, which is what this forum is all about, and not direct such hatred, contempt and derision against something that, in the end, you can't DISPROVE anyway.
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Old 03-15-2008, 10:49 AM   #72
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Default Re: Religious folks: Ever wonder why you tend to be less intelligent and less educated?

I can sympathize with those who cant understand how and why intelligent people will believe that the original man was instantaneously made from dust and woman was made from one of his ribs. These stories are outlandish, and if they are true then there's a lot of explaining to do. The religious people dont like explaining.

I can relate to those mocking these ideas. And the believers only answers are "I personally believe, you cant disprove it".
Surely the burden of proof is on those who believe these stories. I mean, all the scientists who claim the earth was made a long time AFTER "the heavens", and that creatures roamed the earth for ages before man came along, they provide SOME PROOF to back up these claims.
The religious people provide what exactly to back up their claims ?
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Old 03-15-2008, 11:15 AM   #73
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Default Re: Religious folks: Ever wonder why you tend to be less intelligent and less educated?

Quote:
Originally Posted by crippet
The fact that you believe that Cancer going into remission is an act of God petitioned by Prayer, really does illustrate the low level of education you received.
Do you believe that anyone photographing you is stealing your soul??

The sad self indulgent fact is that 'religious' folk cherry pick whichever passages from the bible suit their own personal moral code and dismiss anything whichdoesnt suit them as allegorical or metaphorical.

Or do you Stonehead89 acknowledge that you freely worship a brutal God who practices infanticide??, Who commands the brutal murder of women?. Who condemns homo***uals to death???

Or do you conveniently choose to ignore parts of your Bible which you don't agree with??

A Theological question for you ...

I have a neighbour who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself??
You're retorts are common and simplistic; and although I am not going to go to any length to answer them, they are pretty easy to parry and illuminate. Before you gripe about that I will tell you why: There are none so blind as those who will not see.

As per your accusation of my "low level of education":

I graduated summa cum laude -undergraduate and graduate, from universities in Boston. I was awarded several academic awards, including a fellowship to a doctoral program at the State University of New York at Albany for sociology -which is considered elite. I'm the published author of a history book that is in most libraries and university libraries in the western world and in several nations in the east.

How about yourself?
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Old 03-15-2008, 11:31 AM   #74
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Default Re: Religious folks: Ever wonder why you tend to be less intelligent and less educated?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stonehands89
You're retorts are common and simplistic; and although I am not going to go to any length to answer them, they are pretty easy to parry and illuminate. Before you gripe about that I will tell you why: There are none so blind as those who will not see.

As per your accusation of my "low level of education":

I graduated summa cum laude -undergraduate and graduate, from universities in Boston. I was awarded several academic awards, including a fellowship to a doctoral program at the State University of New York at Albany for sociology -which is considered elite. I'm the published author of a history book that is in most libraries and university libraries in the western world and in several nations in the east.

How about yourself?
That's all very well, but did you answer his questions ?

Simplistic or not, I thought they were IMPORTANT questions.
When a "religious law" (in fact, divine rule from God) prescribes the death penalty for a sin, these things need to be addressed IN CLEAR and PLAIN TERMS.
I mean, they seem important to me. They are important issues.
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Old 03-15-2008, 11:37 AM   #75
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Default Re: Religious folks: Ever wonder why you tend to be less intelligent and less educated?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stonehands89
You're retorts are common and simplistic; and although I am not going to go to any length to answer them, they are pretty easy to parry and illuminate. Before you gripe about that I will tell you why: There are none so blind as those who will not see.
And none so dumb as those who will not speak!

If you hold a belief on what basis do you hold it true. If you hold a belief because 'you just believe it' you should try to avoid intelligent discussion as your argument is very shallow and without any substance.

You have added nothing to this discussion except your own belief. Please enlighten everyone why should everyone believe something that there are no proven facts substantiating. But mant facts proving Christian religion is just the bastardization of a plethora of earlier religions dating from as far back as the worship the sun.

Another Theological question for you to avoid...

Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a
defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle room here?
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