Ali v tyson

fg2227 · 07-13-2007, 04:02 PM

Been done million times, i was just wondering what the experts opinion is on this topic?

McGrain · 07-13-2007, 04:06 PM

Ding-ding round 1.

I pick Ali. I think Ali is one of the two or three fighters that Tyson has little hope against. Both have freakish reactions, but Ali has proved his at the highest level. I don't think he'll have a problem getting out of the way of Tyson's first shot most of the time, and this idea that Tyson can launch his second before Ali has scored with accuracy, is not serious.

In the case that Ali does get caught he has the neccesary chin to ride it out in my view. He is a great survivor and smart enough to manage. Meanwhile there is every chance that Tyson will become discouraged in the later rounds and sacrifice defence for aggression. If that happens then Tyson could be stopped - if he keeps his head Ali wins a pretty wide UD.

duran77 · 07-13-2007, 04:11 PM

Well said

Danny Ocean · 07-13-2007, 04:15 PM

ali ko 11 too fast to smart

Robbi · 07-13-2007, 04:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by I Am Legend

Tyson KO 6 Against the 60's ali.

What have you been smoking?

626BrownBomber · 07-13-2007, 04:46 PM

The Muhammad Ali that fought Liston vs. Mike Tyson that fought Mike Spinks. These were the two fights where I feel these men were at their absolute best. We all know that Mike's only chance of beating Muhammad is by ko, and the fact that Muhammad has never been ko'd(yes he was tkoed as and old man but he was on his feet) and he fought the likes of Foreman, Frazier, Norton, Liston, Cleavland Willams, Lamar Clark, Norton and Patterson speaks volumes about his chin. Mike on the other hand has been ko'd several times, only 2 of which in his prime or near prime. And in those prime or near prime ko's, he soaked up tremendous punishment before succumbing. There is no question who has the better technical skills, the Greatest. But Mike had freakish speed and punching power and anyone could be ko'd by him if they made a mistake. His hand and foot speed I think were second only to his hypothetical opponent. Tyson's body shots would not slow The Greatest down either. This being said, I would have to go with The Greatest on an 8 th round tko, but it would be the greatest fight at any weight of all time. The quenessential puncher vs. the quentessential boxer, what a dream fight. There is little shame in losing to a prime Ali or Tyson, thats for sure.

My dinner with Conteh · 07-13-2007, 04:50 PM

I do agree that Tyson has more chance against the mid-60s version than the 74-75 model. Still, UD either way.

McGrain · 07-13-2007, 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 626BrownBomber

The Muhammad Ali that fought Liston vs. Mike Tyson that fought Mike Spinks. These were the two fights where I feel these men were at their absolute best.

Dunno about that friend. I take it you mean Liston II? How would we know what kind of shape/at what level Ali was at for that fight? It only lasted seconds - the same goes for Mike v Spinks. I'd go for Ernie Terrell Ali and Trevor Berbick Tyson. How about that?

Quote:

There is no question who has the better technical skills, the Greatest.

Sorry man, I don't know about this either. Technically, I would give Mike the edge - certainly as far as punching goes. In other ares, Ali sort of creates his own rules but as far as offensive delivery goes, i'd give Tyson the nod.

Quote:

There is little shame in losing to a prime Ali or Tyson, thats for sure.

No lie.

McGrain · 07-13-2007, 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by My dinner with Conteh

I do agree that Tyson has more chance against the mid-60s version than the 74-75 model. Still, UD either way.

I have heard this idea floated before - feel like fleshing it out a little bit?

Muchmoore · 07-13-2007, 04:53 PM

Tyson is a bad matchup for Ali. Tyson was trained to beat boxers like Ali and disposed of them all. The guys that beat Tyson were strong, rough, tough guys that didnt back up from Tyson. Tyson loved when guys backpedaled from him because it was easy for him to get into mid range.

Tyson would be able to catch Ali as he backs up and finish him off. Alis lack of fundamental blocking and defense cost him here as hes fighting a guy with as good reflexes as himself.

McGrain · 07-13-2007, 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by I Am Legend

the one thats sees Clay carry his hands at his waist and almost get KO'd by cooper. His hands were so low, he could get away with it against bums like terrel, but not against a world class fighter like mike tyson.

Of course you would never see Clay fannying about like that v Tyson - I agree that if he did he would get murdered. Please don't call Terrel a bum, whatever he was, he wasn't that.

Quote:

Ali never met a truly great finisher either, if he gets stunned against tyson, i reckon he'd be finished.

Let's agree that he never met a finisher as good as Tyson and leave it at that - unless you had fought Tyson, though, you probably never did.

I do think that it's interesting to postulate what would have happened if Ali got caught very very early in a late round by Tyson.

Muchmoore · 07-13-2007, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by My dinner with Conteh

I do agree that Tyson has more chance against the mid-60s version than the 74-75 model. Still, UD either way.

The 74-75 Ali didnt have the movement and elusiveness to avoid Tysons blows. If he rope a dopes against Tyson, its over. Tyson was a patient, steady destroyer at his best, not an impatient Foreman who threw every punch full power and gassed out.

GazOC · 07-13-2007, 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muchmoore

Tyson is a bad matchup for Ali. Tyson was trained to beat boxers like Ali and disposed of them all. The guys that beat Tyson were strong, rough, tough guys that didnt back up from Tyson. Tyson loved when guys backpedaled from him because it was easy for him to get into mid range.

Tyson would be able to catch Ali as he backs up and finish him off. Alis lack of fundamental blocking and defense cost him here as hes fighting a guy with as good reflexes as himself.

I dunno, Ali could fight this either way, on the back foot boxing (60's Ali) or in close leaning on Tyson and pushing down on him (70's Ali)

Either way I think Tyson would get discouraged and go into that mode where he just waits to get stopped (Holy 1, Lewis).

McGrain · 07-13-2007, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by I Am Legend

Stick and move was THE way to get yourself obliterated against tyson

I agree with that - and that Tyson did what he did better than anyone else ever. But Ali (Terrell) also did what he did better than anyone else ever.

Overall, I would bet that Manilla Ali has the better chance. What do you see where that one is concerned?

Muchmoore · 07-13-2007, 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GazOC

I dunno, Ali could fight this either way, on the back foot boxing (60's Ali) or in close leaning on Tyson and pushing down on him (70's Ali)

Either way I think Tyson would get discouraged and go into that mode where he just waits to get stopped (Holy 1, Lewis).

That was an unmotivated Tyson that was in it more for the money than to win. When Tyson was getting destroyed by Douglas he roared back and dropped Buster in the 8th, and had it not been the end of the round probably would of won. A young Tyson kept fighting no matter what you threw at him.

07-13-2007, 04:02 PM	#1
fg2227 Contender ESB Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 1,463 vCash: 1000	Ali v tyson Been done million times, i was just wondering what the experts opinion is on this topic?
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07-13-2007, 04:06 PM	#2
McGrain Diamond Dog East Side VIP Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 63,251 vCash: 1000	Re: Ali v tyson Ding-ding round 1. I pick Ali. I think Ali is one of the two or three fighters that Tyson has little hope against. Both have freakish reactions, but Ali has proved his at the highest level. I don't think he'll have a problem getting out of the way of Tyson's first shot most of the time, and this idea that Tyson can launch his second before Ali has scored with accuracy, is not serious. In the case that Ali does get caught he has the neccesary chin to ride it out in my view. He is a great survivor and smart enough to manage. Meanwhile there is every chance that Tyson will become discouraged in the later rounds and sacrifice defence for aggression. If that happens then Tyson could be stopped - if he keeps his head Ali wins a pretty wide UD.
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07-13-2007, 04:11 PM	#3
duran77 newbie Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 49 vCash: 1000	Re: Ali v tyson Well said
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07-13-2007, 04:15 PM	#4
Danny Ocean My nAmE IS MoNeY ESB Addict Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 2,553 vCash: 1000	Re: Ali v tyson ali ko 11 too fast to smart
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07-13-2007, 04:46 PM	#6
626BrownBomber newbie Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 12 vCash: 1000	Re: Ali v tyson The Muhammad Ali that fought Liston vs. Mike Tyson that fought Mike Spinks. These were the two fights where I feel these men were at their absolute best. We all know that Mike's only chance of beating Muhammad is by ko, and the fact that Muhammad has never been ko'd(yes he was tkoed as and old man but he was on his feet) and he fought the likes of Foreman, Frazier, Norton, Liston, Cleavland Willams, Lamar Clark, Norton and Patterson speaks volumes about his chin. Mike on the other hand has been ko'd several times, only 2 of which in his prime or near prime. And in those prime or near prime ko's, he soaked up tremendous punishment before succumbing. There is no question who has the better technical skills, the Greatest. But Mike had freakish speed and punching power and anyone could be ko'd by him if they made a mistake. His hand and foot speed I think were second only to his hypothetical opponent. Tyson's body shots would not slow The Greatest down either. This being said, I would have to go with The Greatest on an 8 th round tko, but it would be the greatest fight at any weight of all time. The quenessential puncher vs. the quentessential boxer, what a dream fight. There is little shame in losing to a prime Ali or Tyson, thats for sure.
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07-13-2007, 04:50 PM	#7
My dinner with Conteh P4P King East Side VIP Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 21,587 vCash: 1000	Re: Ali v tyson I do agree that Tyson has more chance against the mid-60s version than the 74-75 model. Still, UD either way.
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07-13-2007, 04:53 PM	#10
Muchmoore Champion East Side Guru Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 5,443 vCash: 1000	Re: Ali v tyson Tyson is a bad matchup for Ali. Tyson was trained to beat boxers like Ali and disposed of them all. The guys that beat Tyson were strong, rough, tough guys that didnt back up from Tyson. Tyson loved when guys backpedaled from him because it was easy for him to get into mid range. Tyson would be able to catch Ali as he backs up and finish him off. Alis lack of fundamental blocking and defense cost him here as hes fighting a guy with as good reflexes as himself.
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