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Old 05-13-2008, 12:26 PM   #46
janitor
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Default Re: The Evolution from Low Gaurd to High Gaurd

An 1889 aricle by Billy Edwards on the effect of early gloves on the sport of boxing.

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Old 05-13-2008, 01:00 PM   #47
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Default Re: The Evolution from Low Gaurd to High Gaurd

Thanks, Janitor! Cool piece.
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Old 05-13-2008, 02:22 PM   #48
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Default Re: The Evolution from Low Gaurd to High Gaurd

Damn 8oz gloves hurt enough. 4oz would kill me!
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Old 06-09-2008, 10:17 AM   #49
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Default Re: The Evolution from Low Gaurd to High Gaurd

Let's not forget also that boxing gloves were designed to protect a fighter's hands as well as an opponents face. With his hands well taped and padded gloves on, a boxer could let fly with more punches without as much concern for breaking his hands. In the days of bare knuckle fighting a fighter had to be very careful about where and when he let a punch go and it was better to block a shot from the outside as opposed to keeping a high guard near his face. A human fist doesn't offer much protection in that type of guard so it was better to stop it early before it got that close. This style was still used in the early days of gloved boxing as the gloves were rather small compared to todays gloves and didn't offer as much protection in close. When glove technology improved and the gloves got bigger and more padded then the guard became higher as the bigger glove offered more protection to a fighters face and a fighter could let fly with a greater array of punches withuot as much fear of breaking his hands on his opponents skull which is much harder than the relatively brittle carpal and metacarpal bones of the hand. As always, form follows function which is why the old style of boxing wouldn't work in todays game. Bring back 4 ounce gloves or bare knuckles and it would.
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Old 06-09-2008, 02:16 PM   #50
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Default Re: The Evolution from Low Gaurd to High Gaurd

Quote:
Originally Posted by SuzieQ49
The art of Boxing with a high gaurd is essential. Boxing in the old times used to be with your hands low and out, and since then it has modernized to hands up and elbows in. Such changes has been done for a reason. The first signs of switched from low gaurd to high gaurd occured in the 1940s consistently. Brilliant trainers such as Whitey Bimstein, Charlie Goldman,Jack Blackburn, Cus Damato, Ray Arcel, helped bring forth the art of the high gaurd. They realized that their fighters by keeping them with low hands were putting themselves at risk of getting caught flush every second of the fight. Even though they would be sacrificing feinting ability by highering their gaurd, they would be protecting themselves from getting hit flush unexpectadly. Also offensivley, when you look at punching. When your hands are low you have to punch all the way up at an arc of an angle, and if your hands are already up protecting your face...you can simply throw the punch straight....enabling your punch to execute faster because less distance traveled.

Pre 1940 Modern style


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Leaving himself vunerable with low gaurd


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Jeffries and Corbett both leave themsevles vulnerable



Long accurate jabs which developed in the more modern eras would be the kryponite for holding your hands low.




Evolution: Switch to High Gaurd post 1940

Boxing Style changed. We learn from our historical mistakes. Trainers leanred from their historical boxing mistakes and used that to change boxing styles. By the 1940s, Fighters started to carry their hands up high and tuck their elbows in. The high gaurd protects the vital areas of the head(temple) and the elbows protect the liver punches. This basic technique still sticks in the gym today.

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**** Tiger having trouble with his opponents high gaurd



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Machen's high gaurd spoils one of Folley's Great Jab.


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Louis high gaurd enables him avoid a fast straight charles punch



Here are two youtube Clips: Watch for specificully the high gaurd on these heavyweights...

Study Roland Lastarza's high gaurd
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Now Study Eddie Machens high gaurd
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Ropes


Keeping your gaurd high when you get driven into the ropes is the most important aspect of basic defense. why? because the rope stops you from being able to move elusivley for the most part,in essence in a small way your trapped. You need to keep that guard up high when he chases you into the ropes, to protect the swarm of punches that will be coming your way. Unless your pernell whitaker and willie pep which 99% of fighters are not, you better keep a high gaurd laying back onto the ropes to prevent from getting pounded. Here is an example of what happens when you keep your hands low being driven into the ropes


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watch 1:30-1:35 If Gene when being driven back had simply kept his hands high, he would have blocked that first dempsey left hook and been able to weather the storm.




Now heres a look at the correct art of keeping a high gaurd to prevent up top from happening......

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Ali keeping a high gaurd ready to block one of foremans bombs







Modern Day basic Boxing fundamentals:


High Gaurd


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That example of Tunney falling against the ropes happened to him once in 81 fights,I see we are now going to be treated to boxing expertise lessons from you Suzie,I was boxing 20 years before you were born as Im sure some of the other posters were ,Its just possible we allready know the rudiments of defence.Dont get too carried away with the Petronelli gym will you.Ive fought with different size gloves and boot leg with just electrical tape on my hands ,you ought to try it ,itll sure make you wary of catching a shot to the head!
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Old 06-09-2008, 04:11 PM   #51
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Default Re: The Evolution from Low Gaurd to High Gaurd

[quote=janitor]
Quote:


You are right but it should be noted that boxing was as big and organised when it was illegal in many ways.

When Tom Cribb fought Tom Mollineux, boxing was illegal but it was patronised by royalty and when a major fight took place every boarding room for a 30 mile radius got booked out.

When Tom Cribb fought Tom Molineux the fight actualy got more press coverage than the battle of Trafalgar!!!!!!



There is certainly an element of that in boxing but the concequences of screwing up are more serious than in most sports which tends to force a rapid pace of evolution.

Call it natural selection.
"When Tom Cribb fought Tom Molineaux the fight actually got more press coverage than the battle of Trafalgar!!!!!"

Tom Cribb was more charismatic than Horatio Nelson. If Nelson had lost at Trafalgar the British would still have muddled through. But if Cribb had lost, the sun would have begun to set.
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Old 06-15-2008, 01:07 AM   #52
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Default Re: The Evolution from Low Gaurd to High Gaurd

If you can get clips of Jack Johnson and some of the old masters, you can see that they were really adept at slipping, countering, parrying, and other lost arts. I think part of it is that the old fights were longer and it is tiring to hold your guard up for 20 plus rounds in the blazing sun. The fights back then were on holidays like July 4 and Labor Day, since that is the only time people were off of work to watch the fights. And I think California and Nevada were the only legal places, so it was often scorching hot for the big fights.

Great posts of the high-guard defense from several modern greats!
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Old 06-15-2008, 05:53 AM   #53
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Default Re: The Evolution from Low Gaurd to High Gaurd

Suzy,

Just to get an example of the art of high guard that is prevalent now, i youtubed Klitchsko and come up with round 5 of Brewster Klitchsko. ONly problem is that neither fighter used a high guard! both kept their hands down low. Look closely, for most of the time, their guard is low. Klitchsko actually keeps his hands pointing directly to the ground for a lot of the time. Bad example though, so i clicked on the Lewis Tyson fight. Here i saw a good example of the high guard. Only problem is, that it was from Mike Tyson. And the guy using the low guard, Lennox lewis won the fight convincingly. Then i tried the last round of Mercer vs Lewis. Again, Lewis utilised the low guard in this round. Mercer tried a higher guard, for most of the round, though he did tend to drop his lead hand, with a high right hand. Looking at those fighters, it was all a bit confusing. Which modern superheavy fights do you suggest i look at to get a good example of the effectiveness of the high guard? Lennox certainly seems to have some success with the low guard, Did he always use the low guard?
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Old 06-15-2008, 06:54 AM   #54
ChrisPontius
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Default Re: The Evolution from Low Gaurd to High Gaurd

I don't know which rounds of Lewis-Mercer you've watched, but most if not all of the time Mercer was in close, Lewis had his guard up, blocking most of the stuff coming in. A longer range, of course, he kept his hands low because he could afford to do so.

About Klitschko-Brewster, Wladimir kept his hands up most of the time, despite being exhausted... Brewster isn't exactly the most technically correct fighter, but still has his guard much higher than the older timers.
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Old 06-15-2008, 09:53 AM   #55
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Default Re: The Evolution from Low Gaurd to High Gaurd

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisPontius
I don't know which rounds of Lewis-Mercer you've watched, but most if not all of the time Mercer was in close, Lewis had his guard up, blocking most of the stuff coming in. A longer range, of course, he kept his hands low because he could afford to do so.

About Klitschko-Brewster, Wladimir kept his hands up most of the time, despite being exhausted... Brewster isn't exactly the most technically correct fighter, but still has his guard much higher than the older timers.
I only saw the final rounds (again) of both this afternoon. Vlad definitely didnt have his hands up in that round (have a look on you tube). I will have a look at other rounds again when i get the chance. Lewis against Mercer final round also was mostly a low guard, particularly with the front hand by Lewis. If i recall from last time i watched the the fight, Lewis vs Vitali featured two low guards (although i could be wrong). Given that i only watched the final rounds, is the low guard solely due to exhaustion, is it to save energy, or is it just laziness?
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