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Old 07-08-2008, 11:53 PM   #16
rekcutnevets
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Default Re: Mike Tyson beats Sonny Liston

This is a difficult fight for me. I can see ways for both fighters to win, and am not 100% certain in my pick. I may even change my mind during my post.

Liston be roughly the same size as Tyson with just over a foot in reach advantage. Liston could step around his opponent, but didn't look interested in backing up. I don't know if Liston's reach advantage would be a large factor here.

Tyson would be the most powerful fighter Liston ever faced, and only Ali and Patterson could claim as fast or faster hands. Tyson would also have one of the best chins Liston faced. With his build, Tyson was probably able to take a punch better than Ali. Ali's will to win just out matches Tyson's chin in regards to punishment.

I think Tyson's hand speed would be too much for Liston for the first 5 rounds. Tyson was not much into wrestling with an opponent, so Liston would be able to tie him up and occasionally push him around on the inside. Still, Tyson would get off he cleaner punches in the early going. Tyson was loaded with fast twitch muscle fibers, and they would begin to wear out after 6 or so rounds. Liston would start finding his stride around the 6th round. The problem is, he will have lost the first 5 rounds and he doesn't really have a ton of late round stoppages himself.

Liston also fades down the stretch, and Tyson wins a decision 8-7 in rounds.
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Old 07-09-2008, 02:58 AM   #17
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Default Re: Mike Tyson beats Sonny Liston

Quote:
Originally Posted by prime
Liston is not my definition of a man. His psyche is about as suspect as Tyson's. Liston himself folded like a cheap suit to Clay's childlike mind games and moderate trouble in defending the crown. To me Liston is not the one to expose Tyson's fragility.

Liston is a step behind Tyson in speed and power. Tyson over Liston.
Seconded.
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Old 07-09-2008, 03:39 AM   #18
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Default Re: Mike Tyson beats Sonny Liston

[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

Ever hear the story between Tyson and this guy?
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Old 07-09-2008, 03:55 AM   #19
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Default Re: Mike Tyson beats Sonny Liston

No.
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Old 07-09-2008, 04:41 AM   #20
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Default Re: Mike Tyson beats Sonny Liston

Quote:
Originally Posted by fists of fury

Ever hear the story between Tyson and this guy?
Rumor has it they made sweet love while Tyson kissed those bigs lips of his and ****ed him till he loved him.
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Old 07-09-2008, 05:35 AM   #21
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Default Re: Mike Tyson beats Sonny Liston

Same one I heard then.
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Old 07-09-2008, 09:54 AM   #22
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Default Re: Mike Tyson beats Sonny Liston

Quote:
Originally Posted by prime
Liston is not my definition of a man. His psyche is about as suspect as Tyson's. Liston himself folded like a cheap suit to Clay's childlike mind games and moderate trouble in defending the crown. To me Liston is not the one to expose Tyson's fragility.

Liston is a step behind Tyson in speed and power. Tyson over Liston.
The "a Man" comment was there for contrast (with "manchild"), it was also there to call to mind the words on Sonny's grave.

I would agree completely that there are several donzen who would -and have- made Tyson look like that comparative child he is. Danny Williams being the latest. Sonny's on the thread and considering his career in toto as well as the circumstances of his life and his rise to the top, I think that Tyson is far less than Sonny in terms of heart. This doesn't excuse the shady circumstances surrounding his career -I for one would not be surprised if Pontius' theory about Machen's and William's claims are right.

Liston was bad. He hurt alot of people, particularly when drunk, but he was no coward, and I think that Tyson, in his heart of hearts, really was. There are just too many attempts to bite, break arms, and other poor ways of escaping distress.

I don't like Tyson's chances against any ATG who would hurt him -not stun him like Tucker or Ruddock- hurt him. Tyson, though durable as hell, did have a tendency to stay hurt and lose confidence drastically when that happened, even though his body would stay upright for longer than the average guy.
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Old 07-09-2008, 09:59 AM   #23
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Default Re: Mike Tyson beats Sonny Liston

Everyone rates Tyson high H2H yet forget about the mental aspect of boxing when piting him against other heavyweights. If Tyson couldn't knockout Ali, Louis, Holmes and others early he's going to have problems.
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Old 07-09-2008, 10:04 AM   #24
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Default Re: Mike Tyson beats Sonny Liston

Quote:
Originally Posted by mr. magoo
Mike Tyson beats Sonny Liston
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Old 07-09-2008, 12:12 PM   #25
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Default Re: Mike Tyson beats Sonny Liston

Liston is one of my picks for someone who might stand a chance against Mike, but in this case I think Tyson had the speed advantage over Liston and power to match. Tyson would take it in the end.
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Old 07-09-2008, 12:39 PM   #26
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Default Re: Mike Tyson beats Sonny Liston

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stonehands89
While Wealthy Elite masturbates to his imaginary MegaTyson at ringside of this imaginary bout and gets arrested like Pee Wee Herman for exhibitionism, Liston would show the "Manchild" what "a Man" is. And he'd be doing it gradually and painfully.

Tyson would be expected to do some damage early, but I just don't see Liston getting hurt or not bending his knees and returning fire when Tyson is in range. And Tyson would be preoccupied with that telephone pole of a jab -and wary about what's coming behind it.

It is well-established that Tyson was not effective without forward motion. Liston had more than enough strength to move him off balance and backwards. And he could hit like hell and had a defense that was better than the majority of HW champions.

Tyson would fade precipitously with every round -not only physically but emotionally.

Tyson was a fake thug.

Liston was a real-life bad-ass.

Tyson was known to beat up these:
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Ask this guy what Liston did to him one night in Vegas outside the Thunderbird:

[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]
Who is the wrestler Liston clobbered Stonehands? Just curious. Thanks.
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Old 07-09-2008, 12:41 PM   #27
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Default Re: Mike Tyson beats Sonny Liston

Tyson's speed would be a problem for Liston. Liston's jab would be a bigger problem for Tyson IMO. Power is equal.

Liston KO 10 Tyson
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Old 07-09-2008, 12:55 PM   #28
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Default Re: Mike Tyson beats Sonny Liston

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sardu
Who is the wrestler Liston clobbered Stonehands? Just curious. Thanks.
Dick the Bruiser
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Old 07-09-2008, 03:55 PM   #29
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Default Re: Mike Tyson beats Sonny Liston

Quote:
Originally Posted by ironchamp
This can actually work in reverse.

Movement and speed has always troubled Sonny Liston. Tyson has the headmovement and speed necessary to take minimal punishment while having the handspeed to retaliate with his own leather (Ok, so did Patterson) but the biggest difference between Patterson and Tyson is that Tyson was more explosive and fought far more aggresively.

Liston-Patterson I, Floyd showed me up until he was caught, was that a bob and weave peek-a-boo defense if used consistently can give any fighter with the physicalities of a world class fighter a serious advantage over Liston. (this includes Frazier, Marciano, Tua, Morrison- if his chin holds up, etc)

You dont beat Tyson by landing that one big punch. Liston's lack of handspeed means, that even if he does land on Mike it wont be in combination which is vital in beating Mike.
I can see your point, but if I was looking for sombody to beat Liston I would not start by looking for a better version of Floyd Patterson.

Tyson is going to be coming forward into fire and is going to have to take a lot of punishment to get through. Also consider that Liston was good on the inside if Tyson got in close.
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Old 07-09-2008, 04:08 PM   #30
ChrisPontius
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Default Re: Mike Tyson beats Sonny Liston

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stonehands89
Dick the Bruiser
As you may have noticed, i'm not the biggest Liston fan around, but this was one story that i actually enjoyed very much. Especially considering that "look how tough i am" picture of the Bruiser.
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