boxing
Forum Home Boxing Forum European British Classic Aussie MMA Training
Go Back   Boxing News 24 Forum > Boxing > Classic Boxing Forum


Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 07-09-2008, 08:57 PM   #16
Mendoza
Dominating a decade
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 14,912
vCash: 1000
Default Re: Jack Dempsey vs. Jack Johnson

Quote:
Originally Posted by mcvey
Yet he couldnt ko Gibbons ?Is there any part of my post that said Dempsey would be stationary? Don't suggest **** to me Mendoza ,I was watching Dempsey on super8mm 45 years ago. I have every bit of footage of Dempsey that is available.For the record ,I rate him the number 3 heavyweight of all time ,above Joe Louis.I dont require any lessons from you on William Harrison Dempsey.You should change your name from Mendoza to Battery ,you are so full of acid towards Johnson .A mean sob? Carpentier broke a clinch between Johnson and Moran,,Moran dropped his hands Johnson threw a right uppercut and broke his nose,thats mean.

And Gibbons was KO'd how many times in his career? Try once in a 106 matches. So Dempsey did not KO Gibbons. He won rather easily, which is something Johnson could not say in quite of few of his title matches vs lesser opponents.

Dempsey was easily meaner and far more destructive than Johnson was in the ring. But I suppose Johnson flawless defense, that saw him getting out hustled by the likes of Marvin Hart, losing by a shade according to the press to a past his prime O’Brien, floored by a crude middle weight Ketchel, beaten but lucked into a draw vs Jim Johnson, and near even with the likes of a Frank Moran, means the mauler would not land a glove on Johnson!

PS: I doubt you have all the footage on Dempsey. I have him sparring on film with lower weight fighters. I have him in a rare exhibition match vs Levinsky. Collectors had a different version of the Willard film which runs at a smoother speed, and the un-edited Fripo match, but like you said I'm sure you have ever bit of footage on Dempsey available as claimed.
Mendoza is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Old 07-09-2008, 09:19 PM   #17
mcvey
P4P King
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: The Garden Of England
Posts: 23,494
vCash: 1000
Default Re: Jack Dempsey vs. Jack Johnson

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mendoza
And Gibbons was KO'd how many times in his career? Try once in a 106 matches. So Dempsey did not KO Gibbons. He won rather easily, which is something Johnson could not say in quite of few of his title matches vs lesser opponents.

Dempsey was easily meaner and far more destructive than Johnson was in the ring. But I suppose Johnson flawless defense, that saw him getting out hustled by the likes of Marvin Hart, losing by a shade according to the press to a past his prime O’Brien, floored by a crude middle weight Ketchel, beaten but lucked into a draw vs Jim Johnson, and near even with the likes of a Frank Moran, means the mauler would not land a glove on Johnson!

PS: I doubt you have all the footage on Dempsey. I have him sparring on film with lower weight fighters. I have him in a rare exhibition match vs Levinsky. Collectors had a different version of the Willard film which runs at a smoother speed, and the un-edited Fripo match, but like you said I'm sure you have ever bit of footage on Dempsey available as claimed.
I have him sparring with Paul Getty hows that? Charlie Chaplin, and Douglas Fairbanks,Jack Delaney. all from a Black hawk news reel.I have three versions of the Willard fight the latest on dvd shows much more clearly the damage to Willards face,you can even see the welts on his body.Have you seen Dempsey sparring with Baer and Schmeling? I have.
mcvey is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2008, 09:40 PM   #18
Mendoza
Dominating a decade
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 14,912
vCash: 1000
Default Re: Jack Dempsey vs. Jack Johnson

Quote:
Originally Posted by mcvey
I have him sparring with Paul Getty hows that? Charlie Chaplin, and Douglas Fairbanks,Jack Delaney. all from a Black hawk news reel.I have three versions of the Willard fight the latest on dvd shows much more clearly the damage to Willards face,you can even see the welts on his body.Have you seen Dempsey sparring with Baer and Schmeling? I have.
Yes, I have seen Demspey with Baer, Schmeling, Chaplin, and Delaney. Not Fairbamks as far as I know. Also vs Tate.
Mendoza is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2008, 09:49 PM   #19
mcvey
P4P King
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: The Garden Of England
Posts: 23,494
vCash: 1000
Default Re: Jack Dempsey vs. Jack Johnson

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mendoza
Yes, I have seen Demspey with Baer, Schmeling, Chaplin, and Delaney. Not Fairbamks as far as I know. Also vs Tate.
Tate is available on You Tube,there is a rumour that a sparring session with Loughran was filmed , not confirmed though.
mcvey is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2008, 07:17 AM   #20
papke26
Journeyman
ESB Jr Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 228
vCash: 1000
Default Re: Jack Dempsey vs. Jack Johnson

Johnson wouldnt of even lived with jeffries if the fight would of taken place in his prime. People rate that fight against jeffries sometimes as proff of his greatness. But using that king of anology trever berbick was the greatest ever fighter in the top division for disposing of ali
papke26 is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2008, 07:18 AM   #21
papke26
Journeyman
ESB Jr Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 228
vCash: 1000
Default Re: Jack Dempsey vs. Jack Johnson

Dempsey All The Way
papke26 is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2008, 07:29 AM   #22
fists of fury
Champion
East Side Guru
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: March for Revenge
Posts: 6,517
vCash: 137
Default Re: Jack Dempsey vs. Jack Johnson

Quote:
Originally Posted by McGrain
Johnson is all wrong for Dempsey in my view.
I'd like to hear your views as to why. My initial reaction said Dempsey but maybe you can persuade me otherwise?
fists of fury is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2008, 07:32 AM   #23
mcvey
P4P King
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: The Garden Of England
Posts: 23,494
vCash: 1000
Default Re: Jack Dempsey vs. Jack Johnson

Quote:
Originally Posted by papke26
Johnson wouldnt of even lived with jeffries if the fight would of taken place in his prime. People rate that fight against jeffries sometimes as proff of his greatness. But using that king of anology trever berbick was the greatest ever fighter in the top division for disposing of ali
I think everyone on this Forum knows that Jeffries was a shell of the fighter he had been ,however we are discussing Dempsey not Jeffries.
mcvey is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2008, 07:46 AM   #24
Maxmomer
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,690
vCash: 619
Default Re: Jack Dempsey vs. Jack Johnson

I think Dempsey was the better fighter head to head, but Johnson would have the style to bother him. They were both excellent in the clinches. While Johnson would be able to neutralize Dempsey a lot of the time in close, Dempsey would still be doing considerable damage with his short hooks. I'd imagine this fight would be pretty boring, with a lot of clinching, so it would come down to who could do more damage inside and who was more active. My vote is Dempsey, as I rate him the better in-fighter and puncher and think he'd be busier and push the fight most of the time. While Johnson would have success in the clinches, he'd find himself out-gunned on the inside. I think Dempsey'd get cut up pretty bad, I also think that each one would score a KD at some point. I vote Dempsey by close, ugly Decision victory.
Maxmomer is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2008, 12:20 PM   #25
OLD FOGEY
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,835
vCash: 1000
Default Re: Jack Dempsey vs. Jack Johnson

Dempsey came out flaming from the opening bell. I think the shock of his early attack overwhelmed older fighters schooled in the waltz around and feel them out for a few rounds tweny-round era. Jack Johnson fought at the deliberate pace of that older era. If Johnson is still there in the second or the third round, I think he wins. I figure Johnson handles Dempsey inside and punishes him with uppercuts. Even the bloody and battered Willard held his own with Dempsey inside and rocked him with an uppercut.

Johnson by decision or late ko.

I would really like to see this one.
OLD FOGEY is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2008, 06:28 PM   #26
round15
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,681
vCash: 1000
Default Re: Jack Dempsey vs. Jack Johnson

Quote:
Originally Posted by pugilist_boyd
dempsey would i believe overwelm the slower paced johnson and ko him,he was to aggresive to be calmly held in a clench
Jack Johnson slower paced? Jack Johnson had footwork and defensive skills that are grossly underappreciated. Pound for pound he's one of the fastest heavyweights aside from Ali and I think he'd win, prime for prime against Dempsey by a unanimous decision. People forget that he was way ahead of his time and only given opportunities when he was nearly past his prime.
round15 is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2008, 07:25 PM   #27
janitor
P4P King
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 21,969
vCash: 1000
Default Re: Jack Dempsey vs. Jack Johnson

This match would esentialy pit the best pure ofensive heavyweight of all time against the best pure defensive heavyweight of all time.

Who would prevail?

Hard to say.

We know exactly how good Dempsey was but we dont quite know all the subtlties of Johnsons technique in my opinion. It is these subtlties on the inside which are almost impossible to make out on film which would win it for Johnson if he were able to win it.
janitor is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2008, 07:34 PM   #28
mcvey
P4P King
East Side VIP
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: The Garden Of England
Posts: 23,494
vCash: 1000
Default Re: Jack Dempsey vs. Jack Johnson

Quote:
Originally Posted by janitor
This match would esentialy pit the best pure ofensive heavyweight of all time against the best pure defensive heavyweight of all time.

Who would prevail?

Hard to say.

We know exactly how good Dempsey was but we dont quite know all the subtlties of Johnsons technique in my opinion. It is these subtlties on the inside which are almost impossible to make out on film which would win it for Johnson if he were able to win it.
"You can have your cake ,and eat it too" . Bob Dylan.
mcvey is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 07-11-2008, 02:03 AM   #29
pugilist_boyd
BUSTED UP PUG
ESB Full Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: missouri,usa
Posts: 415
vCash: 1000
Default Re: Jack Dempsey vs. Jack Johnson

dempsey couldnt ko gibbons because for a big part of the fight gibbons wanted to leave extremly bad.back peddlin,holdin,back pedlin,and if this fight were in johnsons era johnson would get severly beaten by dempseys superior inside tactics like rabbit punches,kidney shots,groin shots,and many more leagal inside shots that johnson simply couldnt handle this wasnt a starving farmer-shell of the real jeffries this was the peak tyson of the 20,s my point is if in johnsons era refs were more blind which would benifit the rutheless animal dempsey was
pugilist_boyd is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Old 07-11-2008, 02:34 AM   #30
Maxmomer
Belt holder
ESB Addict
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,690
vCash: 619
Default Re: Jack Dempsey vs. Jack Johnson

Quote:
Originally Posted by mcvey
"You can have your cake ,and eat it too" . Bob Dylan.
Well what's the point of buying a cake if not to eat it?
Maxmomer is offline  Top
Reply With Quote
Reply

Boxing News 24 Forum > Boxing > Classic Boxing Forum

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump






All times are GMT -4. The time now is 03:28 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Boxing News 24 Forum 2015