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Old 08-07-2008, 02:04 AM   #1
GoldenHulk
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Default If Jerry Quarry fought in the 1930's....

I think in that decade apart from Louis and Schmeling, Quarry would have an excellent chance against Sharkey, Carnera, Baer, and Braddock. Apart from Baer who would have to pretty much catch him, I think Jerry would easily counter-punch Sharkey, Carnera, and Braddock to victory.
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Old 08-07-2008, 04:22 AM   #2
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Default Re: If Jerry Quarry fought in the 1930's....

Hm, i think a "on"-Braddock has a good chance of beating Quarry as would the Max Baer of the Schmeling fight but if they aren´t Quarry wins. Sharkey imo is just a better fighter than Quarry and would beat him also.
Quarry would be a contender who perhaps grabs the belt in the early 30s but would rate behind the Top3 of the 30s, Louis, Schmeling and Sharkey.
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Old 08-07-2008, 06:47 AM   #3
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Default Re: If Jerry Quarry fought in the 1930's....

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoldenHulk
I think in that decade apart from Louis and Schmeling, Quarry would have an excellent chance against Sharkey, Carnera, Baer, and Braddock. Apart from Baer who would have to pretty much catch him, I think Jerry would easily counter-punch Sharkey, Carnera, and Braddock to victory.
Sharkey,at his best outpoints Quarry ,I give Jerry a very good chance of beating Carnera and Braddock,in fact I would make him favourite,he would also have a chance against Baer as he did well with slow moving big punchers.
Schmeling beats Quarry I think.
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Old 08-07-2008, 06:58 AM   #4
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Default Re: If Jerry Quarry fought in the 1930's....

Quarry had a very good shot of beating everyone of them excluding Louis and he would have been dangerous for Joe for a while as well ...
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Old 08-07-2008, 07:36 AM   #5
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Default Re: If Jerry Quarry fought in the 1930's....

How would quarry have done vs a slick boxer type 6'6 fighter like jack trammell who would stick a long stiff jab in his face all night?


how would quarry do against a very polished technical boxer like john henry lewis?


quarry would do very well, but dont forget the 1930s had some very good contenders who quarry would have had all kinds of trouble with
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Old 08-07-2008, 09:08 AM   #6
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Default Re: If Jerry Quarry fought in the 1930's....

I think Quarry would have fit right in that mix of contenders. I also think Joe Louis would catch him and finish him pretty early. His era had 3 guys he wasn't beating. In the 30's, I only see one he'd have no chance against.
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Old 08-07-2008, 12:56 PM   #7
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Default Re: If Jerry Quarry fought in the 1930's....

Quote:
Originally Posted by SuzieQ49
How would quarry have done vs a slick boxer type 6'6 fighter like jack trammell who would stick a long stiff jab in his face all night?


how would quarry do against a very polished technical boxer like john henry lewis?


quarry would do very well, but dont forget the 1930s had some very good contenders who quarry would have had all kinds of trouble with
My take is that while the champions weren't as outstanding as in Quarry's era, there was more depth of good contenders. I question whether Quarry would have emerged from the pack--Stribling, Risko, Uzcudun, Schaaf, Hamas, Loughran, Farr, etc, etc. In his own era, Quarry got chance after chance because he was one of the few good contenders, and, if we are honest about it, he was the only white American heavyweight of any ability at all. In the thirties he would just have been another in a deep field of contenders from which the champions did not stand out.

Quarry might have had a championship reign if he had gotten a shot at the right champion at the right time, which could also be said of Loughran, Schaaf, Stribling, Godfrey, Gains, Farr, Hamas, Risko, and a number of others. I think, though, that he would probably have fought out his career as a contender who never really emerged from the pack, much like Art Lasky, and be little remembered today.
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Old 08-07-2008, 01:45 PM   #8
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Default Re: If Jerry Quarry fought in the 1930's....

i think that Quarry would have been closer to the elite teir than he was in his own era but still outside it. The beswt fighters of that period were better than him and some of the second teir as OLD FOGEY says would split series with him.

The bottom line is that he could plausibly become champion, but like Carnera and Braddock it could only be with a measure of luck.
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Old 08-07-2008, 07:47 PM   #9
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Default Re: If Jerry Quarry fought in the 1930's....

Quote:
Originally Posted by OLD FOGEY
My take is that while the champions weren't as outstanding as in Quarry's era, there was more depth of good contenders. I question whether Quarry would have emerged from the pack--Stribling, Risko, Uzcudun, Schaaf, Hamas, Loughran, Farr, etc, etc. In his own era, Quarry got chance after chance because he was one of the few good contenders, and, if we are honest about it, he was the only white American heavyweight of any ability at all. In the thirties he would just have been another in a deep field of contenders from which the champions did not stand out.

Quarry might have had a championship reign if he had gotten a shot at the right champion at the right time, which could also be said of Loughran, Schaaf, Stribling, Godfrey, Gains, Farr, Hamas, Risko, and a number of others. I think, though, that he would probably have fought out his career as a contender who never really emerged from the pack, much like Art Lasky, and be little remembered today.
A reasonable view.

My only difference, is your implication that Quarry's recieving multiple paydays was due to his being the only white American heavyweight with top ability. While this is true to some extent, I think Quarry generally deserved his shots against titlists and big named contenders. He afterall, was beating many top raters himself such as Shavers, Lyle, Patterson and M. Foster. He may not have made the very best of his biggest fights, but earning those opportunities is a different story.

I won't claim that Quarry would have been the star of the 1930's. But, I do feel that he would have been a consistant contender throughout much of the decade, and even made a good run for the title. He did prove, being one of the few white contenders in the golden era of black heavyweights, that he was a solid challenger who could beat the lot of the crop. In an era where athletes were mostly white, less athletic, and blacks held down, Quarry who was far more accustomed to more competitive circumstances may have made a greater mark than most...
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Old 08-07-2008, 07:51 PM   #10
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Default Re: If Jerry Quarry fought in the 1930's....

Quote:
Originally Posted by janitor

The bottom line is that he could plausibly become champion, but like Carnera and Braddock it could only be with a measure of luck.
I don't want to nit pick on you Janitor, but in all fairness, when other debates take place, you do not often describe Carnera and Braddock's reigns as resulting from luck....
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Old 08-07-2008, 07:57 PM   #11
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Default Re: If Jerry Quarry fought in the 1930's....

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoldenHulk
I think in that decade apart from Louis and Schmeling, Quarry would have an excellent chance against Sharkey, Carnera, Baer, and Braddock. Apart from Baer who would have to pretty much catch him, I think Jerry would easily counter-punch Sharkey, Carnera, and Braddock to victory.
Quarry vs Schmeling is a pick em' type of match. Outside of that, I think Quarry was a bit better than Sharkey, Baer, Carnera, and Braddock.

Louis in his prime would not have an easy night vs Quarry, though I think his power would win the day.

Quarry was a fighter stuck in a time line when Frazier was at his best, and Ali was pretty close to his best. In another era, Quarry could have been champion.
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Old 08-07-2008, 08:02 PM   #12
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Default Re: If Jerry Quarry fought in the 1930's....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mendoza
Quarry vs Schmeling is a pick em' type of match. Outside of that, I think Quarry was a bit better than Sharkey, Baer, Carnera, and Braddock.

Louis in his prime would not have an easy night vs Quarry, though I think his power would win the day.

Quarry was a fighter stuck in a time line when Frazier was at his best, and Ali was pretty close to his best. In another era, Quarry could have been champion.
I agree somewhat.

The claim, however that he lost to prime versions of Frazier and Ali is somewhat misleading, and not exactly telling the whole story. He lost rather easily to Ali who had not fought in nearly 4 years. Additionally, Ali and frazier were not the only losses he had during his prime. He picked up defeats to Jimmy Ellis and an aging Machen. There are some who even feel that he was gifted in one of his fights against an aging Patterson. The Chuvalo fight, though controversial, left something to be desired.

I do agree however that he was a very talented counterpuncher/boxer, who possesed a decent punch and a good strong heart. I don't see Braddock, Sharkey, or Carnera beating him. Baer, due to his durability and hard punch may have worn down Quarry, but then again, Baer looks rather crude on film, when compared to the finess counterpunching ability of Jerry.
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Old 08-07-2008, 08:21 PM   #13
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Default Re: If Jerry Quarry fought in the 1930's....

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Originally Posted by OLD FOGEY
My take is that while the champions weren't as outstanding as in Quarry's era, there was more depth of good contenders. I question whether Quarry would have emerged from the pack--Stribling, Risko, Uzcudun, Schaaf, Hamas, Loughran, Farr, etc, etc. In his own era, Quarry got chance after chance because he was one of the few good contenders, and, if we are honest about it, he was the only white American heavyweight of any ability at all. In the thirties he would just have been another in a deep field of contenders from which the champions did not stand out.

Quarry might have had a championship reign if he had gotten a shot at the right champion at the right time, which could also be said of Loughran, Schaaf, Stribling, Godfrey, Gains, Farr, Hamas, Risko, and a number of others. I think, though, that he would probably have fought out his career as a contender who never really emerged from the pack, much like Art Lasky, and be little remembered today.
I disagree with this somewhat. Quarry was not the only good ranked white fighter in the late 60's to mid 70's. There was Bugner, Chavalo, Bobbick, Bonevenna, ...those guys. While none became champion, they were stuck with Fraizer, Foreman and Ali. No one in the 1930's would have a chance at winning a series vs Frazier, Foreman or Ali, with the exception of Joe Louis.

Top to bottom, the the mid 60's to mid 70's was perhaps the richest 10 year period of heavyweight boxing. Guys like Ali, Foreman, Frazier, Shavers, Norton, Quarry, Lyle, Patterson, Young, Ellis, and others at this point in time were in or close to their primes their prime.

This to me is a far greater talent level than the 1930's.

IMO Quarry's work rate, speed, skills, and stamina were too much for the fighters you mentioned in the 1930's, save Louis and maybe a motivated Max Baer.
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Old 08-07-2008, 08:43 PM   #14
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Default Re: If Jerry Quarry fought in the 1930's....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mendoza
Quarry was not the only good ranked white fighter in the late 60's to mid 70's. There was Bugner, Chavalo, Bobbick, Bonevenna, ...
Bonavena was actually argentinian. Not Caucasion. Bobbick would not emerge until the later 70's, and when he did, he easily fizzled. Chuvalo's prime was during the 60's, not the 70's. Bugner was a good fighter in his prime, but never truly captured the interest of the public. He was a play it safe fighter, who lost to many average entities.
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Old 08-07-2008, 08:50 PM   #15
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Default Re: If Jerry Quarry fought in the 1930's....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mendoza
I disagree with this somewhat. Quarry was not the only good ranked white fighter in the late 60's to mid 70's. There was Bugner, Chavalo, Bobbick, Bonevenna, ...those guys. While none became champion, they were stuck with Fraizer, Foreman and Ali. No one in the 1930's would have a chance at winning a series vs Frazier, Foreman or Ali, with the exception of Joe Louis.

Top to bottom, the the mid 60's to mid 70's was perhaps the richest 10 year period of heavyweight boxing. Guys like Ali, Foreman, Frazier, Shavers, Norton, Quarry, Lyle, Patterson, Young, Ellis, and others at this point in time were in or close to their primes their prime.

This to me is a far greater talent level than the 1930's.

IMO Quarry's work rate, speed, skills, and stamina were too much for the fighters you mentioned in the 1930's, save Louis and maybe a motivated Max Baer.
I said "American white fighter"--Bugner was English, Chuvalo Canadian, and Bonavena Argentine. Bobick arrived on the heavyweight scene at almost the exact moment when Quarry was exiting. He wasn't really a rival for Quarry.

You list names above, but Ellis did better than any but the big three and was in fact a blown up middleweight with a losing record against rated middleweights, who still beat Quarry, Chuvalo, Bonavena, etc. On what basis do we assume these men were so much better than those of the thirties?

When did Quarry prove he had outstanding stamina? Or, necessarily, outstanding skills, especially on defense? He generally was pretty wide open.

You make the good point that Joe Louis stood above the contenders of the thirties while Ali, Frazier, and Foreman stood above the contenders of the late sixties and early seventies. I don't think you can draw the conclusion, though, that therefore mere contenders such as Ellis and Quarry, who failed badly against Ali and Frazier, were somehow better than the contenders of the thirties. Tommy Farr and Ernie Schaaf, for example, were bigger than Quarry and Ellis and had skills. Stribling was a very skilled and durable fighter. Uzcudun and Levinsky went 20 rounds in the sun at Reno with Baer. Godfrey would have been as awesome in 1970 as in 1930. Gains would be dangerous for anyone.

Last edited by OLD FOGEY; 08-07-2008 at 09:09 PM.
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