The top 30 (at least) at each weight , including P4P

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by frankenfrank, Jun 16, 2011.


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  1. JAB5239

    JAB5239 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Exactly. His rankings are based on fantasy and assumptions. Case in point, he ranks Foreman ahead of Ali because he believes Foreman would have won had the ropes not been loose in Zaire. This is a claim which can NEVER be backed up, so you have to judge by their actual encounter and who else they actually fought in their careers. H2h comparisons should be used to influence your own opinion to a small degree, not dictate in entirely.
     
    JAB5239, Jun 20, 2011
    JAB5239, Jun 20, 2011
    #46
  2. BoxingFanNo1

    BoxingFanNo1 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Nah, just a really really really dedicated troll, it's an artform.
     
    BoxingFanNo1, Jun 20, 2011
    BoxingFanNo1, Jun 20, 2011
    #47
  3. frankenfrank

    frankenfrank Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    See the below
    Yes
    Do you know what subjective/objective is ? cuz I don't.
     
    frankenfrank, Jun 20, 2011
    frankenfrank, Jun 20, 2011
    #48
  4. frankenfrank

    frankenfrank Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Valuev either carried his opponents knowingly or did it indirectly by not training seriously because he didn't want to hurt no one .
    You have no idea about the way he could have been if threatened and motivated for someone like a Klitschko or Lewis .
     
    frankenfrank, Jun 20, 2011
    frankenfrank, Jun 20, 2011
    #49
  5. Saintpat

    Saintpat Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I agree AC Slater > Lance Armstrong, but ...

    Charles Manson > Theodore Cleaver > Inspector Gadget > Optimus Prime > Gomer Pyle
     
    Saintpat, Jun 20, 2011
    Saintpat, Jun 20, 2011
    #50
  6. JAB5239

    JAB5239 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I don't know whether to laugh :lol: or cry :verysad at your logic.
     
    JAB5239, Jun 20, 2011
    JAB5239, Jun 20, 2011
    #51
  7. frankenfrank

    frankenfrank Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I tried thinking about the top 30 MWs , but discovered that the MW division was actually never stacked in talent .
    The reason is probably just in case.
    Anyway , both Hagler's and Monzon's majority of "great" wins came against former welterweights and lightmiddleweights whom were also older and done in Monzon's case .
    Walker Smith was in fact a welterweights/lightmiddleweights who beat lightmiddleweights and middleweights . Even those who "beat" him were beaten more decisively by him or were actually even with him almost to the last year of his career when he was 43 .
    Currently , the Top 2 MWs are Walker Smith and Sam Langford , and I am uncertain about the following.
     
    frankenfrank, Jun 24, 2011
    frankenfrank, Jun 24, 2011
    #52
  8. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    No but we saw him routinely get outclassed by guys much smaller than him.
     
    lufcrazy, Jun 24, 2011
    lufcrazy, Jun 24, 2011
    #53
  9. frankenfrank

    frankenfrank Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I won't repeat what you quoted but that was the answer for your stupid claims about him once and for all.
     
    frankenfrank, Jun 24, 2011
    frankenfrank, Jun 24, 2011
    #54
  10. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    Well this is where your inconsistency betrays you as a troll.

    Valuev was never a good boxer, he was a freak. you try to carefully scrutinise the careers of louis and greb yet don't do the same to a man who never impressed apart from 1 fight against liakhovic who was massively undersized and coming off a brutal knockout.

    Valuev's best wins are controversial decisions and injury stoppages due to a dodgey knee.

    You cannot justify your ranking of valuev and that is the truth. You think a couple of punches after the bell by the brown bomber justify your ridiculous viewpoints but the truth is they don't.

    Valuev has never been considered a great heavyweight and you try to excuse this by saying he was always undertrained or unmotivated? Ridiculous.
     
    lufcrazy, Jun 24, 2011
    lufcrazy, Jun 24, 2011
    #55
  11. Armstrong!

    Armstrong! Active Member Full Member

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    Great post.
     
    Armstrong!, Jun 24, 2011
    Armstrong!, Jun 24, 2011
    #56
  12. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    :good
     
    lufcrazy, Jun 24, 2011
    lufcrazy, Jun 24, 2011
    #57
  13. frankenfrank

    frankenfrank Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    The dodgey knee was a result of Valuev's punching power.
    I usually forget the decision win over Liakhovich when I think about Valuev .
    Valuev's biggest wins are his stoppages over McCline and then Barrett.
    He has a few more notable names on his resume , usually listed as wins for him.
    While his resume is not one of the most impressing , my list is h2h as was previously stated and you stated it yourself.
    If Valuev fought Doug Jones / Chuvalo / Ken Norton and managed to make it go the distance then he still would not have look as crap as Ali was against them.
    And I really don't think he would need smelling salts or any kind of a cheat or foul even against a 1974 Foreman.
    Harry Greb is extremely overrated , even more than Joe Louis whom is very overrated himself.
     
    frankenfrank, Jun 27, 2011
    frankenfrank, Jun 27, 2011
    #58
  14. Armstrong!

    Armstrong! Active Member Full Member

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    Greb's resume is full of champions, hall of famers, and legends in general whereas Valuev's resume is full of no hopers and chubby heavyweights with no versatility.

    The heavyweight division today is weak. We have the two Klitschko brothers (whom I believe could stack up very well in any division) dominating these lesser fighters. They aren't very great or special, but they are what they are.

    We have the David Haye fight coming up shortly so we'll truly see what both men are made of. :bbb

    Your list is full of assumptions. You have George Foreman above Muhammad Ali simply because you think that Foreman would have won if the ropes weren't loosened.

    That can't be used as proper criteria seeing as if the ropes were tighter, the outcome would still probably be the same. Ali won most of the rounds anyway, was beating Foreman to the punch and hurting him in general with speedy, sneaky fast right hands.

    So even if the ropes weren't loosened, Foreman would've probably been knocked out anyways, or drop a decision.
     
    Armstrong!, Jun 27, 2011
    Armstrong!, Jun 27, 2011
    #59
  15. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    again with your bull**** inconsistency.

    you are a troll.
     
    lufcrazy, Jun 27, 2011
    lufcrazy, Jun 27, 2011
    #60
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