Haye's lack of technical skill and game plan were horrible

I get many of the TS`s points. But frankly it really tells me nothing I didn`t already know before the fight. Haye has always fought people at distance. He`s never been and inside fighter. If you thought Haye was going to come into this fight acting like Marciano or Holyfield then you're crazy. Its a one dimensional post that focuses on aspects of his game that have never been there. IF you want to talk about the things that Haye does do I think defensively he is very advanced. I mean it has been a very long time since I've seen a heavy weight that had the ability to stand in range of a world class jab and use head and upper body movement to make his opponent miss for pretty much all 12 rounds. That to me was very impressive. I mean we`re talking about a small heavyweight standing with his hands at his side, in range of the biggest puncher in boxing, slipping and ducking, trying to draw an opening for most of the fight. That is not something that you see world class boxers do, let a lone at heavyweight. You have to give David credit for that and you also have to admire his bravery.

The obvious place to critise was his offense or lack there of. THought his offensive disipline and tactics woudl have been better. Also his ability to do the jab one two's or the looping punches that he's been able to do against smaller or slower fighters wasn't evident. Against the higher level opponent.

 

Nice, reasonable post:good

 

I highly doubt that Haye just showed up to fight for nothing. Don`t forget he signed one of the worst contracts in contract history the first time he signed to fight these guys. After the fight he looked like he was in shock the 12 rounds had gone by without him landing a serious punch on Wlad. He looked like a man that believed it was his destiny to beat the klitchko`s and that he was having trouble trying to come to grips with the fact that it didn`t happen.

 

I thought Haye's side to side movement was brilliant it wasn't back peddling and running like he did against Valuev. He just didn't try to engage at all.

 

Through out most of his career, especially as a CW his athleticism simply carried him over. Indeed he is a phenomenal athlete-I give credit where it's due. But there is nothing to marvel or be impressed about when it comes to his boxing skills-if anything he is marginal at best. Not to say it's putrid but rather flawed. Yes the art of boxing is to hit and not get hit, but it's also about creating opportunities and openings. That's what elite fighters do. Whether it's due to his own inability or not learning (Adam Booth) he simply can't or doesn't create opportunities but rather sits on it. When he went up against a guy who is athletic in his own right and could box we saw the end results.

 

That is called fighting scared of your oppisition:deal

 

I thought Haye's gameplan was a good one. Move, move, leap in with power, and leap out. But to employ it successfully he would have had to expose his chin more often. He was unwilling to do that. As far as technical skill, Haye looked amateurish at times, missing punches and lunging wildly.

 

Superb reflexes shown by Haye in regards to his defence. Top draw. I haven't seen any other heavies do that to Wlad. You could see Wlad's growing frustration. He stood right in front of Wlad for much of the fight and didn't get tagged much at all.

He wasn't on his bike like the Valuev fight, he was far more stationary, he just couldn't get his shots off, or follow though in range after letting the first shot go.

 

I think the real difference is that Arreola is a fighter and Haye isn't. Different mind set. I would not rule Arreola out of this and it would be a pickum fight for me.

 

Nobody seems to be baring in mind that he couldn't push off his right foot to explode the right or follow up once in range.

 

Good post! Haye never really had to develope traditional boxing skills because his athleticism carried him through.

 

For all Haye's faults at least he didn't start crying.

 

Well said.

I really don't know why people are surprised at the gameplan he choose, I wasn't. The only thing that surprised me was there was a little less aggression than was required.

I watched in an interview a few minutes ago in which Haye made the point later that he rolled under the jab a few times leaving Wlad wide open but due to his foot couldn't throw the right off it so "had to just keep moving left", everyone in the room last night also saw this and were screaming in frustration at him to capitalise on it.

There may be some merit on his "excuse" becasue I can't think of any other reason why he didn't land a shot there, to me that was his one and only game plan coming into this fight.

I watched a post fight anaylsis from Dwyer at Gamblers Advisory that pretty much sums up exactly how I saw the fight, he is taking abuse for his views but to me they are spot on.

 

He doesn't care enough about the sport, just the money.

 

Haye's entire style is based around 'creating opportunities and openings' -- he's a counter-puncher. The problem he had in this fight was always very easy to see even beforehand -- how do you counter-punch someone with a significant height and reach advantage, who knows how to use it to maximum effect? It's a stylistic disadvantage that Haye never solved. He tried to move around on the outside and look to do his usual countering, but Wlad simply sat back and jabbed away. Haye did a great job with evading that jab (I was actually surprised he didn't get more credit for that from the HBO commentators, who seemed to be very disdainful of him) but whereas normally he uses that slip to counter, in this case he simply couldn't bridge the massive gap. Wlad is too careful, and leaning back like that while back-pedalling makes it particularly difficult for a small man to reach him. The only solution is more aggression, to follow up with combinations...but that's not Haye's style.

The lack of technical skill wasn't even a big issue...in fact, I think those wild, looping shots are more likely to trouble Wlad than straight ones. The problem is Haye didn't have the mental commitment to get the job done -- he was trying to lunge in, but he never really rushed in and kept the offence going. Whether this is due to the toe or mentality, I don't know...maybe a combination of the two. You have to take the fight to Wlad...don't wait around hoping he'll make a mistake, or that you can jump in and land a massive shot. Haye needed to push him back while using his slipping and ducking, throw more jabs, hit to the body and come up to the top, basically fluster him in every way possible. Only unleash the right hand when you're near the ropes...that would have turned the back-pedalling/leaning strategy into a disaster, as Haye could then catch up to him and land a big one.

On the whole, Wlad is just better, though. He has the massive height/reach, a solid jab, a powerful right and the mentality that makes him happy to sit back and simply jab warily all night long, knowing how difficult it will be to reach his chin. One thing that DID surprise me was Wlad's reflexes, though -- he was actually quicker to move back than I expected. I didn't realise he would make Haye miss so much, as Haye has good speed and good timing.