Perception

I agree regarding Munroe. He was the best challenger around at the time, even though there may have been a couple of others who also would have made decent challengers. I consider him a bit like a Michael Grant or Jerry Cooney type in that he was promising and considered the best challenger but he failed at the top level when tested. Actually, he is probably no worse credentialled than David Haye, who many people seemed to rate the third best heavyweight out there, even though i find it extremelly doubtfull that that he would beat many of the top 10 fighters out there.

 

While we are in the business of comparing Munro to Haye, he was a trash talker extroardinaire. This probably helped him to secure a title shot.

The fact that he did not have acess to photoshop probably held him back.

 

Childs lost to Denver Ed Martin and Joe Choynski in 1902. and he didnt fight in 1903. So i hardly think he was a realistic choice of opponent.

In 1902, Johnson drew twice with the man Jeffries knocked out on debut as a teenager, as well as billy sift. He was improving though and wouldnt have been a bad choice (in hindsight a great choice). It is a shame though that he blew his chance of being the man after Monroe to get a challenge, by losing to Hart.

Hart is an interesting one. Do you think his win over Jack Bonner who managed a draw with Finnegan gave him the rights to a title shot? In 1903, Hart was stopped by George Gardner, who had lost his title to Fitzsimmons (a Jeffries victim) and couldnt beat Choynski.

Ferguson is an interesting one. Some even say he had Johnson's measure in some of their fights. But i would have thought that as well as the Johnson losses, the 1903 Draw with Gus Ruhlin would have hardly put him in the class of Jeffries for people to get excited about such a fight.

It is interesting that you scoff at munroe's record comparing to Haye. I dont see how they are different Old Tom Sharkey was less active than the old Ruiz that Haye fought, but he was also a lot better at his best so it sort of balances out. Peter Maher was old also, i agree, but he is certainly a bigger name than anything on Valuev's list, and he wasnt as old as the old Holyfield who had (according to many people) just outboxed Valuev. The Journeyman Monte Barrett was probably not as good or highly rated as the Hank Griffin that drew with Monroe (even if Jeffries beat him on debut). And of course Al Limerick was no superstar but surely he couldnt be any worse than Audley Harrison.

Both were media creations and neither really earned a title opportunity, but i can see why both were chosen. I think they are a good comparison. Haye may yet turn out better, but i doubt he will ever show anywhere near the courage that Monroe showed later in life.

 

Reading a fair few of the fight reports of Munroe now. It seems to that while the Jeffries alleged decision was what put Munroe in the spot light, it seems that he did have to win an eliminator with Sharkey in order to get the title shot. Sharkey was obviously a name and while i agree he was old and out of form, if he had beat Munroe, it would have given Jeffries his biggest money making option.

Here is a fight report for anyone interested. It is interesting that Munroe won, despite going down in the first round. He was obviously a slow starter because he also went down in the first round against Maher.
http://chroniclingamerica.loc.gov/l...key&y=0&x=0&dateFilterType=yearRange&index=15




http://chroniclingamerica.loc.gov/l...rkey&y=0&x=0&dateFilterType=yearRange&index=3

 

http://chroniclingamerica.loc.gov/l...rick&y=0&x=0&dateFilterType=yearRange&index=3

there is a report from Munroe vs Limerick for anyone interested.

 

here is a much better report

http://chroniclingamerica.loc.gov/l...ck+&y=9&x=7&dateFilterType=yearRange&index=16

And another interesting tidbit, for what it is worth, Munroe was the betting underdog against both Al Limerick and Peter Maher.

http://chroniclingamerica.loc.gov/l...ight&y=0&x=0&dateFilterType=yearRange&index=3

This is quite interesting too. I wonder how Limerick went against Ruhlin. If he beat him, it certainly makes Monroe's claims that little bit stronger.

http://chroniclingamerica.loc.gov/l...ight&y=0&x=0&dateFilterType=yearRange&index=0

Here is some more on Limerick written by Robert Edgren. It has some interesting stories and comments in there. I dare say that the comments about the Flynn Johnson fight being taken to be a fix for Flynn and Flynn having johnson nearly out at the time of the DQ has the potential to cause another Mendoza Mcvey meltdown.

http://chroniclingamerica.loc.gov/l...ick+&y=9&x=7&dateFilterType=yearRange&index=3

 

So we have an unbeaten champion consistently beating his top contenders who attempts to regain his championship after 6 years absence? Definitely a great.