Risen (the Howard Winstone biopic)

Rankings are in the eye of the beholder, I suppose. Not my thing, so I couldn't really say whether top 50 is fair or not. Anyway....

Laguna, Winstone x3, Ramos, Legra, Famechon, Robertson, Seki, Rojas, Luis, Guerrero, Ramirez, Hawkins, Crawford, Sanchez. That's an amazing list of victims in just 40 fights. The era was very deep in terms of quality and Saldivar absolutely ruled it; I can't think of too many champions who were that dominant against that level of opposition.

Apart from an Armstrong/Harada level swarmer, who only come along once in a blue moon anyway, he overcame just about every style: speedsters/slicksters (Laguna, Legra, Luis); pure boxers/technicians (Winstone, Famechon); the physical monster/smooth, well-rounded KO artist (Ramos); the tough pressure fighter (Rojas); the southpaw technician/boxer-puncher (Seki); the varied, tough, top-level contenders (Robertson, Sanchez, Hawkins, Crawford etc). Laguna, Legra, Winstone, Famechon and Ramos were all great champions; Robertson and Seki were seen by some as uncrowned champions in their own right (against Kingpetch and Ramos); Rojas went on to win the super-featherweight title afterwards. Saldivar was past his own best too against the mini-Ali and Fammo, coming off a two year layoff. He gave Shibata a real go too when he was clearly past it.

It's all backed up when I watch him on film too. He was versatile for such a diminutive, pressuring type. Good jab, tight defence, very accurate puncher, hard puncher, physically strong, debilitating body puncher, could lead or counter and mix his attack with his defence. A 15 round circumnavigator on par with Arguello, Sanchez, Griffith, Monzon; his championship rounds full-steam-ahead charge is something else, Winstone would have testified to that more than anyone. And one of the greatest straight lefts in the history of the sport. Not a perfect fighter of course; he could be hurt on the odd occasion by the bigger punchers, especially early in the fight before he got fully going, and his physicality and style were never going to grace him with great longevity as Shibata demonstrated. That said, watch Ramos -who had the appropriate style - trying to get to him early. He handles everything Ramos throws at him, takes charge unusually early with alarming authority and just outright manhandles him and beats him up. Ramos was a huge featherweight too, immensely strong with good speed and excellent power. It's one of the best performances I've ever seen by anyone, and against the sort of fighter you might typically expect him to struggle against too. I'd actually give Saldivar a very good chance of beating Pep.

What surprises me is how often I see the modern trinity being ranked above him or favoured to beat him, but that's another story for another day. They have longevity over him but little if anything else imo, great though they were/are. I think Marquez of the three would have stood the best chance against him, but I'd make Saldivar the favourite without too much hesitation. Lora/Mante has made a good point before about how most people automatically - and wrongly - assume that they should easily stand over many of the past Mexican champions/contenders from the late 50's to the 70's in terms of ability: Chucho Castillo, Herrera, Medel, Macias, Becerra etc. I believe he said that them being amongst the first generation of fighters to come under the scrutiny of the internet generation has bolstered their profiles.

This will probably end up sounding like an attack on Barrera, Morales and Marquez, which it isn't meant to be. I've grown watching and admiring all three of them; they probaly were/are the bigtime fighters of my generation along with Pacquiao, but they get a tad overrated at times in comparison to many of the top Mexicans who have gone before them.

But Saldivar is one of the major justifications in my mind of having gotten into boxing history a bit more. One of the greatest of all the lower weight champions.

 

You seen Risen yet Greg? I know you'd mentioned that your trainer recommended to you or something....

 

You're welcome mate, although Greg basically summed up in one sentence what took me serious time, effort and pretentiousness. Tommy-topping little ****.....and I can't do **** all at a pace. :|

Have you seen all the newer stuff of Jofre that keeps cropping up? There's some footage of his post-Harada stuff at feather including some of the Legra fight, but no Saldivar unfortunately. Saldivar-Jofre was apparently a done deal back in 65, but Harada put paid to it. That would've been some fight....