"Ollie McCall 1995 vs. Ernesto Shavers 1976" in a 10 rounder... Who dah boss?

McCall by KO, inside of 9 rounds. Power ain't **** if you can't hurt the man your fighting.

 

But what's all this crap I hear about Earnie never beating anyone? Jimmy Young? Jimmy Ellis? Ken Norton? Joe Bugner?

Muhammad Ali? He beat Ali, you know.

 

Mcall is bad though Shavers had a bad chin, but I think he still has the skills to hang with Oliver who besides catching Lewis and a green Maskaev, was never much of a big puncher.

 

Jimmy Young - A 7-3 novice when he fought a peak Shavers. Years later, fought him to a draw.

Jimmy Ellis - way past his prime, and in the last couple fights of his career.

Ken Norton - Past prime and with a shaky chin

Joe Bugner - returning from a long layoff

Muhammad Ali - Close fight, but Shavers didn't win it.

 

Oh I see...so those wins don't count. Thanks for clearing that up. Poor Earnie probably took those fights thinking the victories would count, but I guess not. So even though the prime Larry Holmes couldn't knock Ken Norton out in one round...LESS THAN A YEAR before, Earnie's destruction of Norton was meaningless. And even though Earnie was the only guy amongst people such as Foreman, Ali, Norton, and Lyle, to ever put Young on the canvas, that too doesn't count because in other fights Earnie looked bad. And Ellis, despite being a durable guy who'd fought the best in the world over the previous ten years, never getting taken out in one round by Ali, Quarry, Patterson, Lyle, etc, was a totally differnt guy when Earnie got a hold of him. Okay, I get it now. Thanks.

 

That's not what I meant.

Yes he had good names on his record, but whenever we just arbitrarily list opponents we also have to consider the TIMING of these fights. Otherwise, Brian Neilson would be considered an all time great.

 

My money would be on McCall.

Power is the most over rated atribute in a fighter.

A punchers chance against a fighter with a decent (not granite) chin is like a snowballs chance in hell.

 

I don't believe there's ever been an irresistible force in boxing, hence there have been immovable objects. Unless Earnie pulls off the sort of surprise jabbing attack he used to win his ten round decision over Henry Clark in Paris, McCall surely takes this one. Oliver's one successful title defense was a close decision over a very cagey and experienced elder Holmes, a vastly superior opponent to anybody Shavers ever decisioned, controversially or otherwise. Whether by decision or stoppage, I have to go with the Bull over the Acorn.

 

McCall blew it against Bruno and Shavers was decent at picking up the points on the judges' scorecards, it was his stamina that often let him down. I believe Shavers could discourage McCall with his power and put him to a shell which he gets out of too late in the fight to pull off a comeback win. McCall would have to rely on a late round KO in order to win. You have to remember that a prime conditioned Shavers did go 15 rounds against Ali, so him gassing out and knocking himself out is not necessarily the only outcome. A Frank Bruno situation could take place.

I wouldn't say Oliver McCall was a huge puncher, however his countering capabilities with the right hand are sometimes overlooked. Steward made him practise that punch a thousand times and it paid off for him as he unloaded the punch automatically when given an opportunity. He obviously had an incredible chin, but he did not necessarily put himself in harm's way and hardly enjoyed being hit.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D90yV3E-ajE[/ame]

4:50

A punch like this is enough to put any man on the backfoot, granite chin or not. That was Shavers' favorite punch of course, along with that savage right hand to the body (which made McCall quit in a sparring session against Tyson by the way).

 

I agree. Mcall was the type of guy if you hit him hard enough he would leave you alone and do enough to lose. Hard to believe he couldnt get rid of Bruno in the last rounds. Bruno was an upright dead man.

 

And regardless of my previous post, this is certainly feasible. Earnie was a very intelligent slugger for his style of fighting, more consistent between the ears, and McCall was certainly susceptible to a psych. I do wonder how Bruno-McCall might have unfolded if it was anywhere resembling neutral turf. After Hagler-Minter, the idea of any defending champion coming from America to risk his title against a hometown challenger in London seems bat**** insane, no matter the compensation. To make money off the title, you have to at least be able to have a chance at keeping it. I wonder how much Bruno's Wembley crowd intimidated Oliver.

Yeah, Earnie has the smarts in this one. His way of dealing with Tiger Williams was sensible enough. Piled up an early insurmountable lead by repeatedly hammering the right to the body. Unlike Foreman, he could go into a match not counting on a knockout to win, and that paid off in critical situations like Rondon (his first major win), Young II (where he controversially avoided defeat on the strength of scoring the final knockdown Jimmy would sustain in his career), Clark I (ending Henry's final career undefeated streak), Tiger Williams (where Earnie had the scoring clinched at the end), and Ali (where many believed the surprisingly restrained Shavers did enough to earn the title).

 

Agreed with all except the should have been champ thing. Ali won.