Who's really the master, ariza or roach ???

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by freddy-wak, Aug 30, 2011.


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  1. freddy-wak

    freddy-wak M O D E R A T O R Full Member

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    i got to thinking this the other day...

    roach gets held really high up there when it comes down to the best trainers around...mainly, cause of manny pacquaio and their success together...

    i dont think i can name you one fighter that roach has brought up from amateur, to world champion...and though that might not mean much nowadays, it does really solidify a trainers legacy and adds and extra bump to the bragging rights...nacho berinstein to me is hands down the greatest trainer around, followed by many more that have had their share of champs from boys to men....

    roach on the other hand, has been fed superstars, and has done really next to nothing as far as skills go...take for example, james toney, built by mr owens then years later became roachs fighter, but his style never really changed...a bit more defensive, but in many cases that comes with moving up in weight, and age....

    forward to manny now...if you know manny, you know damn well the things that made him dangerous, he's always had...speed, power and able to throw punches from every angle.....aside from the "manila ice" :lol: can you really tell me how roach has made manny a ****en monster ??? he's more patient now, but again, that comes with experience and age, not something a trainer can teach....

    khan - another gifted kid that really aint been taught ****, his attributes like manny are speed, and power...instead of angles though, this kid has size....as far as skills go, roach aint done **** for the kid...

    chavez jr - another superstar that has a huge following based on his name, and his new blood and guts style that he's starting to love and adopt...kid has some pop, size and seems to have a granite chin...since with roach, i aint noticed a **** of difference in his skill dept.....

    now here comes the bomb....though i aint noticed **** in the skills dept, i have noticed a huge difference in their conditioning, and that to me is thanks to the real master behind wildcard, ALEX ARIZA

    anyone care to prove me wrong..
     
    freddy-wak, Aug 30, 2011
    freddy-wak, Aug 30, 2011
    #1
  2. MrMagic

    MrMagic Loyal Member Full Member

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    That's outright stupid, Roach had major success as a trainer before Ariza even entered that gym.

    Khan ain't been taught ****? C'mon.... :lol:
     
    MrMagic, Aug 30, 2011
    MrMagic, Aug 30, 2011
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  3. freddy-wak

    freddy-wak M O D E R A T O R Full Member

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    most guys that dont/didnt have superstar qualities, have left him......does that tell you something

    and sure he had success, enough to live an ok life as a trainer...but he wasn't a superstar trainer how he is now
     
    freddy-wak, Aug 30, 2011
    freddy-wak, Aug 30, 2011
    #3
  4. Uncle Rico

    Uncle Rico Loyal Member Full Member

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    You should really watch Khan and how he fought pre-Prescott. The difference between then and now is very noticeable. If Freddie didn't teach him, then I don't know who did.
     
    Uncle Rico, Aug 30, 2011
    Uncle Rico, Aug 30, 2011
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  5. Auracle21

    Auracle21 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Roach easily. Ariza's contributions are marginal at best.
     
    Auracle21, Aug 30, 2011
    Auracle21, Aug 30, 2011
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  6. freddy-wak

    freddy-wak M O D E R A T O R Full Member

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    weight seems to be the only difference, really....

    and the fact that he tries to mimic pac sometimes
     
    freddy-wak, Aug 30, 2011
    freddy-wak, Aug 30, 2011
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  7. Uncle Rico

    Uncle Rico Loyal Member Full Member

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    You need to watch more of Khan. That's the only thing I can suggest.
     
    Uncle Rico, Aug 30, 2011
    Uncle Rico, Aug 30, 2011
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  8. freddy-wak

    freddy-wak M O D E R A T O R Full Member

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    i've seen all of khans fights...even in the amateurs

    the dude didnt even adjust in the maidana fight...that's where roach would've shined in the corner, and he didnt...

    maidanas styles is one of the easiest to adapt to, and roach couldn't even coach him to that
     
    freddy-wak, Aug 30, 2011
    freddy-wak, Aug 30, 2011
    #8
  9. john garfield

    john garfield Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Your points are well-taken, fw, but can tell you first hand -- in no uncertain terms -- FREDDIE RUNS THE SHOW! Parkinsons or not, he cracks the whip.
     
    john garfield, Aug 30, 2011
    john garfield, Aug 30, 2011
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  10. freddy-wak

    freddy-wak M O D E R A T O R Full Member

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    no doubt about that...
     
    freddy-wak, Aug 30, 2011
    freddy-wak, Aug 30, 2011
    #10
  11. Boxing Fanatic

    Boxing Fanatic Loyal Member banned

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    fug me, toney was on the shite and guess who was training him, freddie roach
     
    Boxing Fanatic, Aug 30, 2011
    Boxing Fanatic, Aug 30, 2011
    #11
  12. iceman71

    iceman71 WBC SILVER Champion Full Member

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    ive said that for years....roach is a fine tuner and very good trainer when it comes to guys with mad skills or have already been world champions...maybe the days are over of having homegrown talent and spotting that kid in the gym whos 12 and turning him into a world champ
    obviously manny steward, lou duva and his team are among the best...
    how good was angelo dundee? ali and leonard made him look as good as them...youre ultimatley as good as your fighters talent
     
    iceman71, Aug 30, 2011
    iceman71, Aug 30, 2011
    #12
  13. papolamuerte

    papolamuerte Yo soy La Muerte! Full Member

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    Roach hands down, he trains the Mexican Assasin....:)
     
    papolamuerte, Aug 30, 2011
    papolamuerte, Aug 30, 2011
    #13
  14. freddy-wak

    freddy-wak M O D E R A T O R Full Member

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    thanks for understanding :good

    ****, manny even made some improvements with an already damaged cotto....that's great if you ask me
     
    freddy-wak, Aug 30, 2011
    freddy-wak, Aug 30, 2011
    #14
  15. Leon

    Leon The Artful Dodger Full Member

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    roach has admitted before that emmanuel would be a good fighter with or without him.

    What fighters like about roach are his gameplans. Oscar liked roach's gameplans the most out of all the trainers he had, he said this in his book.
     
    Leon, Aug 30, 2011
    Leon, Aug 30, 2011
    #15
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