Angelo Dundee -"Vitali is special" but says Ali would beat him.

speed kills. Vitali is slow compared to ali.

 

pay attention to Ali not Williams

 

it never gets old. Once again, pay attention to Ali. Vitali cannot hit this guy, he cannot deal with this speed, he cannot deal with this talent, he has never seen anything remotely like it.

Roll the tape.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oJUzl0aFHZw[/ame]

 

If an old Lewis beat him one has to assume a younger Lewis would have so that takes us back to the early 90s, a time where most folk thought a speedy 5ft 10 Tyson could take Lewis out.

 

Agree with Dundee, even though i think Vitali is a stylistic h2h nightmare for almost anyone (and hes criminally underrated by some of the nostalia people here)
Ali had the perfect style to beat him.

And people saying Lewis beat him so he showed how to are full of it, you cant teach someone to open a lucky cut while getting your ass kicked.

 

Wrong... Simply wrong. Vitali has and will never beat an opponent the caliber of Ali. Ali was fast, had the footwork to easily negate Vitali's game, had the hand speed, ring IQ, heart, chin, and movement to definitely beat Vitali. it doesn't take a genius to think that. Just because Ali was smaller then Lewis he also had way more dimensions to his game and had a better chin as well as heart.

Ali would decision Vitali

 

I think Angie's having a pop at the Klit fans, he means ******-special.

 

Love and respect Ali and Dundee, but the trainer is wrong here.

Vitali Klitschko is the most dominant heavyweight -- maybe the most dominant boxer -- I have seen in the past 25 years.

The last person who dominated in the manner of Klitschko was a young Tyson. Who, incidentally, could have given Vitali one hell of a fight and possibly beaten him. He had the tools to do so, despite his size.

There are two versions of Ali: Pre-suspension and Post-suspension. The Pre-suspension version was superior. He was younger, faster and had better reflexes. This is the version who faced Cleveland Williams in the video posted above.

The Post-suspension version of Ali was heavier, a little bit slower and had slightly less-strong reflexes. He was still damn good, though, good enough to beat George Foreman at his most fearsome.

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. His reach (80") and height (6' 3") are pretty good, but he simply doesn't have enough mass (215 lbs) to deal with someone who is a power-of-magnification larger than him like Vitali. Particularly given Vitali's set of skills and natural ability.

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(AKA Cassius Clay)

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. This is the crux of the problem, in my opinion. Tyson had enough power, Ali did not and that means Vitali would have rushed and stalked and cut the ring off against Ali. And even if he didn't land solidly on Ali consistently, he would maul him and drape his weight all over Ali round after round. That's where the lesser body mass and height would really hurt Ali. And after about 6 rounds of this, the bounce from Ali's legs would start to fade for good in the fight.

As Tyson used to say, everyone has a plan until they get hit. Or, in this case, everyone has a plan -- Haye, Adamek, Hide, etc -- until they actually get between the ropes against the Klitschkos. There is no one in the world to mimic them, that has the same amount of size, athleticism and skill. That's why you see people so confident against them before the fight and then they go in and get mugged in the squared circle. It's shocking, when you have to try to actually deal with what they bring to the table.

There is no one Vitali has ever fought as a professional boxer who truly challenged him. That includes his two losses to Byrd and Lewis, fights he was winning when he was injured/stopped on cuts. I have discussed the Lewis fight with a former professional fighter who gave Lewis a very tough fight (when they were both professional fighters) who agreed with my assessment that Vitali "mauled" Lewis in the Vitali-Lewis fight. Vitali brutalized Lewis in that fight, in a manner no one -- particularly Lewis -- thought Vitali could. You tip your cap to Lewis for getting the win, but that (winning on cuts) is not a formula for beating Vitali. He has never been cut in that manner before or since the Lewis fight. Which could be why Lewis never decided to rematch Vitali.

Now, could Ali defeat Vitali on cuts? Yeah, sure he could. Lewis did, so why couldn't Ali? Again, though, for a man who has suffered serious cuts just one time in 45 professional boxing matches, that's not a viable strategy to rely on.

People want to talk about Ali vs Cleveland Williams. Great performance, certainly. However, as was mentioned previously, Williams was totally shot -- both figuratively and literally -- by the time he faced Ali. Williams was also a known drinker, which didn't help matters:

SOURCE: http://ind.pn/n1KRBD

In other words, Williams was a harmless opponent with a good name and record when Ali fought him. He had nothing left, didn't have the best chin but would look good on Ali's resume.

Ali looked great in the fight -- because Williams allowed him to. There is no comparison between a shot Cleveland Williams (6' 3", 80", 210 lbs) and a Prime version of Vitali Klitschko (6' 7.5", 80", 245 lbs). Besides having the same reach, there are no similarities to speak of.

Now, I mentioned above that Ali is neither big enough nor possesses enough power to defeat Vitali Klitschko. Those are two serious problems Ali would face in taking on Vitali. But

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If you look at the first two rounds of the Cleveland Williams fight, here is Ali's punch output:

R1 -- 50 punches
R2 -- 62 punches

That is very good, particularly for a heavyweight. This is a 24-year-old, young, fresh Ali. And he's facing a shot fighter who is simply following him around the ring and offering little resistance.

Now, let's look at another example of Ali's punch output. Though this is an older (32 years old) version of Ali, a Post-suspension version, looking at Ali's punch output against George Foreman is a good barometer of what Ali might look like against another bigger fighter who is stalking him and throwing big punches:

R1 -- 35 punches
R2 -- 30
R3 -- 35
R4 -- 31
R5 -- 33
R6 -- 36
R7 -- 23
R8 -- 29 (fight stopped with 10 seconds left in the round)

So, let's say we could combine these two sets of data and come up with an approximation of what Ali's punch output would be against Vitali Klitschko. Take a younger, fresher Ali and put him against a much larger man who would be pressuring him.

Let's say Ali averages between 45-50 punches per round, being a bit generous perhaps.

That's very good, especially for a heavyweight.

Except there's one problem.

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.

At 31 years old, he averaged 70+ punches per round against Lewis. Despite the cuts.

At 37 years old, he averaged more than 70 punches per round against Sam Peter.

At 38 years old, he averaged more than 80 punches per round against Arreola.

At 40 years old -- far beyond his prime -- he still averaged 60 punches per round against Adamek.

I think you get the idea.

Vitali Klitschko is an anomaly. He's a Next Generation-level athlete. The reason why he has never trailed on the scorecards at the end of any of his 45 professional fights is not an accident.

He doesn't have to fight like The Terminator. He can fight off the back foot. He can move when he needs to (see Arreola fight). He can brawl. He is extremely accurate (as was Ali). He is a deadly counterpuncher. He can throw arm punches in bunches, or he can sit down on his punches and hurt you (as he did with Lewis).

Simply put, Vitali can fight any style he chooses and be successful.

Ali is one of the greatest fighters who ever lived. However, he was dropped by fighters who weighed 185 lbs (Cooper), 191 lbs (Banks) and 205 pounds (Frazier). Cooper and Banks were against Pre-suspension Ali as well.

If you don't think a 245 pound giant who seriously hurt Lennox Lewis could put Ali down, well...I would say you know little about boxing or physics. Vitali Klitschko has the highest KO % in heavyweight history (88.9%). Again, not an accident.

I'm not saying Klitschko knocks Ali out. He probably doesn't. But because of his workrate and the fact that he would be the aggressor, I see him winning the fight along the lines of 7-5 rounds or 8-4 rounds. I'm not saying Ali couldn't ever beat him. He could. But

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.

I understand why Dundee said what he said here. He's tied to Ali. As in, if Ali's legacy is diminished, Dundee's legacy is also diminished. He had to say what he said.

Vitali Klitschko will never be recognized for what he is amongst most fans and even boxing experts. The Adamek fight helped reveal the truth, and a Haye fight would help as well. But most people won't ever "get it" because they either choose not to get it or they don't understand the sport well enough to know what they're seeing.

Nevertheless, the truth is that

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. As good as Ali is, his size, relative lack of power and comparatively lower workrate would make a fight against Vitali Klitschko very hard for Ali to win.

 

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WxW_1r_SZGA"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WxW_1r_SZGA[/ame]


This little bloke was floating about like a butterfly and showing great speed and movement, then bang, KO'd out in one round.

 

are you referring to the blubbery blob that hurt his knee?

Manning, from your avatar you look like the kindly, avuncular sort. And I say this with all due respect, but I wonder whether the best course of action right now for your own health and well-being would be to schedule an appointment ASAP to have your head thoroughly examined. A comprehensive head check-up is what you need. Something is not right with your eyes and your judgment.

 

:rofl:rofl:rofl

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H5cS0bZiJ1Q[/ame]

 

Great stats and substantial evidence for your claim, but your forgetting that speed kills. We saw what happens when a former middle weight fights a heavyweight (roy vs ruiz). We saw a lightweight vs a welter. Now im not comaparing the vitiali to the opposition, but what did the lighter guys have was trmendous speed. Vitali is too slow to hit prime ali. You cant hit who's already three steps ahead of you. Pac has proven this already. Pac has alreadfy proven that with even long reach and jab you can still get counter because pac can see it and already 2 steps ahead of his opponent. The same was roy with ruiz, they all couldnt beat someone with skills and superior speed. Vitalis jab is slow with speed footwork and head movement the reach can be overcomed and countered. Now if ali plays around with vitali like he did henry cooper, he's not getting up, but i doubt he would play around when he's looking at a 6'7 monster.

 

Margarito averages over 100 punches a round, therefore he beats Klitschko and Pacquiao in one night.

Your analysis is thoroughly moronic.

 

Well he has to say that out of respect to the great man. I would favor Ali to beat Vitali, hard to pick against him after all he proved beating all those ATGs and HoFs, all throughout his career.

 

LMAO @ Vitali being the most dominant heavyweight of the last 25 years.He isn't even the most dominant heavyweight in his own family.