Controversial statements on boxing that you stand by...

Prime Holyfield beats prime Bowe, prime Tyson & would be very competitive with prime Lewis

& p4p should rank higher than all of them

 

There's a theory about the colour of gloves. I think it's in the encyclopedia Britannica now:

http://www.eastsideboxing.com/forum/showthread.php?t=26587

 

There is no prime Evander. Unless you pick and choose different parts of his makeup throughout his career, he shifted his style and physique as he went on, and that makes him inherently different.

In terms of 'P4P' I just count Cruiserweight towards HW resume, it means nothing to me.

I used to have Evander between 33-40. With my recent acceptance of the above fact, I'm not sure how I can have Evander above Lennox, although I know have to fathom where to put him :huh

1. Ali (between 7-10)
2. Louis (between 11-14)
3. Lennox (not currently in my top 45, between 50-60)
4. Foreman (not near my top 60)
5. Larry (not in my top 75)
6. Evander????
7. Tyson (between 90-100)

Although as of late, I'm starting to think that maybe Evander and Mike should be over Larry :think

 

I should qualify my statement, by "prime" Holy I would chose the 89-91 version. Strong, fast, durable & incredibly well conditioned.

His record is incredible, as are some of his performances & achivements. I'm probably biased after watching loads of his fights recently but he's top 50 for me & above Lewis.

Mike over Larry is interesting but I'd have Holmes higher

 

Nah, I see what you mean entirely.

Maybe it's controversial me having Lennox so high? :think

 

atsch Langford also knocks that arse out :yep but he was a special fighter (my p4p number 4, but a case can be made for a number 1 spot). I read that after their fight, they held a three round exhibition in which Langford, after clinching early on whispered to Johnson 'this ain't no exhibition, I'm hear to fight', and pretty much roughed old jack up.

The thing with Johnson, he was so god dam lazy (probably just to **** off the white folks). He would rather jab, grab and toil with his opponents when they were seriously hurt rather than having that killer instinct that say, a Tyson, had. But maybe that's because his opposition was so weak. I mean, imagine him against the likes Tyson or Louis. He would be under constant pressure and would HAVE to react, something which I think he was capable of. I mean, did he even get out of 2nd gear? He is certainly an interesting one. I'm by no means an expert on him (I'll need to finish the book and learn a shite more about his opposition), but he was a 'character' to say the least.

No way!!! Lewis beats him 9 times out of 10 for me, and should rightly be rated higher than him. He probably does beat 'Bottler' Bowe, but I think even a prime Tyson gets him going enough. I mean he wasn't doing half bad in the 3rd round of their second fight, he seemed to have hurt Evander a little. But decided to bite rather than hook :-(

 

I did a project on Johnson-Jeffries for my leaving cert History.

Got 100%, suck on it.

 

Wait, you studied someone above 5ft 3 :huh

You'll have to send it over if u still have it.

 

Hurting Holy & finishing him off are 2 very different things:bbb

89-91 Holy wouldnt be an easy night for Lewis, I also think he has the better record of the 2

 

I don't think anyone has an 'easy night' against that Holyfield.

 

I agree with the first part,

But the second comment

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Lennox has a better resume hands down for me

 

I ain't read that (my memory is poor though), got a link? :good
On Johnson, I've just never really been that impressed with his offensive arsenal, but his opposition is not poor at all IMO.

-Burns
-O'Brien
-Jeanette
-Jeffries
-McVea
-Kaufman
-Fitz
-Langford

Although some of those guys would peak later or were past their best, that is just a quick scan of my brain and a fairly solid list. It can be ripped apart pretty easily though, and I certainly don't have him in my top ten, but I wouldn't say his opposition was really 'poor', and I think he faced some good fighters in defeat/draw as well :good

For instance, no shame in being stopped by Choynski pre-prime, it's between Maher and Choynski for the hardest pure hitter of that era, and all the best said Choynski was the hardest hitter they ever faced.

 

Ain't got a link m8 but will search tomorrow (not easy on iPhone). But it's in the first 50 pages of his book. It was held on a stage, with no ring at all and people down below. Both ended up rolling in the crowd and almost tearing down the building they was in!

Your right, he has 'names' on his resume, but it's easily picked apart (like you say). Jefferies was Massively inactive, Phili Jack was past it, as was Fitz. He beat Langford but never gave him a rematch even tho many considered him the best HW around.

Like I said, I'm not massively clued up on it, but I'm learning

 

Holy had more title fights, beat more champions & won more titles:deal

(But thats not controversial)

 

I seem to be learning a fair bit lately, I'm nearly as dedicated as in my 'prime'.

BTW, controversial statement for sure: Paup Snith would stop Darren Baker inside a few rounds :deal