Controversial statements on boxing that you stand by...

That was ages ago and I've completely changed my views on him since then ACTUALLY :fire That's like me saying 'you love Donaire so I find it really difficult to take you seriously on him'. You should take me seriously on everyone, I'm not here to take the ****. To be perfectly honest I just wasn't aware of the likes of Marquez and Mthelne actually being any good because my interest in the current game slipped so I wasn't well versed on them. I still don't rate Sydorenko all that much though. I can't deny how fantastic a fighter Donaire is, a joy to watch and a fantastic puncher. I've just seen a lot of fantastic fighters as good as him so I'm not massively impressed.

I also don't rate the depth of the modern game, so the few years he did little due to contract problems and promotional issues or whatnot, I shunned him.

Zarate is a totally different kettle of fish. Donaire is a big Bantam, and at his best as he is now, I couldn't see him making the weight on the day as Zarate did.

Concepcion roughed him up a bit. Nothing wrong with Nonito and the opponent was poor, but he did come in overweight so that's why I think Nonito looked off form.

Zarate is only a Bantam though. If we're being fair, we should put Donaire in with bigger blokes from the older days that probably could make Bantam with a day to spare as well.

Why I would ever go on personal bias when analysing a fight anyway I don't know, FFS you and your old man accused me of the same thing when Haye was going to fight Wlad atsch

Sorry, but that would be a waste of my time. I just don't agree that Donaire is that unbeatable beast that everyone else seems to think he is I'm afraid, I'll wait it out a bit longer :good

 

Christ Donaire vs Zarate? and theres me thinking Donaire would struggle with Tapia

 

Also, I just don't agree that Donaire is on the same level of ability as Wilfredo Gomez. Gomez against Davila was better than anything Donaire has done against a better opponent.

Both have looked punch perfect, I'll go for the more proven man. Question is, can Donaire do a similar job?

I guess he probably could, so I do see where you're coming from. But the jury is still out for me, as brilliant as he looks he hasn't had a consistent run of genuinely tough fights, and I don't think that can happen whilst he's taking on Omar Narvaez and, apprently, Arce :-(

He's wasting time again IMO.

 

Haven't you heard? Donaire knocks out everyone between Fly and Super Bantam, ever!

 

Watching Cleverly-Murat right now & am more convinced than ever that Bellew will win inside the distance

 

I reckon Campillo would batter Clev and win comprehensively.

 

Fair enough, but it was a ridiculous notion even then.

Donaire made the Bantamweight limit for his destruction of Montiel.

The amount of footage I've seen of Carlos Zarate has reached double figures. Quite a few fighters, obscure talents, found their mark on the Mexican. He was no stranger to getting hit himself.

Like I said, Donaire operated at Bantamweight in his last outting, arguably the best shift he has put in so far during his career. I think the Donaire we've seen at 118lbs would best Carlos Zarate. It's not about being fair.

It's the only conclusion I could come to when you told me you would favour Darchinyan in a rematch. You said you've changed your stance now, so fair enough.

Although I also don't think Nonito Donaire is an "unbeatable beast", I do think he has speed to burn, and that coupled with his punching ability and athleticism would make it hard for any Super Flyweight or Bantamweight in history, not just Carlos Zarate, to beat him. The amount of footage I've seen of Carlos Zarate has reached double figures. He was a straight-up, one-paced banger. I don't see him handling a dynamic fighter like Donaire with that much success.

 

He probably would struggle with Johnny Tapia. The two fights are completely different. In tapia you have an exceptionally fast workhorse, who will throw a lot of punches in clusters, and wouldn't blink an eyelid as he is tagged. In Zarate you have, as I said to Fleaman, a straight-up, one-paced banger who was no stranger to being hit, and was methodical in his work.

I draw little to no comparison at all between the two. Styles make fights.

 

But a much bigger banger than anyone Donaire has faced. Zarate could be tagged, but apart from Rodolfo Martinez (who was class as you know) I can't remember him being hurt pre-Gomez? Am I wrong?

But good post, as I said before, see what you mean entirely.

I maintain that Khaokor would be a horrible fight for him.

 

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Do I know Rodolfo Martinez was class? He certainly didn't look class in the fight, and neither did Carlos Zarate.

Fair point about Zarate being the biggest banger Donaire would have faced, but I don't see him landing with enough regularity for it to be too much of a factor. You could look at Zarate's record and mistake him as being a lights out puncher, but I saw quite a few fighters stand up to his shots early on in fights. Very rarely was he responsible for knocking a quality fighter out cold. Leaving them face down on the matt, motionless.

I guess it's no secret now that I don't rate Zarate all that highly. I also think a fighter like Orlando Canizales, who brings a lot of angles, would also best Zarate at Bantamweight. Straight up and down.

 

He was a damaging puncher though, and could effectively get his shots off (methodical as you say) and could bludgeon you down. I suppose Donaire does have the ability to move in, pop, move out, and stop Zarate from getting much going. I have to admit, it is a favourable matchup for Donaire.

We had a 'Canizales Vs Donaire' at some point, what do you reckon there? I rate Canizales very high on ability he was hard as **** as well.

 

And yes Rodolfo was class, although I agree it was a scrappy matchup, before Zarate punched him into submission. Martinez mixed in a great era for the weight, and holds a comprehensive win over Venice Borkhorsor.

Borkhorsor, I'd pick him over Zarate for sure. A matchup with Donaire? Now that's interesting.

And yes, I did concede above. Well done.

 

Definitely. Orlando moved up to Super Bantamweight and took Junior Jones shots and pretty much laughed at him. The guy had a beard of granite. He was knocked down only once during his career, and stopped the guy mere minutes later. I don't see the fight ending inside schedule.

When I asked Jesse Reid Jr about the fight here merely said, "Orlando. Zarate was a hard puncher, but he was straight and up down". You can't take much from this considering that the man's dad trained Orlando, but I thought he was on point. Zarate was straight up and down. He moved in straight lines. A classical stand-up boxer puncher. In Orlando you have a guy moving from side to side, throwing shots from a multitude of angles. I think if the best Orlando turns up then he would bamboozle Zarate with his foot work, but that's a big if. Orlando put in quite a few bad performances during his so-called peak. You also have to consider that Orlando fought in an incredibly weak era. He wasn't beating world calibre fighters most nights.

How about you?

 

You clearly know more about Martinez and that Bantamweight era than I do, but I don't think Martinez or Zarate covered themselves in glory with that fight. Very scrappy.

Borkhorsor? I'll have to look this guy up. I've seen no footage of him.